A rant about America
This is a discussion on A rant about America within the Bob & Terry's Place forums, part of the The Back Porch category; It does however make me sick to see our generation referred to as a failed generation.
Buckeye, it makes me sick, too. I have the ...
April 8th, 2009 04:00 PM
1943 - 2009
Buckeye, it makes me sick, too. I have the utmost respect and admiration for the young men and women serving in the Armed forces today.
It does however make me sick to see our generation referred to as a failed generation.
Viet Nam was my war. I'm well into the second half of my sixth decade on this earth. If I was able, I would be proud to serve with your so-called "failed generation" (a sentiment I don't agree with, by any means) but I have to admit, even on my best day, I would be hard pressed to hump half the gear I see you guys packing!
God bless the Armed Forces of the United States of America and all who serve.
When you’re wounded and left on Afghanistan’s plains,
And the women come out to cut up what remains,
Just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains,
And go to your God like a soldier.
April 8th, 2009 04:27 PM
I don't think of it as a failed generation, I think of it as a generation with failed leadership;
When I was a young boy, my idols were my grandfathers, both of who fought in WWII. I distinctly remember the values they lived and taught every day, but also the feel of the belts they used to enforce those rules and regulations. My Fathers' Father was a retired Marine Colonel who saw action at Okinawa, Bouganville, and Iwo Jima before wounds took him out of the fight. Till the day he died, he kept his Marine flattop haircut and ramrod straight posture. His counterpart on my mothers side was a fighter pilot who saw action at Midway and the great marianas turkey shoot, who later on became an independent oil & gas producer after the war. Both were children of the great depression and impressed these values in me at a very young age.
Even then, My Grandpas used to tell me that America one day would be in a decline, one borne out of a loss of our moral compass, which is where we are now. My Dad's dad even told me one day that "when we begin building more prisons than we build schools, you know the end is near"........
How prophetic. So our problem is that we have lost our moral compass, and that is why some deem the latest generations failures. I say it all comes from the type of parenting and leadership they have.
Mine were 2 grandfathers who had the hard teachings of war and depression to guide them.
In contrast, todays youth have MySpace, the internet and Britney Spears for role models.
"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry
April 8th, 2009 04:29 PM
The "failure" is widespread complacency and self-absorption, but people are fooling themselves if they believe these flaws belong to any particular generation. They are human failings that blossom like an aggressive cancer during prosperous times.
Not all people succumb to it, but enough of them do to make things dangerous and miserable for the rest of us.
"The flock sleep peaceably in their pasture at night because Sheepdogs stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
April 8th, 2009 04:37 PM
Thankfully today by and large veterans are treated better than you gentlemen that went to Vietnam. While the media may not portray us in the best light always, a lot of people do small things that show appreciation and that makes a difference. One reason I love Ohio and the Midwest in general, is that attitude. As an example, those yellow ribbon car magnets are still everywhere here, sure a lot of people pay 5 bucks for em or whatever and just slap it on the car, but it is still nice to see driving down the road. But thank you for your service, hopefully someone else has said that before.
edr, I'd agree with broken moral compass. When making money however you can becomes a priority over doing the right thing, its a screwed up society.
Fortes Fortuna Juvat
Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor
April 8th, 2009 05:43 PM
April 8th, 2009 06:06 PM
Originally Posted by edr9x23super
This is what I ment by a "failed" generation... I see all kinds of people from my generation today, and I am in my mid 20s... some give me much hope but IMHO there are many more who I truely worry about... THE one's who believe they are "owed" something IN life (the entitlment class), THE ones who think America is a force for evil not liberty, THE ones who have no idea how they even remain free yet know each American Idolt winner, THE ones who remain ignorant of their own history and culture. You know what these sort of people are good for? Take a good long look on history and see those failed states, how do you think those people were so easily brain washed and rippened for their future masters? You think it all happened over night? NO, it was a gradual decline on several fronts over many years.
2 months ago I was shopping, and after coming home from work tired, I see these woman in her early 40s with her 2 grown children (they looked like they graduated from High school), and she had 3 FULL TROLLIES full of the most expensive food you can find... and I took one intelligent guess, that they were on food stamps (I was dead right too because she pulled out the food stamp card and saw a receipt LONGER THAN MY ARM, because IN TODAYS AMERICA those who sit at home and watch opra hours a day can be ENTITLED to $400-$600 worth of food a month (family of 3) without even trying to get a job, getting an education or making their communties better in any way... while those who BREAK THEIR BACKS live within their means.. and now with all those FAILED SOCIAL PROGRAMS the entire nation will hurt (We are hurting now because of them!!!)... America is now rewarding failure, a free chicken for every pot and a free pot for every chicken is the new mantra... This was not the mind set that built a Great Nation and a country is only as strong as the mental state of the people who lead it and those who elect them.
Sig P220R/Sig P239 (9mm)/ S&W 640/ Ruger Single Six Hunter (.22LR/Mag)/ CZ 452 Varmint .22LR/ Lee Enfield No4 MK2 sporterized dated 1959/ Mosin Nagant M90-30 dated 1942/
April 8th, 2009 06:29 PM
CR, just so ya know, I agree with you on many of those ideas, and this thread was in no way an attack on you or your thinking, so I hope you didn't take it as such.
But it seems like since the election there has been an up-tick in some aspects of society that seem to think its the people in their late teens to mid 20's who are all to blame for everything bad in the country these days. The generation has faults, as all do, but people do need to look at the driving forces behind such ideals, because they have to come from somewhere. (Not trying to start a big generational debate, but its true.).
Has America lost its moral compass, sometimes I really believe so, but at the same time I see glimmers of hope that show that we can be worthy torchbearers to the ideas that made America the nation it should be.
Fortes Fortuna Juvat
Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor
April 8th, 2009 08:55 PM
First, thank you for your service and being an example of why the stereotype does not apply to all of the younger generation.
Originally Posted by buckeyeLCPL
However, stereotypes typically have more than a grain of truth to them. Everyone witnessed the young Obama supporters, who when asked questions on issues had absolutely no idea about anything. These glassy eyed voters were not the determining factor in the last election but clearly represent childish behavior when given adult responsibilities.
Many of these people have learned to hate America in colleges throughout the nation. We hear news about anti-American professors like Ward Churchill and Angela Davis but it is well documented that campuses are severely left leaning. Many outside engineering and scientific disciplines are innundated with the concepts of 'hate crimes', speech codes, and 'America is to blame', which sadly, Obama espoused on his recently completed apology tour.
Another problem is that parents always want what is best for their children. They want to protect them and nurture them. Over the last thirty years America has seen great advances in technology and a huge increase in standard of living. Thus, children are not required to work and they have no incentive to work as their every need is taken care of by their parents. Into their 20s and beyond. It requires a strong sense of morality, self respect and initiative to break through the childish 'I want...give me' mentality. And that lack of responsibility is encouraged by the food stamp, free health care, subsidized housing, and welfare that is a job for many. Why work for $40,000/year when you can watch MTV all day and make $30,000?
I don't see this as a failed generation. I see many young people who have yet to taste the real world and have been left unprepared for coping with life. That is a failure of my generation. I also see young people like yourself that are a credit to any generation.
April 8th, 2009 10:14 PM
Pretty much right on, SD. The thing that amazes me about the younger generation is that so many do turn out so good despite what SD mentioned above. BuckeyeLCPL, your generation hasn't failed, your just getting started. It's us older (slightly, I'm 41 ) that let things get this way.
Originally Posted by SelfDefense
As a sidenote, I had a co-worker ask me why I thought there are so many mass shootings going on today. I told him it basically came down to throwing the ultimate temper tantrum. They haven't recieved the life they believe they are "entitled" to and they want everyone to know it and suffer for it. That isn't just the younger generation.
Btw, thanks for your service, buckeyeLCPL. It's young men and women like you that give us hope and makes us proud.
April 8th, 2009 11:03 PM
The "ultimate temper tantrum" is a good theory, and one I hadn't considered.... but I think you may be right.
Originally Posted by kpw
April 10th, 2009 09:25 AM
I honestly don't think it is a failed generation thing as much as I see it as a dramatic shift in the American mentality.
I am only in my early 40's but both of my parents are in their early 80's and have the depression era mentality. Nothing wrong with that in my mind, but just as a reference of where I am coming from. Most of the folks my age have parents that are a whole generation younger than mine. I have clients that range in age from a decade older than my parents to kids that aren't even out of high school yet, from all walks of life, waitresses and construction workers to engineers and doctors. Folks that barely make enough to pay the bills to folks that make close to a million dollars and pay more in taxes than most of us earn by working. So, you all can take this for what it is worth, about what your paying for it here.
What I mean by the shift in the mentality of America is this.
No longer is hard work and honesty used as a measure of a man/woman. It has become about who can end up with the most toys it seems. Used to you could take a man at his word, you didn't need a 20 page legal contract for rental agreement, and when you agreed to the contract you paid the rent each month. Now it seems that both sides of any agreement are looking for either how they can get out of something or get away with something.
Folks are focused on whether their neighbors have a newer car, or bigger house than they do, or the latest this or that. Very rarely do you find someone going to work at a company and staying until retirment age because the grass is always greener somewhere else, and by the same token the companies don't look to retain the folks that have given 20 years of service because some young person will do the job for less money and benefits.
The corruption in government officials from the local to the federal levels, and the all to familiar corporate rip offs and such driven solely by greed.
With all this self centeredess its all about me attitude folks have lost respect for themselves and others as well in my opinion. I was lucky enough that when I was in the Army there were no conflicts taking place. I applaud all the men and women who have served both during peace time, but especially those that chose service knowing that there was a conflict going on. Most Americans would never have considered it, as is reflected by the large number of contractors being used and the amount of enlistment and retention bonuses that have needed to be paid.
So buckeyLCPL, don't take any lack of respect that some show towards you as a direct affront on you or any others that have served with you. It truely is an indication of their own attitudes and they are the ones that should be discussed with themselves. Hopefully peoples attitudes will change, and we will get back to thinking about things that are truely important. But right now we can only hope.
Maybe your generation will end up being the next "great" generation.
Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
Texas CHL Instructor
Texas Hunter Education Instructor
April 10th, 2009 10:39 AM
I think this sums up some of the problems we see today in our society
"[Richard Rohr, a Franciscan priest researching initiation rites in
diverse cultures and religions] has found a remarkable similarity in
the 'lessons of life' that such rites attempt to teach across both
cultures and time. Rohr summarizes these as the following:
1. Life is hard.
2. You're going to die.
3. You're not that important.
4. You're not in control.
5. Life is not just about you.
[...] Now consider how utterly contrary those lessons are to what our
modern culture teaches. [...] If we were to compile the list of modern
culture's assumptions, they might read:
1. Life can be easy.
2. You can stay young (or keep looking and feeling young) forever.
3. You are what's most important.
4. Above all else, you must stay in control.
5. Life is mostly about you and your fulfillment."
This is true and sobering!!
"Our society needs more leadership and less celebrity, more character and less charisma."
A real man loves his wife, and places his family as the most important thing in life. Nothing has brought me more peace and content in life than simply being a good husband and father.
April 10th, 2009 10:53 AM
(Hesiod, 8th century BC).
I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on
frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond
words... When I was young, we were taught to be discreet and
respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise
[disrespectful] and impatient of restraint
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. (Thomas Jefferson)
April 10th, 2009 01:05 PM
I'm in the 'old fart' generation. I did my years in the military and have fond memories of pride and respect for my country that still hold strong meaning for me.
Our society seems to be breaking apart, but we are only responsible for who WE are and how WE treat others.
No man is an island, but we build our society, one man at a time.
I shake hands with every service man or woman I cross paths with...
It will sadly, probably take another all out war, or a full-blown depression...or both, to make this country come back to its roots...we'll see.
Maybe that's what we need?
Last edited by RETSUPT99; April 10th, 2009 at 02:29 PM.
The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
April 10th, 2009 08:47 PM
I think that the problem is that the hippies who were students during Vietnam, and thus avoided the draft, are now in charge of the media, education, and large segements of government. Their liberal idiocy is passed and the younger, lazy, half-witted, bleeding hearts grab the ole torch and carry it on.
It makes me sick too, but just as during 'Nam, a bunch of the best are on the battelfield and the losers are back home whining and protesting things they truly cannot even begin to understand.
The biggest challenge is to think of a way that we can overcome the cycle. How do we get rid of the entrenched idiocy in academia that perpetuates itself from one generation to the next?
It's gonna take something big. Real big. Like Retsup said, perhaps a WW or depression will be enough to snap the mind numbed American Idol fans out of their slumber. It will take something that mobilizes the majority of hard working folks into taking action and saying, "Your liberal crap ideas are not working and we are tired of you running our country into the ground with your excess spending on failed policies." or something to that effect. Who knows?
God Bless, take care.
When you've got 'em by the balls, their hearts & minds will follow. Semper Fi.
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