Robbed at Gun and Knife Point - What Would You Have Done?

This is a discussion on Robbed at Gun and Knife Point - What Would You Have Done? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Many people have opinion on what they WILL do, but have never really been faced with the choice. That's somewhat dangerous. It's easy to say ...

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Thread: Robbed at Gun and Knife Point - What Would You Have Done?

  1. #46
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Many people have opinion on what they WILL do, but have never really been faced with the choice. That's somewhat dangerous. It's easy to say that I'll shoot this guy or use my knife on that guy, but it's not as easy to do it - for most of us.

    I've written about the two situations I've been in that lethal force was an option. The second stopped with the sight of my gun, the first wasn't as simple.

    I was kidnapped (technically) during a car-jacking. Both were armed and made me climb to the open trunk area of the Four-Runner. I offered all of my money and the truck. i had around $500 in cash, but they also wanted my credit cards and ATM card. In total, they got over $2,000 from the ATM machines, my cash, a $500+ Mont Blanc pen and my Cartier watch that was a Christmas gift from my Grandmother who had passed away two years earlier..

    I was 19 years old at the time, this was 11 years ago. I've studied martial arts at this point off and on since I was 6 years old. I owned a number of guns, but could not carry due to my age. I did carry a pocket knife though and knew a little about how to use it. On a side note, I've since started studying Krav Maga and feel it's one of the most effective hand to hand defenses available.

    Both the driver and passenger had handguns and the passenger also played with a wire, similar to piano wire. I tried to talk to them as much as possible and by the third ATM, about an hour in to the ordeal, I knew I wasn't going home. I was confident from our conversation that I'd be finished off in the woods or a field somewhere.

    I'm not going to get too deep into the "Fight or Flight" response and how I was affected physiologically, but let's just say without it in full effect, I'd probably not be typing this today.

    At the third ATM, the passenger went inside the store. The driver continued to hold the gun on me from the driver's seat. I knew this was it, my last chance. I wasn't going to die on my knees in a field. I decided to make my move. i dove over the rear seats and attacked the driver with every bit of me... The gun went to the floor board after discharging. We struggled to get to it, punching and choking each other. The driver's head went through the driver's side window and blood was instantly everywhere. I jumped out the rear passenger side door and ran to a telephone repair truck parked maybe 20 yards away.

    The passenger saw me getting out and ran to the SUV and got in. They sped out off and the police were there within a few minutes. They were never caught. The fact that they had my address concerned me some, but not like I expected it would. They found the Four-Runner that evening along with dozens of finger prints, two teeth, blood and what we assumed was a small piece of the driver's face.

    Now, before going through that I would have told you it probably would never happen since I'm so "aware" of my surroundings or that I would have been out of there within 2 minutes. I would have laughed if you told me this is how it would have played out. It's great to discuss what we could do, but it's foolish to think we KNOW what we'd do.

    Since then, I got my permit as soon as I could and have trained like crazy. I still don't think I know what I'll do in another situation, but I do know that no matter what happens, I'm much better prepared to handle it. This was proven in the second situation. I won't go in to details, but I would have told you this and that is what I'd do, but I ended up doing the other when it happened.

    If there's a next time, I don't care how many there are or what they want, I WILL NOT give it to them. Hypocritically, I tell others to give them the money and try to get away. If confronted with no other option, FIGHT! I know what I can do and what I'm capable if, but i can say that ONLY because I've been challenged with making those choices.

    Be safe out there. Train as hard as you can, carry the largest caliber you can shoot fast and accurately and in no way should you ever think you know exactly what you'll do in a self defense situation. Having a plan is a good thing, but thinking you know exactly what you'll do will put you in a real bad place when that option is not available! Let it play out, look for opportunity and act WITHOUT hesitation. Hesitation will get you killed.

    This stuff isn't a joke, it's serious business and these people will kill us for $50 or less. They don't have to worry about consequences, who else may be wounded, or if it's justified. We do. That puts us at the disadvantage. We can't hit reset when things aren't going as we'd like them to.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

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  3. #47
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    glad youre here to relate the story...

  4. #48
    Member Array spar10's Avatar
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    thanks for sharing that story jonconsiglio. it's true and i think you make an important point. there are two type of advice. one that comes from someone that's been in a comparable situation and the other that comes from someone that thinks they have a good answer based on what makes sense from a practical standpoint.

    i guess we can only take as much information as we can get, train, train and train some more and hope all of that knowledge and training are never needed. of course, as i said in my op, given that anyone is in this situation, follow your gut.

  5. #49
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bubbiesdad View Post
    Two words, "decoy wallet" one old picture of you and your significant other, $7 cash, plus, I'm sure everyone has at least one credit card where the account has been "compromised", and the account closed, (as of my recent travels, I have three, all with expiration dates to last awhile).

    Be sure to carry this on "weak side".
    I say a picture and address of an "ex"....
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

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    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  6. #50
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Ha ha!! That's pretty funny.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  7. #51
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bladenbullet View Post
    glad youre here to relate the story...
    Thank you, I am as well. I really hope that someone out there can learn a thing or two. The other situation I was in required my handgun, but luckily no shots were fired.

    My family learned a lot from this. My Mother's side of my family own firearms, but used to be in the "It won't happen to me" camp. That's changed for at least one of them.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  8. #52
    Member Array CDRGlock's Avatar
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    Robbed at Gun and Knife Point - What Would You Have Done?

    Quote Originally Posted by spar10 View Post
    this is a true story and i keep replaying it in my head and wondering what would of happened differently, if anything, had i already had my ccw and had been carrying.

    i was walking my (really small) dog around 11pm on a winter night. i was one block from my house and as i approached the final cross street before walking onto my block, i could see two people standing on the corner. it didn't seem right so i know i've already screwed up by continuing to walk toward them instead of turning around and going down a different route to my house.

    as i approached the two people i could see they were probably teenagers. as i got close to them, one of the kids pulled a gun in front of me and the other kid pulled a knife (a steak knife of all things) and stood behind me. i still had my small dog on the leash. i was pretty nervous but not anywhere near as scared as i thought i would be or probably should have been in this scenario.

    they told me to give them all of my money so i reached into my back pocket, pulled my wallet out and gave them what little was in there. once they had the money, they told me to keep moving and don't look back, which is exactly what i did.

    about 50 feet away i reached into my coat pocket and called 911 from my cellphone. i'll cut out the rest of the story and skip to the ending. the little douche bags were caught and arrested. one of the punks was 15 and went to juvi for 3 years, his douche bag buddy with the gun went down for 7 years and the two little ****heads in the getaway car that i never saw got off with a slap on the wrist. go figure.

    so my question is.... if i'd been carrying should i have shot both of them and been done with it? as it turns out, i'm fine and my only trauma is really wondering what, if anything, i would or should have done differently had i been carrying.
    With the circumstances, you did the right thing, you are alive and unhurt. Since the crime was committed and they were no longer an immediate threat, shooting them would have been unjustified.

    Situational awareness is the key to self defense. If you don't feel comfortable, then you could have crossed the street to avoid them. If you had a gun on you and you sensed a threat, you can get yourself ready to draw or fire if the gun was in the coat; however, self preservation would be the only priority. Let the dog go and draw or fire from the pocket if the situation escalated to bodily harm. However, with two assailants either way you would have been probably shot or stabbed.
    NRA, Lifetime Member

  9. #53
    Member Array glock45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jcabin View Post
    Drawing would have got you killed.
    I think this also. Your mistake was to continue walking towards them instead of around them.
    G21SF, G30, G36, Ruger SP101 DAO, S&W 642

  10. #54
    VIP Member Array old grunt's Avatar
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    You did well..you lived to talk(and post)about it. Only one mistake I see..you felt something was wrong and you continued toward the 2 dip$%*^s, instead of taking a different route home.
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  11. #55
    Member Array romansten9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jcabin View Post
    Drawing would have got you killed.
    I agree, since the BG had his gun drawn already. Of course it is possible to shoot without drawing. (through a coat pocket). (it was winter) Provided that you are close enough to aim just by pointing. First shoot through the pocket and take out the one with the gun, then quickly back away from the one with the knife and draw the gun out. Of course the BGs in the getaway car complicate things too. So, the best option would be to take a different route home (if it didn't "seem right" to walk past them in the first place)

  12. #56
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    You have a gun drawn on you and your thinking about drawing and ordering them to drop their weapons
    If you have a chance to draw in this scenario....you better shoot immediately. A better (& safer) suggestion, if trained to do so, would be to go to close quarters combat, IMO.

    Because of proximity (it sounds like close here)...they have the edge if it becomes a shoot out. You cannot beat them if they are committed to shoot. Better to use the right techniques and have a better chance of disabling their gun or using it on them.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  13. #57
    Member Array 45tek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sticks View Post
    Thank you. I really did not want to get into the whole "not worth it / it's just a wallet" issue.

    If more people refuse to be victims under any circumstance, then we might just be able to stem the tide of wannabe hardened criminals while they are in the apprenticeship program.

    For deeper insight I refer to this now closed thread... http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...-property.html

    Unfortunately the OP put himself in this position, primarily by ignoring his gut. Then he was forced to deal with the situation on the BG terms. Harsh lesson, and an even harsher way to learn it. It sounds like the OP has learned from this and will not be a free repeater.
    Well, its not just a wallet actually. I mean, OP obviously was not in a position to draw. I guess we can all armchair quarterback this thing, but drawing with a pistol pointed at ya at point blank is TV and nothing more. I guarantee my trigger finger is faster than any draw known to man. Now having said that, Im thinking unloading a pocket pistol/revolver from inside your jacket is your only chance in this situation.

  14. #58
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    I am 68 years old living most of that time in NY/NJ, hardly the Garden of Edens of the world. Up until 2 years ago I never touched a firearm in my life and in all thoe 68 years I have never been in a situation that ever came close to wanting or needing or even thinking about a firearm. As most have said already, situational awareness is, IMO, at least 95% (if not more) of self defense. You can have the biggest and the baddest with lasers and lights and sights and multiple mags etc etc but avoidance is the easiest way.You walked right into something you knew was not right--nough said.
    Sounds alot like me Kel. Got my first and only gun at 49. Never felt the need for one and did indeed handle many situations. No real situation convinced me to buy one either.

    But the lifelong SA is still there. As a woman, esp., I would never have walked that close to them. I would have crossed the street or gone back. I also watch for people following me on foot or in my car.

    But the OP acknowleges this...ignoring his gut. I've taken precautions that make me feel silly afterwards sometimes...but hey...I'm still here.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  15. #59
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    IMO, Bladenbullet gave some solid advice here.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  16. #60
    Member Array CommonMan101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    Hey Bubbie: The answer to your question as to why, after 66 years of never even havng touched a firearm is simple. This country is turning into a cesspool led by the biggest idiot we have ever had in office, a bunch of little idiots that surround him, and a swarm of illegal garbage who believe they have a right to my country. I see germany in the 30s as clear as day. I see complete government takeover and the crowning of our first dictator. I see a fascist state. I see people on this forum being labeled terrorists and anti-government. I see the suspension of liberties. I hope I am wrong but I intend to be prepared if I am right. I will not lay down and be a sheep like some of my distant relatives did in germany, thinking that because they are german, no one will bother them. This country is getting dangerous and I will protect myself and my family.
    +1 That pretty well covers it. Got your back. `nuff said.

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