Legal aspects of shooting unarmed man in public restroom - long

This is a discussion on Legal aspects of shooting unarmed man in public restroom - long within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by ctsketch Your posts obviously show intent and malice against homosexuals, and now they are a matter of permanent public record. good luck ...

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Thread: Legal aspects of shooting unarmed man in public restroom - long

  1. #91
    Member Array basicbosch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctsketch View Post
    Your posts obviously show intent and malice against homosexuals, and now they are a matter of permanent public record. good luck with your defense in the future.
    Except for the homosexual friends of mine being witness to my actual nature. Considering I have never even made a joke about harming them will speak volumes. Thanks for adding your $.02.

    I will take it into account during pretrial when I explain my full understanding of my right to defend myself against a sexual predator.

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  3. #92
    Member Array basicbosch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    basicbosch

    I stand by my original post.

    Unless the guy assaulting you is a 300 lb linebacker why can't you just stand up for yourself? You are telling me you need a gun to defend yourself? You are willing to kill because someone exposed themselves to you? You should rethink your priorities. Please for the love of God and all that is holy... rethink your priorities.
    Once again, my states deadly force statue abandons my duty to retreat. I don't have to fight off or run away from a sexual attacker and I am within my rights if I feel someone is attempting to kill, do great bodily harm, or sexually assault me.

    Once again get to know the situation. Someone would have to go wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy out of their way to accidental expose themselves to me. A male would have to have forced my pants down to have myself exposed to them.

    I know the difference between a flasher and someone who is attempting a sexual assault.

  4. #93
    Member Array basicbosch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeephipwr View Post
    I think the gentleman may be harboring feeling of homosexuality. In his own mind, he wants to be percieved as a heterosexual male. But when placed in an environment of possible naked male bodies or male body parts, he wants to resort to violence or flee. Thus avoiding those places.

    Males are exposed to other mens bodies all the time. Locker rooms, gyms, showers, etc. It is common place and should not a fearful thing. Just the way it is.

    Look at his reaction to the woman that exposed herself. He had her arrested. Most guys would have asked for another look or a photograph. Not the best behavior but not really harmful either.

    So I think the fellow needs o seek counseling and address that basis of his fears in going to public restrooms and possible adversion to male nudity.

    I am not a psychologist but I am staying at a Holiday Inn Express right now.
    It's clear you aren't a psychologist.

    "Look at his reaction to the woman that exposed herself. He had her arrested. Most guys would have asked for another look or a photograph. Not the best behavior but not really harmful either."

    I don't need to look at every retarded women willing to expose herself to the general public. They are usually trash and not worth talking to anyway. Don't give me the whole she has kids to feed crap either, anyone can work at McDonald's. A woman who runs around in public naked is flat out trash and I do not have to view it. She belongs locked up for it each time she does it.

  5. #94
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    I don't have a problem with people being gay, I have a problem with people having non procreational sex. .

    I know that in the other forum's thread, you emphasized what was considered 'reasonable' behavior...for society and for a jury.

    Do you consider your view above 'reasonable?' As in--it should be applied to society in general? Do you believe it would be reasonable to apply this standard if you were on a jury?

    Should married couples who dont want kids never have sex?

    And how does this apply at all to being exposed to other men's genitals?
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  6. #95
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    I never took an exam. You are a far different person from me. After getting my degree I made the decision that our justice system is socially stacked against people based on class. I find it completely hypocritical to throw someone in prison for 5 years for cocaine possession, while someone with crack will get at least 2 times the penalty. I wouldn't place someone under arrest for a drug addiction, or for not paying their child support. I don't care about the 1994 Child Support ACT that Bill Clinton made law, I know full well we got rid of debtors prison over 150 years ago. That was just Clinton's way of eliminating social welfare reductions.

    I am far to idealistic.

    How do you justify this position ^^ when you clearly wrote that you would just shoot if you felt threatened and let the jury decide...because dead men cannot tell their side of the story? That you could say whatever you wanted and they'd have to believe you because 'the dead tell no tales?'

    This is a clear breach of ethics and justice.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  7. #96
    VIP Member Array ctsketch's Avatar
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    I have a criminal justice degree.
    I just love how his defense for everything is "I ARE HAS DEGREE!!!!"
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  8. #97
    VIP Member Array ctsketch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    I never took an exam. You are a far different person from me. After getting my degree I made the decision that our justice system is socially stacked against people based on class. I find it completely hypocritical to throw someone in prison for 5 years for cocaine possession, while someone with crack will get at least 2 times the penalty. I wouldn't place someone under arrest for a drug addiction, or for not paying their child support. I don't care about the 1994 Child Support ACT that Bill Clinton made law, I know full well we got rid of debtors prison over 150 years ago. That was just Clinton's way of eliminating social welfare reductions.

    I am far to idealistic.
    Hey i'm not a LEO i'm and Engineer
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  9. #98
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Wow.



    Just...wow.

  10. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    Wow.



    Just...wow.

    Ya....that's what I was thinking.

    For those who might come across this thread in the future...this thread is NOT normal...but an aberration of things discussed on this forum.

    BB...your latest posts appear reasoned. By your focus on one aspect of self-defense--sexual assault--I think that is what throws people for a loop. Given the collective experience of the group, this is just one event...and it does strike me as odd; I would not trust you as a LEO, IMO. I do think you should seek additional counseling and discuss this thread with him/her.

    I do have to ask, though, when you said:
    I am certain you won't be reading anything like that. I have had the situation where I was armed and justified to shoot my ex fiancé, ex husband. Just before he threw her off the steps and came inside where I was standing in the middle of the room with my pistol I dropped the clip and flung it under the couch, then I remembered Michigan's duty to retreat and ran out the back door with him following me, I created a scene and he jumped on me and I used fluid shock wave strikes and finally head locked him until deputies arrived.
    Why did you do this??
    Last edited by SIGguy229; May 28th, 2010 at 09:40 AM.
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

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  11. #100
    Member Array CommonMan101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    Ya....that's what I was thinking.

    For those who might come across this thread in the future...this thread is NOT normal.

    BB...your latest posts appear reasoned. By your focus on one aspect of self-defense--sexual assault--I think that is what throws people for a loop. Given the collective experience of the group, this is just one event...and it does strike me as odd; I would not trust you as a LEO, IMO. I do think you should seek additional counseling and discuss this thread with him/her.
    +1 there is a somewhat un-hinged aspect to BB's personality and view of the world. Can't put my finger on it - probably get shot if I could.

  12. #101
    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    Once again, my states deadly force statue abandons my duty to retreat. I don't have to fight off or run away from a sexual attacker and I am within my rights if I feel someone is attempting to kill, do great bodily harm, or sexually assault me.
    Wrong!

    basicbosch you are misinterpreting the law. A mistake that could get you locked up for the rest of your life.
    Quote Originally Posted by Public Act 309 of 2006
    Introduced by Rep. Rick Jones (R) on September 7, 2005, to create a new law establishing that a person who uses deadly force for self defense in his or her home, contiguous private property or occupied vehicle need not first flee from a threatening attacker, and that a person who unlawfully and forcibly enters one of these is presumed is to be doing so with the intent to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence, with certain minor exceptions. This would place the “home is my castle” doctrine in statute. Also, to establish that a law-abiding person who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be, has no duty to retreat, and can “stand his or her ground” and meet force with force, including deadly force if necessary to prevent death or great bodily harm.
    Unless you own the restroom you MUST retreat.

    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    Once again get to know the situation. Someone would have to go wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy out of their way to accidental expose themselves to me.
    Why are you so willing to kill someone because they exposed themselves to you? Psychotic tendencies? It goes beyond psychotic behavior to then try to legally justify murdering someone who flashed you.... it treads into the premeditated murder territory.

    Don't ever join a fraternity!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    A male would have to have forced my pants down to have myself exposed to them.

    I know the difference between a flasher and someone who is attempting a sexual assault.
    You actually believe there is a man in a public restroom somewhere willing to forcibly rape you? You must have watched "Deliverance" one too many times... If that where to ever happen you better pull your pants back up and buy a lottery ticket.
    There is something about firing 4,200 thirty millimeter rounds/min that makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

  13. #102
    VIP Member Array ctsketch's Avatar
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    I bet he's afraid to drop the soap even in his own shower
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  14. #103
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    Wrong!

    basicbosch you are misinterpreting the law. A mistake that could get you locked up for the rest of your life.

    Unless you own the restroom you MUST retreat.



    Why are you so willing to kill someone because they exposed themselves to you? Psychotic tendencies? It goes beyond psychotic behavior to then try to legally justify murdering someone who flashed you.... it treads into the premeditated murder territory.

    Don't ever join a fraternity!!!

    You actually believe there is a man in a public restroom somewhere willing to forcibly rape you? You must have watched "Deliverance" one too many times... If that where to ever happen you better pull your pants back up and buy a lottery ticket.
    Originally Posted by Public Act 309 of 2006
    Introduced by Rep. Rick Jones (R) on September 7, 2005, to create a new law establishing that a person who uses deadly force for self defense in his or her home, contiguous private property or occupied vehicle need not first flee from a threatening attacker, and that a person who unlawfully and forcibly enters one of these is presumed is to be doing so with the intent to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence, with certain minor exceptions. This would place the “home is my castle” doctrine in statute. Also, to establish that a law-abiding person who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be, has no duty to retreat, and can “stand his or her ground” and meet force with force, including deadly force if necessary to prevent death or great bodily harm.

    actually...he isnt misinterpreting the law....but as he states incorrectly it doesnt abandon the necessity to retreat...it just allows his to stand his ground if he is somewhere he is legally entitled to be...there is more to it than the statement you bolded....

    it doesnt change the fact that he is...in my less than proffessional opinion...legally incompetant of making those decisions based on his statements....but his interpretation of the law he plans to use when he blows away a guy who trips away from the urinal with his pubic hair caught in his zipper by accident...

  15. #104
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    re: basicbosh

    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    Well I would say get to know a subject before you decide you get graded on it. I understand what a flasher is, I know what indecent exposure is as well. The situation I suggested was if a man showed me his junk coming toward me, making an action to assault me, I would defend myself to the limits of the law.
    Wow. You really have what seems to me to be a very unrealistic fear of sexual assault in a public restroom. But worse, you clearly don't understand that you have an obligation to use the minimum amount of force necessary to extricate yourself from a situation.

    So, let's take this situation you imagine might happen. "A man showed his junk coming toward me," SO? You can't walk away?

    You can't yell, hey man, pick your pants up?

    You can't outrun a dude with his pants down around his knees? (Just the mental picture here is good for a laugh. "But judge, I couldn't outrun him." Yeah, sure. )

    Do you have any real reason to believe he isn't just a guy careless about his exposure who wanted to ask you for a roll of toilet paper? A bar of soap? Directions to somewhere? Where in your scenario is a threat expressed that requires you to respond in any way whatsoever with more than a verbal command? In the scenario you are describing there could be totally innocent
    explanations and no threat whatsoever.

    Let's just for the sake of argument assume that this "attacker" didn't instantly back down when you yelled, "get back?" Are you a mouse? Do you really think that your only resort would be homicide?

    Again, where is the evidence of ability, opportunity, jeopardy and intent?

    In your scenario at most there is an ambiguous indication of "intent." There is no indication of ability. (Again, are you a mouse?) There is no indication of jeopardy or opportunity, it will only exist if you fail to open the door and get out of the place.


    Lethal force is for the gravest extreme, and not because you are agoraphobic, or because you have irrational feelings about nudity.

  16. #105
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    re: Basicbosh-- your comment on the prostate

    Quote Originally Posted by basicbosch View Post
    I don't have a problem using a public restroom, first off it is always more comfortable to piss or 2 sitting down then standing up. Second off I understand it's bad for your prostate to piss standing up all of the time.
    Sir, the more you write the more you show that things don't compute normally. Your comment above about ******* standing up being bad for the prostate is wrong, period! Yet, another indication that you need more help than you can get here or on whatever forum you originally were on with 9MMare.

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