Do you shoot him?

This is a discussion on Do you shoot him? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; There was an incident several years ago in Co Springs in which the home owner caught a bad guy in his basement and ordered him ...

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Thread: Do you shoot him?

  1. #16
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    There was an incident several years ago in Co Springs in which the home owner caught a bad guy in his basement and ordered him to leave.

    The BG turned around to walk away, took a few steps , turned and fired at the home owner. I know the home owner returned fire but I don't remember if he hit the BG or not.

    Given that, I'd err on the side of caution IAW Colorado law if I percieved that the bad guy presented any threat how ever slight I'd defend myself.

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  3. #17
    AzB
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    Why give them the chance? They've already shown poor judgement, what's to stop them from leaving and coming back armed? Pulling out a concealed weapon and shooting? Making outrageous claims after the fact?

    If he's down and dead, my family is safe and I'm safe. End of story. I don't have to worry about what he claims, what he was about to do, or what he might do tomorrow.

    For the emotional trauma of my family? Yes, that's a real consideration. But dealing with the cleanup and mental anguish of a dead criminal in my house is preferable to the cleanup and mental anguish for dealing with dead family members.

    I'm really a very nice person and hope to never kill anyone. But these days people are getting more and more unpredictable, violent, and totally without honor or empathy. For the safety of me and my own, I'm not taking chances with someone who is in my house uninvited.
    Az

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  4. #18
    VIP Member Array grady's Avatar
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    Any unknown, uninvited stranger in my home at 2 a.m. is a threat to my family and to myself, whether I can see a weapon or not, whether he dropped a weapon or not, whether he has another weapon or not, whether he's a martial arts expert or not, whether he's young and athletic or not, whether he has accomplices or not.

    The best way to ensure the safety of my family and myself is to fire until the threat is no longer a threat. Numerous examples exist of a criminal turning to run while still pointing a gun and firing at someone behind him.

    If you're a guest in my home at that time, you might want to cover your ears.

  5. #19
    Ex Member Array HollowpointHank's Avatar
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    I remember a thread where a presumed bad guy broke into a home, only to find out he was falling down drunk and had the wrong house. While he was no threat to anyone and just trying to find his bed, he was in a strangers home. Should he pay with his life?

  6. #20
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    Yes, if I have to.

    Just because the law says I can shoot him doesn't mean I have to.
    Retired USAF E-8. Remember: You're being watched!
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

  7. #21
    Ex Member Array HollowpointHank's Avatar
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    Old vet, I see your point, but the previous posts seemed to say shoot first and ask questions later.

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    Okaay

    1. That depends on tactical positioning, possibly/possibly not. He gets a "FREEZE" command. The slightest movement and he gets a load of buckshot.

    2. To each his own.

    3. Because he would be prone on the ground with a gauge pointed at him from behind and then cuffed.

    4. He won't be doing any running prone and cuffed.

    5. There can nearly always be another answer.
    Do you have Professional training to handcuff the BG while holding him at gunpoint? This is one of the MOST dangerous things you could choose to do, make your decision to do this VERY carefully.

    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Let me check my "retsupt's Home Invasion/Robbery Rules" sheet...just a minute...

    Let's see...

    Home invader, armed...Boom-boom!
    Home invader, unarmed...Boom-boom!
    Home invader, armed, but drops his weapon...Boom-boom!
    Home robber climbs through window, armed...Boom-boom!
    Home robber climbs through window, unarmed...Boom-boom!
    Home robber turns his back to me to hide behind couch...Boom-Boom!

    Bottom line...there is really no way to identify a weapon...anyone invading my space must be assumed to have a weapon or he/she would not have been so bold as to enter a private dwelling 'unprepared'.

    Yep, I got the stranger in my home pretty well covered...I'm assuming that ANYONE unidentified/uninvited in my home is not there to sell girl scout cookies. His/her midnight free shopping license is getting revoked... I'm just sayin'...
    Best answer in the thread!
    Quote Originally Posted by HollowpointHank View Post
    I remember a thread where a presumed bad guy broke into a home, only to find out he was falling down drunk and had the wrong house. While he was no threat to anyone and just trying to find his bed, he was in a strangers home. Should he pay with his life?
    Yes....He may be "falling down drunk", and lost. He may be "falling down drunk" lost and a mean drunk who is armed, I can't tell the difference (in the amount of time I'm willing to give him before he gets shot), can you? He may think you're in HIS home and attack YOU. In the time it takes you to realize that this is an armed drunk, wanting to hurt you or your family, you could be shot. NOT A CHANCE I'M WILLING TO TAKE!
    Last edited by sigmanluke; June 12th, 2010 at 10:28 AM. Reason: clarity
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  9. #23
    VIP Member Array searcher 45's Avatar
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    A friend of mine told me this: "Any home invader in his home was committing suicide."
    NOT LIVING IN FEAR, JUST READY!!!
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  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by HollowpointHank View Post
    I remember a thread where a presumed bad guy broke into a home, only to find out he was falling down drunk and had the wrong house. While he was no threat to anyone and just trying to find his bed, he was in a strangers home. Should he pay with his life?
    Yes he should. Some mistakes are just too big. He CHOSE to get drunk. He was sober when he made that decision.
    Mark Twain:
    The government is merely a servant -- merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a
    patriot and who isn't. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

  11. #25
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Okay guy is "unarmed" and turns to run,you let him go,after he reaches the door and goes thru it he now has cover produces a backup weapon and starts firing into your home,possibly not only striking you but your wife and kids in their rooms.
    If I think for one minute my family will be more traumatised by a BG bleeding out in the house or being shot because I gave the BG an opportunity,and just remember the BG's are always looking for opportunitys.
    You let BG go and cops don't catch him,one day you walk out to get in your car and next thing you know he's standing at your window saying remember me,as he puts a bullet in your head
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Home invader, armed...Boom-boom!
    Home invader, unarmed...Boom-boom!
    Home invader, armed, but drops his weapon...Boom-boom!
    Home robber climbs through window, armed...Boom-boom!
    Home robber climbs through window, unarmed...Boom-boom!
    Home robber turns his back to me to hide behind couch...Boom-Boom!

    I see you still have the coach gun huh!
    I prefer to live dangerously free than safely caged!

    "Our houses are protected by the good Lord and a gun. And you might meet 'em both if you show up here not welcome son." Josh Thompson "Way Out Here"

  13. #27
    Member Array Beretta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    Why give them the chance? They've already shown poor judgement, what's to stop them from leaving and coming back armed? Pulling out a concealed weapon and shooting? Making outrageous claims after the fact?

    If he's down and dead, my family is safe and I'm safe. End of story. I don't have to worry about what he claims, what he was about to do, or what he might do tomorrow.

    For the emotional trauma of my family? Yes, that's a real consideration. But dealing with the cleanup and mental anguish of a dead criminal in my house is preferable to the cleanup and mental anguish for dealing with dead family members.

    I'm really a very nice person and hope to never kill anyone. But these days people are getting more and more unpredictable, violent, and totally without honor or empathy. For the safety of me and my own, I'm not taking chances with someone who is in my house uninvited.
    I completely agree. Obviously I wont shoot a person that has genuinely given up. Keep in mind that a home invader probably wont give you any warning, and a lot of times they are seasoned veterans in what they do. On top of all that, theyre at an advantage. They have the element of surprise. In my home, [once identified] I will not give any warning either. I cant afford to give them a chance and will take every advantage I can get.

    Quote Originally Posted by HollowpointHank View Post
    I remember a thread where a presumed bad guy broke into a home, only to find out he was falling down drunk and had the wrong house. While he was no threat to anyone and just trying to find his bed, he was in a strangers home. Should he pay with his life?
    Who's to say, but one doesnt know a drunk from a home invader at 2am. Trying to find out may get one killed in the process. Every senario is different. JMO.
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  14. #28
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    Originally Posted by HollowpointHank
    I remember a thread where a presumed bad guy broke into a home, only to find out he was falling down drunk and had the wrong house. While he was no threat to anyone and just trying to find his bed, he was in a strangers home. Should he pay with his life?

    Yes he should. Some mistakes are just too big. He CHOSE to get drunk. He was sober when he made that decision.


    So let me get this straight you are going to tell the investigating LEO and the following jury and/or prosecutor a man who is drunk and mistakingly broke into your home whom you know was not armed or a threat would be shot down simply because he was drunk and broke into your house by mistake?
    I am not a lawyer but was a cop for a long time and I would bet some of the best criminal defense lawyers in the country would be lining up for this case whether he lived or died.
    I realize that in some states the caste doctrine says he breaks in you can use deadly force but you must also realize that many say that you must be in fear for your life. An unarmed drunk in your living room who broke into your house by mistake does not fit that criteria.
    Think about what you are saying on an open public forum that you will with premeditation kill someone who is unarmed and not a threat if he is illegally in your home.
    In regards to the statements that he runs away and confronts you later on with a gun, that can be applied to any SD scenario in which the suspect flees instead of fights. Do you shoot them all threat or not just because he may come back later?
    As I have stated before the totality of the circumstance would be looked at. If the threat is not there, AT THAT MOMENT, you cant use deadly force because of what the BG may do seconds from now or years from now.
    Just an opinion and I realize that state laws differ.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  15. #29
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sigmanluke View Post
    Do you have Professional training to handcuff the BG while holding him at gunpoint? This is one of the MOST dangerous things you could choose to do, make your decision to do this VERY carefully.
    Five seconds to check my bio should answer that for you.

  16. #30
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    Uh empty wheel or mag done

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