2 against one, head on, one lane road

This is a discussion on 2 against one, head on, one lane road within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; You work for a communications company. A site on top of a mountain just went offline and you are dispatched at 1am. As you are ...

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Thread: 2 against one, head on, one lane road

  1. #1
    New Member Array jimh's Avatar
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    2 against one, head on, one lane road

    You work for a communications company. A site on top of a mountain just went offline and you are dispatched at 1am. As you are driving up to the site you get in an area where there is no cell service. You come around the corner on the one lane road, and meet another truck head on. About 50 feet in front of you, the passenger gets out and is armed with an ar15 and the driver has a pistol leaning out the window.

    They were at the communications site stealing equipment (which is why the site went offline). You have a ccw with a pistol, but you are alone. The road is narrow and has lots of turns so backing up fast is not an option.

    What do you do?

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    Ex Member Array BikerRN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimh View Post
    You work for a communications company. A site on top of a mountain just went offline and you are dispatched at 1am. As you are driving up to the site you get in an area where there is no cell service. You come around the corner on the one lane road, and meet another truck head on. About 50 feet in front of you, the passenger gets out and is armed with an ar15 and the driver has a pistol leaning out the window.

    They were at the communications site stealing equipment (which is why the site went offline). You have a ccw with a pistol, but you are alone. The road is narrow and has lots of turns so backing up fast is not an option.

    What do you do?
    Given the situation, night, twisty road which I will assume means on a mountain somewhere, occupants are armed.

    My goal is to get to a safe area ASAP, as I really dislike having guns pointed at me. I am assuming that you have a mountain on one side of you, and a steep cliff on the other. If not, is it possible to exit your vehicle and take to the woods and once behind cover communicate with them?

    Another option is to wave and act like nothing is wrong and manuver around the other vehicle, or back up to a pullout or wider shoulder area to allow them to pass. The fact that both occupants of the vehicle are armed is a great concern to me at this point given the expressed posturing you wrote about.

    You do not know that these folks were up there stealing stuff, eventhough that is the most likely explaination as to why they were up there, and theft is not usually punishable by death. The two have the ability, some implied intent based on their actions, and the means to cause your death, but I think most juries would have a hard time buying the intent at this point by what you typed.

    They could argue that the rifle bearer got out of the truck due to your aggression, or some other such, and was only taking a more tactical position in the interest of safety and not because they had any evil intent towards you. It also could be a property owner checking on fences after he saw the lights from the real thieves as they were stealing stuff. It would sure suck to be you after you shot a rightful property owner that, after having seen the vehicle lights of the real criminals, went to investigate only to be shot by a company employee.

    Sometimes the poker game of life deals you a crappy hand, and you have to play the cards you are dealt. Being that I am not there I cannot tell you exactly what I would do, as I cannot read their mannerisms and have no knowledge of the local culture. I can tell you that I would have to consider some options, none of which are favorable, and all carry risk.

    Biker

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    Member Array 007BondJames's Avatar
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    Has this happened or is this a what if? I would think your truck should be equipped with a two way radio. Most com truck should be rather large like a bucket truck. I would ram their truck if the shtf. They would only get out of the truck if they were cornered.
    Hitler once said, “The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerers who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing.”

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    VIP Member Array goldshellback's Avatar
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    One guy with a rifle and the other with a sidearm........not good odds. Your taken by suprise out in the sticks and out gunned.

    Headlights go to high-beam and I start crying and praying outloud and hope to catch them by suprise. Rifle-thug HAS to go NOW.

    If running is an option.......then I'm outta there. That's a fire fight I do NOT wanna partake in.

    The ONLY advantage you have is the suprise of being armed and it being dark.
    "Just getting a concealed carry permit means you haven't commited a crime yet. CCP holders commit crimes." Daniel Vice, senior attorney for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, quoted on Fox & Friends, 8 Jul, 2008

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    Senior Member Array DIABLO9489's Avatar
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    Duck and cover But really I would be backing up to somewhere where I could turn around and get the hell out.
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    Member Array TVille's Avatar
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    Sometimes you are just screwed. You likely would not see either weapon given the headlights. You would have no idea why they were there - Maybe they were just up playing on the mountain - who knows.

    You would probably be thinking of backing up to a place to allow the two vehicles to pass, unless you are really paranoid, and think everyone is stealing your equipment. Most of what I have seen would mean a 200 yard or so path to the next wide spot in the road.

    At that point, if they chose to eliminate the phone company witness, you are screwed. They have the drop on you, outnumber you, and out gun you. Otherwise, they pass, you go up and discover they situation.

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    VIP Member Array Hiram25's Avatar
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    High beams, exit vehicle towards the rear and head down the road behind your vehicle as quickly as possible. Once you get to where you have a signal, 911. Describe yourself and the others as best you can, weapons observed including yours and tell them where you are hiding and what you are wearing. Find a place to conceal yourself until police arrive. Holster your weapon, and with hands in the air, try to make contact with the responding units. Once you have made contact tell them exactly what they are dealing with. Be a good witness.
    Hiram25
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    Short answer? I would run away and hide. Long answer is something similar to what Hiram25 posted. If you really wanted to trap them on the road you could take your truck keys with you or throw them into the woods. As for me I'd leave them in the truck so they could leave ASAP.
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

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    JD
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hiram25 View Post
    High beams, exit vehicle towards the rear and head down the road behind your vehicle as quickly as possible. Once you get to where you have a signal, 911. Describe yourself and the others as best you can, weapons observed including yours and tell them where you are hiding and what you are wearing. Find a place to conceal yourself until police arrive. Holster your weapon, and with hands in the air, try to make contact with the responding units. Once you have made contact tell them exactly what they are dealing with. Be a good witness.
    That sounds like a winner to me. I've been in the communications biz for the last 6 years and have often thought of this as theft of antenna lines for the copper is becoming more frequent. The above sounds like as good a plan as any I've come up with.

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    VIP Member Array Old School's Avatar
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    They knew you were coming before you knew they were there. Real tough spot to be in. Hiram 25 has some good thoughts but you better be thinking and moving fast. If the BG with the AR is any where near proficient you got a big time problem.
    "Violence is seldom the answer, but when it is the answer it is the only answer".

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    New Member Array jimh's Avatar
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    Thanks for the posts guys. I like the idea of leaving the truck and going back down the road. My first thoughts were to exit the truck and head into the woods on the downhill side. That means you would need a bailout bag. Either of those options would probably turn out ok.

    Attempting to engage them would be very difficult to have a positive outcome.

    This situation is one of my bigger fears... Also, last week, 3 BGs in ski masks hit a site at 2am and stole a bunch of stuff. The site had cameras, but it is not known if they were armed. Police were called and were there within 30-45 minutes but they were gone. We just put a policy in place, that if a site goes offline at night and the reason looks like theft, we are going to call the sheriff and try and get an escort...

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    Member Array yoyomeng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimh View Post
    You work for a communications company. A site on top of a mountain just went offline and you are dispatched at 1am. As you are driving up to the site you get in an area where there is no cell service. You come around the corner on the one lane road, and meet another truck head on. About 50 feet in front of you, the passenger gets out and is armed with an ar15 and the driver has a pistol leaning out the window.

    They were at the communications site stealing equipment (which is why the site went offline). You have a ccw with a pistol, but you are alone. The road is narrow and has lots of turns so backing up fast is not an option.

    What do you do?
    Reverse and go back as normally as possible while trying to see if they are getting in their vehicle. If they do then haul a** and call the cops.

    No way I'm trying to play dumb and get around or start talking to them to get around for work.

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    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Bootlegger turnaround... firing out your window as you go....

    Or not...

    That would be a very bad situation... I would hit the brights... exit to the rear stage FAST... and hide hide hide.... I would run thru the briars and run thru the brambles, and run thru the bushes where a rabbit couldn't go!

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    Ex Member Array BikerRN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    Bootlegger turnaround... firing out your window as you go....

    Or not...

    That would be a very bad situation... I would hit the brights... exit to the rear stage FAST... and hide hide hide.... I would run thru the briars and run thru the brambles, and run thru the bushes where a rabbit couldn't go!
    I hope Col. Jackson is with you along the mighty Missisip as you do that.

    Biker

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    Well, you gotta love these scenarios. I'm glad I don't have the responsibilities of doing trouble shooting work at remote sites.

    But, I'll play along...

    As I always carry my Emergency Bag, I'm gonna switch on my high beams, turn off my truck and take the keys, grab my E-Bag and escape from behind my vehicle using it as cover, hopefully without exchanging any gunfire. At my first opportunity I'm off the road and solidly in escape and evasion mode by darting into the wooded area.

    The only time I would engage them would be if they pursued me. However, I would do my best not to. With what I carry in my E-Bag, I can outlast and evade whoever may wish to pursue me.

    In all likelihood, they are going to want to get out of there as soon as possible so I doubt they would be pursing me for very long. If they were just thieves or vandals stealing comm equipment and not part of a terrorist cell, they would likely only try and pursue me for only a hundred yards or so before returning to their vehicle and fleeing.

    My truck has a battery saver device to prevent running the battery down should I leave my headlights or an interior dome light on, so when I can maneuver back to my truck, I hopefully still have transportation available.

    I'd be very cautious after returning to my vehicle to avoid ambush, which may change my plans on just turning around and driving back down the mountain. They may have set up an ambush for me as I try to drive off. Ideally, I would try to call for help from the area I'm at and wait for help to come to me.

    Btw... jimh, If you do that kind of service work at odd hours and in remote areas and don't have an Emergency Bag of some sort, you should get one put together soon.
    -Bark'n
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