Man threatening to "help quiet down" a loud obnoxious toddler scenario

This is a discussion on Man threatening to "help quiet down" a loud obnoxious toddler scenario within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by ep1953 I will not bet my grandson's life on how stupid someone may or may not be. If he threatens my grandson ...

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Thread: Man threatening to "help quiet down" a loud obnoxious toddler scenario

  1. #91
    Distinguished Member Array SpringerXD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ep1953 View Post
    I will not bet my grandson's life on how stupid someone may or may not be. If he threatens my grandson I will place myself between him and my grandson. If he moves toward me I will meet the threat with what force may be necessary.
    Exactly. I don't know him. I know nothing of his intentions. I know nothing of his past, which might be of a criminal nature. There's no way I'll step aside and allow him to physically "correct" my child.

    Granted, if either of my children were young enough to be disruptive in a restaurant, I would have long since taken them outside, but nobody is going to physically handle them.
    "I practice the ancient art of Klik Pao."

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  3. #92
    Member Array BlackBirdCD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shockwave View Post
    I do not understand people who bring their screaming toddlers into dining establishments. There should be a Dante-esque locale for such villains.
    Best response yet.
    Nothing unreal exists

  4. #93
    VIP Member Array First Sgt's Avatar
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    I have already responded on the OP.... With that said, I'd like to say, I've been totally shocked by some of the comments made within this thread. For some of you, it's as if you believe you were born an adult and have never made a wrong move in your life. For others, it's as if you think all children should have attended "Miss Manners School of Etiquette" before they are let out of their jail cell. Then there are those of you, whose arrogance, towards anyone with children, violating YOUR space in a family restaurant and "annoying" you by being a family, should be kicked out and sent to an island by themselves. Your indications that a couple with children should only be allowed to eat at Wendy's, MacDonalds, or Burger King because YOU as a supposedly mature adult are offended by their mere presence, is astonishing. The one thing that I can totally agree upon, is that parenting begins at home and the training continues in public. It is truly an ongoing training experience. There are some folks who are parents, that need to have a refresher on properly executing their own responsibilites as parents, before they try to educate, train, and discipline their own children. I have truly been disappointed in some of my fellow forum members and their responses. The "I'm superior" attitude, because of the lack of children in the home or dislike of children being around them in public places, or belief that because they are now "empty nesters" whose parenting skills were so exemplerary in their time, that no one else knows or has the ability to raise a child, now believe they are OWED peace and quiet whereever they may go, without it interrupting their space/day is so sad. I'm sorry this thread branched out, because some folks, that I once respected based on their posts here, have now caused me to check my own attitude and judgement, due to their arrogant and insensitive remarks. I truly have a bitter taste in my mouth. I guess time will allow me to get over it. Chalk it up to the rant of an old man that tries to be tolerant of others and can sometimes remember from whence I came. This thread has truly been an eye opener... JMO
    Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.

  5. #94
    Member Array Back 40's Avatar
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    +1

    Amen! And well said. I had no idea we had so many bitter members. It really saddens me.

  6. #95
    Member Array gruntingfrog's Avatar
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    Well said, First Sgt. I don't have children, but I recognize that kids are kids and they're part of life. If you don't like being around kids, move to an assisted living center. I think tonight is chicken and green jello night.
    Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face.
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  7. #96
    Member Array CyanLite's Avatar
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    Soooo.... to get us back on topic, I have a few more thoughts on this scenario, and restaurants/bars in general:

    1. Besides WallyWorld, being in a restaurant/bar is the only place that has me in Condition Dark-Yellow at all times, as many sit-down places serve alcohol.
    2. Easy access to several "deadly weapons" at the restaurant table. Steak knives, forks, beer bottles, etc. Combined with alcohol this isn't a good mix.
    3. Many people coming in from the outside but limited number of exits.
    4. Close proximity to other customers, very easy to bump into another patron and have that turn into a fight. Weapon retention and drawing ability can be a problem.
    5. Very high collateral damage potential: lots of people make it very easy to have a legitimate SD encounter and other people end up getting hurt from cross-fire, overpenetration. More civil/criminal liability issues here.

  8. #97
    Member Array ItsMyRight2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shockwave View Post
    I do not understand people who bring their screaming toddlers into dining establishments. There should be a Dante-esque locale for such villains.
    I have to agree. I have had many dining experiences ruined by someones screaming child.Sorry but its true.
    When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.
    The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
    - Thomas Jefferson

  9. #98
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    Anyone else think this thread ran it's course?
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

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    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  10. #99
    Ex Member Array Treo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    Anyone else think this thread ran it's course?
    Several pages ago

  11. #100
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
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    forgive me for not reading the whole thread but you are sitting at a table with a knife, fork, plates, tray, various items in front of you that could very well be used to defend yourself if it is indeed necessary and the first thing that comes to mind is your gun because some idiot has made what is probably a bs threat against your kid?...

    guy comes near my kid hes gonna walk away looking like a silverware porcupine with my chair up his a$$...if i decide not to take him down hand to hand...i'm guessing hes not expecting much resistance cause hes concentrating on the kid...

    and sorry for all you kid haters out there but the noise isnt really so bad and its usually just an outburst here and there...they do make adult living facilities for you guys where young ones arent allowed so you can get your afternoon naps in before the early-bird specials at the local diners...

  12. #101
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    Y'all should be at the local Chucky Cheese!!!!

  13. #102
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    It seems like this thread is running its course.

    If it was me and my boys (who are well behaved) and someone threatened to harm them, I do believe that I could commuicate that attempting to harm my boys is a potentially fatal act.

    As said I would involve the resturant staff first.
    “You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic.”

    ― Robert A. Heinlein,

  14. #103
    VIP Member Array TedBeau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikerRN View Post
    As a patron I should not have to endure the screeching of a child unless I'm in a pre-school or some such place that I will never attend willingly.

    There is a time and place for everything, and a restaurant is not the time, nor the place, to endure such a thing. I think is behooves the parents, breeders, or whatever they want to be called, to remove the offending child quickly and promptly. With that said, I think anyone that threatens violence towards the child needs to also be dealt with. The best way to do that is to alert the staff on duty, as already suggested.

    Too many people run around thinking their child is precious and "special". Maybe to them, but not to me, and I shouldn't be forced to endure typical child behavior in an adult setting. I have no problem complaining about a child's behavior to the same on duty staff, and am not hesitant to do so.

    Biker
    I agree that the parent should take whatever steps neccesary to keep the child under control and not be a nuisence. However the way I interpet the original post the child was making what most people would consider a "normal" or acceptable amount of fuss. Anyone that has had children kows that a toddler is not always going to be completely quiet. They also know that over correcting for one simple loud giggle, or an accidentally dropped piece of silverware is likely to trigger an exchange between parent and child that esculates to the type that requires the child to be removed from the dinning area.
    Sometimes as a parent it wiser to pick your battles.
    I am not condoning letting children run rampet through the resturant, but I refuse to force a two year old to eat an entire meal without making a sound.
    On a side note we were out at a small resturant/ ice cream parlor last week and there was a group there with 4 boys between 4-9 years old. The children were running between tables yelling and crawling on the floor. This continued the entire time we were there.The parents either laughed at the antics or made a few half hearted "shhhhh" sounds. SinceI have raised two children I am used to a little activity from children in a resturant but this was far worse than anything I had seen before. Even then it didn't bother me to the point of moving to a different table. Granted the childrens "base of operations" was several tables from us so we were only on the fringe of the action.

  15. #104
    Senior Member Array Snowman23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ice Man View Post
    To the posters who expect parents to lock their kids in the basement..

    How do you expect parents to teach their children how to act in public if we do not take them in public? I suppose we should isolate them until age 18 and then just release them on the public and hope for the best. Children are part of life and part of our civilization, if they are acting age appropriate... DEAL WITH IT. If it aint a black tie establishment, kids gotta eat too!
    +1,000 This is exactly what I was thinking. I have a 2 year old, my wife and I are very diligent in trying to ensure that he is not a nuissance when in public places. We have a right to go out to eat too....No, I don't take him places that have 300 bottle wine lists, where a quiet experiece is to be expected. Most parents are embarrassed when their kid makes a scene and will do what's necessary to "control" their kids.

    To the OP. I'm with the train of thought to immediately involve management. Anything directed at my child that is physical or even aggressive verbal at close range will have me playing blocker and hoping they don't escalate it to a level they don't want to.

  16. #105
    Member Array Alchemist77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    ... There is no reason that family should not be able to go and eat a good meal other than McDonalds with their family. I don't fault them one bit for doing so. That is much more tolerable than a bunch of cackling women, or folks that show up with a whole bottle of perfume or cologne, or freaking cat hair all over them that makes me sneeze for the rest of the evening.
    I agree. Folks using the term "breeder" in reference to those who have been blessed with children is a bit offensive. I have 5 kids, and it is a tough job. They are not perfect, and do not always behave like little statues in restuarants. However, that doesn't relegate us to fast-food only just to appease the neighbors. After all, we have to tolerate folks expressing their freedom by riding their intentionally obnoxiously loud Harley's on public roads, tolerate folks smoking in public areas being completely ignorant or uncaring about folks with asthma and other sensitivities, live with the fact that a percentage of the population are going to drink too much and do really stupid things like driving, etc. Life in a "free" state necessarily involves some tolerance.

    So, is some jerk intentionally blowing cigarette smoke in the face of a sensitive asthmatic a threat.... yes. Is a drunk behind the wheel a threat..... yes. Can we shoot them...probably not. Is some kid being loud in a resturarant a threat....annoying, but no. Is some selfish smart-butt mouthing off about said kid a threat.... no. But, if said dude approaches within my small child's safety zone with ability, intent, and my reasonable perception of imminent actions to cause serious harm, we have a very serious situation that will be dealt with appropriately....

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