Nowhere to run to...you have to engage! - Page 2

Nowhere to run to...you have to engage!

This is a discussion on Nowhere to run to...you have to engage! within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I donít own a car, but Iím still trying to figure out how a 22 disabled one. Anywise if it did, and i was in ...

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Thread: Nowhere to run to...you have to engage!

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array AlexHassin's Avatar
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    I donít own a car, but Iím still trying to figure out how a 22 disabled one. Anywise if it did, and i was in this situation, I think I would call the cops and sit tight behind a wheel or engine and make shore he did not get closer. Basically play the patience game until, he levees or the cops arrive.


  2. #17
    Member Array GrandBob's Avatar
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    Dude...you're gonna play the "patience game" while he's shooting at ya?

    You got alot more patience than I got.

  3. #18
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    rip my rear door off it's hinges, use it as a riot shield and advance on him... nah... that won't work....

    I know the BG will shoot, not that he can...
    Draw, 911 (open line), cover, observe, wait.

    He will either:

    1. drive off... description of vehicle and direction to 911...

    2. or decide to pursue me... He can not seem to hit a target at distance... probably can't hit a moving target... He shot the wounded man close in... If he comes toward me, shots in his direction may dissuade him... I can't guarantee a hit from the initial distance from behind cover but I will shoot at him. If he's dissuaded, he's back to #1 and so am I... If not, and he continues to advance, odds are tipping in my favor... I can move around my car more as he gets closer... I still have 10-12 rounds left in mag. He has taken several shots from his tube, or mag (let's assume we're now both nearly even as to remaining rounds without reload) ... phone is still open... I can move more while still covering.

    In the end, assuming I have not disuaded his advance, and neither one of us has fired any more rounds, and we are still equal in rounds available... I will rush him... I am more likely to survive his bullets and poor aim, than he is mine. If I am shot first and out of cover... I stop moving right then... assume the best targeting position available to me, and start shooting COM and head until I am out of boolits, or he falls.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  4. #19
    Senior Member Array CowboyColby's Avatar
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    Call 911 and be agood witness.

    J/k Depending on how my vehicle was setting I would take cover behind it and watch his next move looking under my vehicle possibly taking my shot from here if able to. I'm guessing this guy is going to be heading out at his first opportunity if he has already shot someone. I would then sell my pickup the next morning if it can't stand a .22 round and still be operable.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrandBob View Post
    Sounds good in theory.
    I learned a long time ago in some God forsaken desert in the Middle East, if some one is zeroing on you... its time to move.
    I agree. My plan may not be for ____, but I have moved from the trunk where he was shooting to an area with ore cover. Moving further in this scenario means moving straight back from my cover point or being exposed. Tough call either way.

    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyColby View Post
    I would then sell my pickup the next morning if it can't stand a .22 round and still be operable.
    Too right!!! What he said.
    Last edited by JD; August 12th, 2010 at 02:54 PM. Reason: merged posts
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  6. #21
    Member Array carguy2244's Avatar
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    Engage

    Take cover, ducking behind front wheel and engine block, draw weapon, peer around car (peeking over hood is a good way to catch a skimmer to the head).
    I immediately take the shot. He's close enough, inside 30 yards, to take him.

  7. #22
    Member Array OldLincoln's Avatar
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    I may be wrong, but I thought anytime somebody deliberately shoots at you and you have the means to defend yourself yourself you should. Since he has a 22 rifle and shot at you what's to stop him from closing his position and shooting again as you get into the car. I believe I would get behind my car for cover and shoot at him. He's only 30 yds away and well within the range of my handgun. Anybody that practices a bit at 25 yards and hits the target should be able to hit him at 30. If hit, even if he gets away he may need medical attention and be caught. With a body on the ground and holes in your car I'd think that's a good defensive action and you should be okay.

  8. #23
    Member Array CyanLite's Avatar
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    If at all possible, I'd actually retreat to the store (I couldn't visualize the layout from the OP's description). I'd fire enough "cover" rounds to get myself to the store. I'm a sitting duck at the car. Limited visibility, he can easily continue shooting as he approaches me, limited cover. Why move to inside the store?

    1) There are more people there to intercept the bad guy (He can try shooting them all but he'll run out of bullets)
    2) There's more ammo and guns available on the inside of the store (I'll gladly pay for it later)
    3) Video cameras are everywhere in Wal-Mart. If you do have to take this guy down, it'll be recorded and you won't have to worry about the grand jury. You have "retreated" and now you must stop the threat.
    4) Plenty of cover available. Good hiding spots along the aisle.
    5) Rarely would criminals ever come on the INSIDE of an enterprise. They would easily be identified and/or killed.

  9. #24
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    Hunker down or shoot and scoot. Which ever makes the most sense at the time.
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    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... Buffalo Springfield - For What It's Worth

  10. #25
    Senior Member Array AlexHassin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrandBob View Post
    Dude...you're gonna play the "patience game" while he's shooting at ya?

    You got alot more patience than I got.
    In my experience driving around hear requires an extreme amount of patience. I would just remind myself, at lest Iím not in a car in Manhattan on the day the light up that tree in Rockefeller Center.

  11. #26
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    Ok guys should have given more detailed so no one would be confused. He fired 8 rounds from a .22 striking the front quarter panel near the front passenger door in about a three inch grouping he obviously was trying to intimidate you and if he wanted to shoot you he could have.

    If you dont think a .22 will disable a vehicle would be happy to demonstrate. Depending on what year vehicle you are driving one round striking any number of electronic control modules or cutting the right wire under the hood or dash will disable your vehicle. The fiberglass construction of modern vehicles will not stop a .22 round or an icepick for that matter. For those of you who drive older model all steel trucks or cars just to make sure that your vehicle cannot be disabled by gunfire then lets say you left the radio on and the battery is dead, whatever reason the car/truck will not start.

    If you have never seen a Walmart parking lot empty then great substitute Bobs House of All Nights Widgets then the place does not matter. Cyanlite not a problem. Imagine a triangle and you are at the top point. At the two bottom points are the entrances to the store, the grocery portion on one side and the store entrance on the other. Both doors are about equal distance from you, about 40 yards and your vehicle sits about 50 yards from the front of the building. Hope that helps.

    Generally speaking anyone armed with a rifle, even a .22, has a person armed with a handgun outgunned as far as range goes so you either have to attempt to run, outflank or close the distance and directly engage the threat. There have been some good suggestions anything that is semi solid will probably stop a .22, but a .22 will richochet off a solid objects, like pavement, very easily so watch where you position yourself around the vehicle.

    The point of all this guys is to show that in theory there may be a time when you have to engage someone beyond the normal statistical SD distances. Will something like this ever happen lord I hope not but at least you can say you at least you were able to think about it.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  12. #27
    VIP Member Array ctsketch's Avatar
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    He fired 8 rounds from a .22 striking the front quarter panel near the front passenger door in about a three inch grouping he obviously was trying to intimidate you and if he wanted to shoot you he could have.
    Is he an assailant or a exhibition shooter? If he fired 8 rounds and missed me purposefully...he's shooting to intimidate mot kill, meaning...he wants me to get away...or go away...so of course I will.
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  13. #28
    Member Array carguy2244's Avatar
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    If he can group 3 inches off hand, he's to accurate for me to move away from the cover of the vehicle, so I don't see running as an option. If he's shooting to intimidate me, he's accomplished his goal - enough so that I return fire.

  14. #29
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    Find cover and be prepared to move, call 911, stay alert, be prepared to fire if he moves closer.
    I too, have never really spotted an 'empty' Wally World parking lot...they usually don't plan for WW stores in remote areas.
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  15. #30
    Distinguished Member Array pirate's Avatar
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    Obviously you quickly seek cover first. But once again make one very thing clear, a handgun is generally no match for a rifle even if the guy is only an average or less shooter. You have to engage if you have no other option and he closes the distance. If he was just firing at you to intimidate you stay put and call the law.
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