Attacked with a knife or defending with one? - Page 3

Attacked with a knife or defending with one?

This is a discussion on Attacked with a knife or defending with one? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; bsms there is a difference from a charge that starts at 20 feet and contact distance. Yes it would be insane to charge a drawn ...

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Thread: Attacked with a knife or defending with one?

  1. #31
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    bsms there is a difference from a charge that starts at 20 feet and contact distance. Yes it would be insane to charge a drawn gun even at 10 feet or closer but the OP is talking about an attack with the gun in the holster at oh **** distances.
    Guantes is correct the stun gun represents the knife and where you are hit with the stun gun is evaluated as to the damage a real blade could/would have caused. Have not used a stun gun for that but have used jumbo black markers just to show that contact was made.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013


  2. #32
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    Having had to defend against a blade before I used hand to hand until I could bring my firearm into the situation.

    I must be an exception to the rule, because I was moving, deflecting the blade, and drawing my gun all in one motion it seems. What I will tell you is, I GOT LUCKY!

    I don't like relying on luck, but I won't pass it up when it's offered either.

    Biker

  3. #33
    VIP Member Array shockwave's Avatar
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    I'm sure that some BG's practice martial arts as well
    That's a really funny thing, and worth a quick side-note. Pretty much anybody who's spent any time studying martial arts, no matter what style, will tell you that occasionally thugs show up to take classes. I've seen it many times.

    What usually happens is that they attend 2 or 3 times and then quit. And this is why you don't read reports about "ninja/samurai/kung fu masters" out there robbing convenience stores. There's something about the act of training that requires intense self-discipline, and along with that comes respect for others, and a whole bunch of things like that. The thug doesn't want that - he wants to learn some quick-n-EZ moves for beating the crap out of people.

    So martial arts present the criminal with a problem: the more he studies, the less inclined he'll be to continue his wayward ways. It's a very curious thing, but teachers with experience will confirm this if you ask them.

    Another thought on studying knife defense: You do it because you can. Not because you think you'll have super powers to avoid injury in an attack, but you do it because not doing it gives you zero advantages. To those reading at home, you don't need to study with masters - you can practice with a friend in the comfort of your own home. One person gets a neutral object to stand in for a knife, and see if you can find a few things that work. Anything you do to prepare beats doing nothing.
    "It may seem difficult at first, but everything is difficult at first."

  4. #34
    VIP Member Array ctsketch's Avatar
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    A rational knife guy will not try to charge 20 feet and attack a guy holding a gun unless he is suicidal.
    why is everyone assuming someone who is going to attack you with a knife is 20 feet away? most videos of knife attacks i've seen occurred close range...in the bubble and the first stab happened before people knew what was up..same for mugging, they won't present the knife till they are up close and personal.... at close range they will attack you before they even perceive you have a gun.
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  5. #35
    VIP Member Array ctsketch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shockwave View Post
    That's a really funny thing, and worth a quick side-note. Pretty much anybody who's spent any time studying martial arts, no matter what style, will tell you that occasionally thugs show up to take classes. I've seen it many times.

    What usually happens is that they attend 2 or 3 times and then quit. And this is why you don't read reports about "ninja/samurai/kung fu masters" out there robbing convenience stores. There's something about the act of training that requires intense self-discipline, and along with that comes respect for others, and a whole bunch of things like that. The thug doesn't want that - he wants to learn some quick-n-EZ moves for beating the crap out of people.

    So martial arts present the criminal with a problem: the more he studies, the less inclined he'll be to continue his wayward ways. It's a very curious thing, but teachers with experience will confirm this if you ask them.

    Another thought on studying knife defense: You do it because you can. Not because you think you'll have super powers to avoid injury in an attack, but you do it because not doing it gives you zero advantages. To those reading at home, you don't need to study with masters - you can practice with a friend in the comfort of your own home. One person gets a neutral object to stand in for a knife, and see if you can find a few things that work. Anything you do to prepare beats doing nothing.
    I've had some questionable characters in my class
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  6. #36
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    As to my good fortune living in Iowa.. yes... On the other hand, one of my close friends from work was walking home from his shift one frigid morning.. (at 2:30 A.M. (THE FOOL)) and was stabbed, beaten, kicked, and left for dead... Within two blocks of the plant.

    Most criminals who rely on assault tactics.. knife, gun, screwdriver, have no discipline... Might as you mention, show up at a dojo or similar... but learn nothing from the experience.

    I agree with your point that if they stuck around, they might learn the error of their ways... "Martial arts as 12 step program" for recidivists prolly wouldn't be successful though...

    I assume that most knife attacks for the purpose of robbery, begin within about 12 feet... probably less... my co-worker's did. His SA was such that he was able to discern a potential threat as a car was slowing down on the street next to him and draw his little 3" folder. He had it in hand when the frist guy said "gimme." Tunnel vision took over and one of the other three from the car cold cocked him with something from side/behind, and then they all started wailing/kicking and stabbing. My buddy was able to hold onto his knife while on all fours, and through the rest of the onslaught.

    If, instead of unfolding his little folder, he had been press checking even a little kel-tec .380, raised it and fired in answer to the first BG, I'm reasonably certain the whole thing would have gone much differently.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctsketch View Post
    I've had some questionable characters in my class
    A bit off topic, but when I was in Jr High, a kid named Joe was a well known bully. He started studying martial arts so he would be better at beating up other kids. Oddly enough, about 6 months later, word got out that Joe had stepped in to protect another kid from a bully. Last time I saw Joe was near the end of HS. He was doing well in competitions and was one of the nicest guys in the school...

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsms View Post
    A bit off topic, but when I was in Jr High, a kid named Joe was a well known bully. He started studying martial arts so he would be better at beating up other kids. Oddly enough, about 6 months later, word got out that Joe had stepped in to protect another kid from a bully. Last time I saw Joe was near the end of HS. He was doing well in competitions and was one of the nicest guys in the school...
    That's because as previously stated, to actually do well in a true martial art you have to dedicate yourself to it and learn to respect the dojo and the art. Those who are not this way will either learn to be this way or drop out quickly in many cases.
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    As to my good fortune living in Iowa.. yes...
    Good fortune except in January. At least that winter weight clothing should give some protection from a blade.


    On the other hand, one of my close friends from work was walking home from his shift one frigid morning.. (at 2:30 A.M. (THE FOOL)) and was stabbed, beaten, kicked, and left for dead... Within two blocks of the plant.
    Yikes.

    Most criminals who rely on assault tactics.. knife, gun, screwdriver, have no discipline... Might as you mention, show up at a dojo or similar... but learn nothing from the experience.
    Will leave after one or two or get invited to leave. My experience with the MA crowd is fairly limited, but I have yet to see an aggressive unpleasant individual. One of the places I go to is not located where they would attract even middle class students. Most of the kids and young adults are from hard working lower income families. Some are very street tough. But none are anything but mellow and cool kids to be around.

    I agree with your point that if they stuck around, they might learn the error of their ways... "Martial arts as 12 step program" for recidivists prolly wouldn't be successful though...
    Can't fix that problem.

    If, instead of unfolding his little folder, he had been press checking even a little kel-tec .380, raised it and fired in answer to the first BG, I'm reasonably certain the whole thing would have gone much differently.
    Indeed.

  10. #40
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Good fortune except in January. At least that winter weight clothing should give some protection from a blade.
    It was the Carharts that saved Matt... Overalls AND a coat... windchill of -25... The outer garments kept a 6-8" kitchen knife from going through and through.. nicked the lowest rib, missed all vital organs... the other knife wound was in the buttocks...

    Definitely not Samurai/ninja attackers... The usual teen thugs...

    Funny part is the one that couldn't make bail.. wrote letters to his girlfriend from the klink... describing, in detail, the plan (such as it was...) the weapon and the participants... Jail house mail is read by the authorities in and outbound... well disciplined bunch, huh?
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    It was the Carharts that saved Matt... Overalls AND a coat... windchill of -25...
    As a very old -time Cyclone, I learned years ago that my nose freezes up and my eyes stay mostly shut in such conditions. Can't imagine what fools those kids were to even be out looking for trouble in weather like that. Your friend should have had a canteen of water to throw on them. They would have instantly frozen to death in place.

    As for the notes from jail, you didn't say these were smart kids.

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