Employee won't call 9-1-1. I need your help.

This is a discussion on Employee won't call 9-1-1. I need your help. within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I work in a ground floor office building in a downtown urban area. The foot traffic and drive-by traffic over the past 10 years has ...

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Thread: Employee won't call 9-1-1. I need your help.

  1. #1
    Member Array JeffMRC's Avatar
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    Employee won't call 9-1-1. I need your help.

    I work in a ground floor office building in a downtown urban area. The foot traffic and drive-by traffic over the past 10 years has steadily declined in safety. I carry daily and have learned an incredible amount from all of you and refer to this site for guidance when something happens at or near work or home and bothers me enough to think about how I would react in any given situation.

    One of my female employees thinks she is bigger, tougher, faster, and smarter than a bad guy. At 46, daughter of a deceased cop, she weighs maybe 95 lbs at 5'4" and is frail looking. She constantly works late and goes to her car by herself after dark and will sometimes sit in her car, door open or unlocked, and text or talk on the phone. I have warned her several times, coached her, asked her to get some carry lessons and a gun. I even bought her pepper spray but she leaves it in her car or loans it to her 15-year old son.

    She was working alone tonight about 8:00 pm there were a couple cars in the parking lot with a few teenagers/young adults being rowdy. She was sure they were using and dealing drugs. Her office window faces the parking lot but she has shades drawn. When she heard them in the lot she peeks out the shades and they spot her. Pretty soon they're pounding on her window. She didn't call 9-1-1. She waited til she thought they were gone and left the building - they were at the end of the parking lot. She hurries to her Mini Cooper, gets in and locks the door and starts to drive away as they are harassing her. She called the sheriff's office, not 9-1-1 to have them drive by. Now she's mad at the bad guys for being in the parking lot messing around. Knowing the neighborhood crowd I told her she is lucky to be alive.

    Here's what I need some help with: I think if she could view some actual videos of the fierceness of an attack, and the speed and violence that accompanies an attack, she might be convinced of the uneven playing field. I'm not a big guy but I could easily hold her at bay with one arm and dial my cell phone with the opposite hand. Limatunes, she's smaller than you by about 5 - 10 pounds.

    So, some convincing links to videos or audio or sites would be appreciated.
    "I wish I would have done the hard things when they were easier to do."

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Ya can lead a horse to water but ya can't make them drink it
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    Ex Member Array BikerRN's Avatar
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    Some people have to burn their hand on the stove top before they figure out it's hot. Others are smart enough to see someone else burn their hand, and learn from that.

    She won't recognize what she doesn't see, so there is no use in preaching to her, as it would be a waste of time, IMO. Let her life happen, and if she survives and wants advice, she will seek you out. The sad thing is, she may not survive, but that's life.

    Let us know how bad her blisters are.

    Biker

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    "Some people have to burn their hand on the stove top before they figure out it's hot."

    You are absolutely right Biker, and then there are those who burn their hand on the stove top, and then do it again just to make sure that it really burned them the first time.

    Your friend it seems has the attitude "Don't confuse her with facts her mind is made up". The scenario you described should have shook her up enough but sometimes it takes direct action to get the ball rolling. I would search youtube for videos there is always something on there that can be used.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  6. #5
    Ex Member Array EB31's Avatar
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    I'm with Biker and Tac.

    To add, not much more you can do if the person doesn't want help.

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    Distinguished Member Array alachner's Avatar
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    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous... If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for?" [Clint Smith - Thunder Ranch]

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    Distinguished Member Array alachner's Avatar
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    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous... If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for?" [Clint Smith - Thunder Ranch]

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    Distinguished Member Array alachner's Avatar
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    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous... If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for?" [Clint Smith - Thunder Ranch]

  10. #9
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeffMRC View Post
    One of my female employees thinks she is bigger, tougher, faster, and smarter than a bad guy. At 46, daughter of a deceased cop ...
    There's always a bigger fish. Always. Her frightful evening with the would-be harassers in the parking lot show how fragile her "belief" of her invincibility really is. Young adults can feel invincible, for a time. No 46 year old has any business thinking it. It is dangerous to think so.

    Here are some useful links that can help provide a view of just how much crime occurs in the Spokane area. While not graphic images, if nothing else it might help disabuse her of the naive notion that crime happens elsewhere. Reality? It's all around. Welcome to the real world.




    Suggestion: In another week or so, have her read this discussion thread. Hopefully by then there will be numerous useful links to videos, images, crime maps, statistics and other tools that might help show her some of the reality of what is going on in her town.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  11. #10
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    alachner...
    Everyone of those attacking thugs deserves a bullet. That scum does not respect life and the whole group is nothing but a bunch of 'oxygen wasters'...hang 'em high in my book.
    They deserve about as much mercy as they gave the man that were attacking.

    To the OP...
    She WILL eventually get it, but probably through some 'personally expensive' experience. Hopefully, she'll catch on before a serious confrontation.
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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  12. #11
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeffMRC View Post
    I work in a ground floor office building in a downtown urban area. The foot traffic and drive-by traffic over the past 10 years has steadily declined in safety. I carry daily and have learned an incredible amount from all of you and refer to this site for guidance when something happens at or near work or home and bothers me enough to think about how I would react in any given situation.

    One of my female employees thinks she is bigger, tougher, faster, and smarter than a bad guy. At 46, daughter of a deceased cop, she weighs maybe 95 lbs at 5'4" and is frail looking. She constantly works late and goes to her car by herself after dark and will sometimes sit in her car, door open or unlocked, and text or talk on the phone. I have warned her several times, coached her, asked her to get some carry lessons and a gun. I even bought her pepper spray but she leaves it in her car or loans it to her 15-year old son.

    She was working alone tonight about 8:00 pm there were a couple cars in the parking lot with a few teenagers/young adults being rowdy. She was sure they were using and dealing drugs. Her office window faces the parking lot but she has shades drawn. When she heard them in the lot she peeks out the shades and they spot her. Pretty soon they're pounding on her window. She didn't call 9-1-1. She waited til she thought they were gone and left the building - they were at the end of the parking lot. She hurries to her Mini Cooper, gets in and locks the door and starts to drive away as they are harassing her. She called the sheriff's office, not 9-1-1 to have them drive by. Now she's mad at the bad guys for being in the parking lot messing around. Knowing the neighborhood crowd I told her she is lucky to be alive.

    Here's what I need some help with: I think if she could view some actual videos of the fierceness of an attack, and the speed and violence that accompanies an attack, she might be convinced of the uneven playing field. I'm not a big guy but I could easily hold her at bay with one arm and dial my cell phone with the opposite hand. Limatunes, she's smaller than you by about 5 - 10 pounds.

    So, some convincing links to videos or audio or sites would be appreciated.
    Education cures ignorance. You can only show her and talk to her; if she wants to remain ignorant and refuse to learn from some else's experience, tough on her. The BG doesn't care what her daddy was--because he ain't there to protect her, and she doesn't have a lick of sense to take care of herself.

    If she doesn't get it by now, experience is going to be a mean teacher, and hopefully she'll survive to learn the lesson.
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

    martyr is a fancy name for crappy fighter
    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  13. #12
    Member Array AWDeanSr's Avatar
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    I would buy her a personalized shirt that has the word "victim" on it.
    1 Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:



  14. #13
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Portland, Oregon, over the past 12mos. Example CrimeMapper visualization of the incidence of various crimes around the metro area. It allows you to zoom in, get basic details about the crimes (date, time, location).

    Assault - An attack by one person upon another for the purpose of inflicting severe injury. This type of assault usually is accompanied by the use of a weapon or by means likely to produce death or injury.

    Portland -- Assault.jpg


    Burglary - The unlawful entry of a structure (both residential and non-residential) with intent to commit a theft.

    Portland -- Burglary.png


    Homicide - The willful (non-negligent) killing of one human being by another.

    Portland -- Homicide.png


    Rape - The carnal knowledge of a female, forcibly and against her will. Attempts are included.

    Portland -- Rape.png


    Robbery - The taking or attempting to take anything of value from a person or persons by force or threat of force.

    Portland -- Robbery.png


    Theft from Auto - The unlawful taking of motor vehicle contents or parts. Note: Theft from Auto (Car Prowl) is a Larceny. It has been separated from the Larceny category to more easily identify where these crimes occur.

    Portland -- Theft from Auto.jpg


    Nicely, my own neighborhood is well away from the city center, in the 'burbs. My neighborhood+3mi is very light, by comparison. Still, homicides, rapes, robberies, assaults, vehicle thefts, burglaries ... all of these have occurred within that 3mi "bubble." Livin' in the 'burbs well away from the city center in a reasonably good neighborhood isn't an absolute shield. In the past year, alone, there have been well over 100 violent crimes within a 3mi range of my home. (Homicide, rape, robbery, kidnapping, assault.)

    Portland city center + 3mi? Far worse. Spokane, Washington? The criminals are very active there, as well.

    Lesson: Crime occurs nearly everywhere, at some point.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  15. #14
    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    One of my female employees thinks she is bigger, tougher, faster, and smarter than a bad guy. At 46, daughter of a deceased cop, she weighs maybe 95 lbs at 5'4" and is frail looking.
    Wow! I can respect the fight in the individual, but that's ridiculous. It's obvious that she's never really been in a serious altercation and being the daughter of a cop, I'm sure she's heard all kinda of horror stories, so I'm not convinced anything you present her will have much of an affect on her disposition. She seems to have a sense of her mortality, but not much common sense to defend it. IMO, it's similar to trying to turn a anti gun person into a pro gun person. It's near impossible without some type of life changing event taking place to aid in the conversion like being a victim of an armed mugging or robbery. JMO, but it's been my experience that most folks that view themselves as ten foot tall and bullet proof either need to grow out of it on their own, or have the afore mention scenario take place.

    Good luck to you and I applaud your efforts, you seem to be a good friend. My suggestion; Just try to keep an eye out for her when you can and continue to give advise until she ask you to stop, no need to be over protective to someone who is unwilling to defend themselves. Who knows, maybe she learned something that night an is already starting to become more alert and taking precautions when she needs to.

    GBK
    "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luke 22:36

    "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." Thomas Jefferson

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Don't waste your time on her. If she is not interested in her own safety, it doesn't fall on you.

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