This happened to my wife yesterday...

This is a discussion on This happened to my wife yesterday... within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; My wife and my mother-in-law were walking our dogs ( a Border collie and a Shepard mix) close to finishing their walk, 5 houses away ...

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Thread: This happened to my wife yesterday...

  1. #1
    Member Array arffdog875's Avatar
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    This happened to my wife yesterday...

    My wife and my mother-in-law were walking our dogs ( a Border collie and a Shepard mix) close to finishing their walk, 5 houses away from our house the neighbor's son came home opened the garage door and their 80+ lb pitbull came charging out. The kid tackled the dog but was not controlling the dog, the dog was going off the Richter scale and dragging him down the driveway. My wife yelled over and told him to control the dog and take the dog back in the garage! My wife saw the father standing in the garage not helping the son with the dog, at that point when my wife told the kid to control the dog, the father came out of the garage carrying a large wooden stick yelling obscenitys at my wife and mother-in-law telling her my wife had no right telling his son what to do with his dog!. My wife tried to tell him all she wanted was for his son to control the dog! He kept yelling and swinging his stick at my wife from the middle of the street, she continued walking down the street to our house terrified of what else this man is capable of!
    Now she is terrified of even walking down to the mailbox for fear of the crazy man turning his dog loose on her! This Pitbull appears to be a fighter...lots of scars on his face, very aggressive. My wife didn't call 911 for fear of of this raging man coming after her us after the cops visiting him. I am gone most of the day, 5 days a week. If I would have been there when the incident happened, I am positive there would have had a different outcome, but I was not, and now I am concerned for her safety while I am gone.
    I am needing some help, what is the forums thoughts/comments?
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  3. #2
    Distinguished Member Array 21bubba's Avatar
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    Call the law now. This has the potential to get bad real quick. You need to get in front of this right away. Good luck.

  4. #3
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    In the immediate:
    9-1-1
    The dog on it's own unreasonably placed both women in fear.
    The owners inability to control the animal also placed them in real fear. That alone is a call the cops problem.

    The kids crazy father grabbed hold of a stick so as to _weaponize it_ and wielded it as directed toward them with intent, and success, to intimidate; That is a classic definition of _brandishing_ a weapon. Brandishing is not exclusive territory to a firearm or knife.
    This too is well reasonable justification to dial 9-1-1.

    Why did neither woman think to do this?!
    The idea/excuse of not wanting to piss of the raging man makes no sense considering look he's already enraged and for no valid nor reasonable reason, and in a way of reaction that is well inappropriate too.

    Now hours/days later:
    I personally had this been my wife would _still_ call the cops, on both the kid with his clearly out of control dog as well as his crazy man acting dad.
    But I'm not you and don't have to live under your reported conditions.

    Buy your wife AND your MIL each an individual can of quality pepper spray.
    Direct them to keep it at hand when they walk the streets and to not at all think twice about using it on any mother, two or four legged, that might step to them sideways.
    As well buy them de-contamination towelettes to go with it for keeping in their purses/pockets for use on themselves.

    $0.02 Street

    - Janq

    P.S. - It is time for you and your wife & MIL to map out a new as in different dog walking route to avoid what clearly is a dangerous mine field.
    But that is a no brainer I'm sure the three of you thought of on your own.
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  5. #4
    B94
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    Have your wife arm herself if she can handle a gun. Then she can take care of dogs or neighbors. If your wife can't handle a gun either train her or walk the dogs somewhere else.
    PRO-SECOND AMENDMENT - Live Free or Die

  6. #5
    Senior Member Array Tala's Avatar
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    I know for fact that the police won't do much except talk to the guy. There won't even be a report of this talk for a paper trail. Even if you go to the PA yourself to file charges for brandishing, nothing will happen because of the lack of police report. Ask me how I know.


    Just call animal control and anonymously tell them you suspect that dog as being in a dog fight ring because of his face. Describe the dog, his scars, his aggressiveness, and the owner's lack of control. Give your NEIGHBORS address, NOT your own. Use a cell phone that isn't listed in the phone book with your address to make the call and if pressed for your name tell them that you wish to remain anonymous. You are far more likely to see the animal control truck at your neighbor's house than a police cruiser.
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them. -- John Wayne as John B. Books in "The Shootist"

  7. #6
    Senior Member Array deafdave3's Avatar
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    Call the police and request a complaint be filed against the father and the owner of the dog. In the future, if you have to draw on either of them, you have the previous complaint to help you out... a lot.
    A CCW is like a parachute; if you need one, and don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.

  8. #7
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    Jang : has it absolutely correct, I would still call the police and report it..... the guy by swinging the stick and threatening her, is already guilty of assault. If he uses the dog as a threat, that is also assault on the owner.
    I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
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  9. #8
    Ex Member Array EB31's Avatar
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    Call 911. Report neighbor. Deal with consequences later.

  10. #9
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    CALL THE POLICE! Document the date and time you called. 911 should have the record of the call if something does happen. This is a very tough situation. The guy is going to be mad. If you have to, make your wife go somewhere else during the day. Go to harbor frieght and buy some $40 dollar security camera's to record what goes on while your not home. I'm not trying to sound like the world is coming to an end, but you are better off being prepared for a bad encounter with this guy. If he is crazy enough to swing a weapon at her, he can't be too stable. I have personnally seen people do crazy things over their dogs. I suggest that she finds somewhere else to walk.
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  11. #10
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    What Janq and Tala wrote. Not what B94 wrote, at least not until the reports have been made.

    I'm not so sure the police won't take this seriously. It is the word of two frightened women about an enraged male threatening them with a stick. That is more than brandishing in some places, and there are two witnesses. (Bet he has a record of something with the police, PI or DUI at least.)

    The dog story is almost irrelevant. The dog is a potential hazard. The dad is an assaultive maniac who needs some stiff dealing with by the authorities. The son, hey, he was trying, give him a pass.

    Will the guy retaliate if you report? You never know. So B94s suggestion to walk your dog somewhere else is wise. It is also inadequate without the OC suggested by Janq, and if at all possible the arms suggested by B94. But first things first. Don't delay making reports. Note the multiple. To police and animal control.

    G-d made some really crazy people. Chances are this nut was at least partially drunk, taking it out on the dog and the son, and continued his rage on the two ladies. He may be gentle as snow when sober, but he is a one dangerous dude.
    At least get the paper work started, and keep a shoty handy too because he is unpredictable.

    Failure to call the cops out of fear is not going to insure your future peace or freedom from violence. Reporting may not prevent future problems because nuts like that ignore all the warnings, but it will at least set a paper trail that will offer you some legal cover if strong action or not so strong action (OC to the face) needs to be used.

    Oh, as to the anonymous reporting thing, it won't work. The BG knows who he assaulted. He will be able to guess who called when he is visited and the nature of the complaint becomes clear to him.

    Pick up the phone and call the non emergency numbers now.

  12. #11
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    As usual Janq is spot on with his interpretation of the situation and for the course of action to be taken!

    I will say, in addition to the OC spray and leaning how to deploy it properly that it is a shame people must live in fear. I believe in firearms as the best all around method for self defense and that includes obtaining a concealed carry permit.

    However, when the dangers this world has in it, and the thought of personal protection finally comes to the forefront of ones conscious only as the result of being placed in a crisis situation, one is usually finds themselves way behind the curve in addressing those issues. Still, better late than never, eh?

    In the short term, I think Janq has proffered excellent advice. In the long term, I think your wife should wake up! These kinds of dangers have surrounded us all along and since the dawn of time. It's a fact, the world is a dangerous place, and no one is immune from being placed in jeopardy at any point in time no matter where they are. Even within their own home and castle as Dr. Petite and his family in Connecticut found out as a case in point since the trial is just wrapping up and one of the two monsters just today received the death penalty for his heinous acts.

    You've belonged to this gun forum for over a year now. It's time you and your wife sit down and discuss the benefit of having firearms as part of your every day, immediately accessible, emergency life saving gear. She can continue to live in fear, or choose to become empowered and able to be responsible for her own safety. Same goes for your Mother-in Law.

    You mentioned that had you been there, there most certainly been a different outcome. Well, you weren't there. And there is a huge amount of time in any given day you are not there. Your wife is afraid to call the police, your wife is afraid of retaliation, your wife is afraid of a possible dog attack in the future and your wife is afraid of the man who was exhibiting threatening behavior and what he might do in the future. I have to ask... Is your wife comfortable with being afraid, or would she rather live a healthy happy life with the confidence and capability of knowing she can handle threatening situations when you're not there to protect her?

    If she decides she may want to consider warming up to the idea of learning to shoot and being responsible for her own safety, she needs to understand, it's a process. You don't wish for things to be different and then all of a sudden, they are.

    I'm sorry she got the crap scared out of her. It truly was a dangerous situation and could gone very badly. With just the dog attack alone, she could have been permanently crippled, and or disfigured for life and living the rest of her life with chronic pain and nerve damage. Medical bills and multiple reconstructive surgeries can easily top any caps you may have on your insurance policies and dramatic alter your families financial lifestyle and way of life paying for everything. People rarely think through all the likely consequences and possible results of such an act of violence, whether it comes in the form of a dog attack or from a two legged predator leaving you with permanent brain damage and unable to feed yourself for the rest of your life after breaking a bottle or tire iron over the back of your head.

    All things to consider when we delve into the world of self defense, personal protection, how we choose to protect our families (or not), and whether or not we are willing to step up to the task or not.

    Good luck in what happens in the future. I'm glad no one was injured and all turned out okay. But you and your wife need to have some serious discussions on just what you want to do to be safer from this day forward. There are no safe places in this world, and it's time to take the blinders off.
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  13. #12
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    I would most definitely call the police and report the incident.
    You don't specify the distance from your wife the perp was when he was swinging the stick. In any case it appears that there was at least Menacing.
    I would request a report, but it might only result in a log entry and a warning unless your wife is willing to prosecute. I would request the file number of the report if one is written and get the unit number and officer names and record them and the date, so that if there is no report, you will have a reference to the unit log entry.


    18-3-206. Menacing.

    (1) A person commits the crime of menacing if, by any threat or physical action, he or she knowingly places or attempts to place another person in fear of imminent serious bodily injury. Menacing is a class 3 misdemeanor, but, it is a class 5 felony if committed:

    (a) By the use of a deadly weapon or any article used or fashioned in a manner to cause a person to reasonably believe that the article is a deadly weapon; or

    (b) By the person representing verbally or otherwise that he or she is armed with a deadly weapon.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  14. #13
    Senior Member Array Tala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    What Janq and Tala wrote. Not what B94 wrote, at least not until the reports have been made.

    I'm not so sure the police won't take this seriously. It is the word of two frightened women about an enraged male threatening them with a stick. That is more than brandishing in some places, and there are two witnesses. (Bet he has a record of something with the police, PI or DUI at least.)
    I myself have been the "frightened woman" who had disgruntled neighbors (about animal-related problems) banging on my door before 6 am while my graveyard-shift working husband was gone. He threatened me, and also came over another time with a video camera and a large Maglight. The cops talked to him twice, but did not make a written report either time. I went and filed trespassing charges at the PA's office, and attempted to get other things as well as asked about a protective order because of the threatening, but they told me with no police report they couldn't do anything about it. They said they could do "extra patrols" har har har apparently cops in my town are highly allergic to paperwork.
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them. -- John Wayne as John B. Books in "The Shootist"

  15. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tala View Post
    I know for fact that the police won't do much except talk to the guy. There won't even be a report of this talk for a paper trail. Even if you go to the PA yourself to file charges for brandishing, nothing will happen because of the lack of police report. Ask me how I know.
    With all due respect, this is a "your mileage may vary" situation. Sounds like you had a bad experience, but don't assume that your experience applies universally. In my former region in NW Connecticut, the local gendarmes were quite aggressive in taking action against owners of dogs that appeared dangerous.

    Back to afrffdog - hopefully by now your wife and her mom have gotten over the shakes and can rationally address how to proceed with staying safe in your own neighborhood. I would focus on avoiding the neighbor and the scary dog, but then next consider how to deal with him if he can't contain either his anger or his mutt.
    Smitty
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  16. #15
    Senior Member Array Tala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    With all due respect, this is a "your mileage may vary" situation. Sounds like you had a bad experience, but don't assume that your experience applies universally. In my former region in NW Connecticut, the local gendarmes were quite aggressive in taking action against owners of dogs that appeared dangerous.
    You are right. I've simply had it "up to here" with small town "justice" and I forget that not everywhere is as bad as Arkansas or Oklahoma.
    Actually, what I said about calling the animal control is very true. They WOULD do something about the aggressive dog/possible fights. They would at least come check it out. Cops here don't *do* animals, or their owners apparently. However, other jurisdictions may handle things differently.
    I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them. -- John Wayne as John B. Books in "The Shootist"

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