One which I haven't seen posted before. - Page 2

One which I haven't seen posted before.

This is a discussion on One which I haven't seen posted before. within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; One thing I've been thinking about is that I just don't see a Kroger store in the Roanoke valley as being a high priority target ...

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Thread: One which I haven't seen posted before.

  1. #16
    Member Array celticredneck's Avatar
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    One thing I've been thinking about is that I just don't see a Kroger store in the Roanoke valley as being a high priority target for an Al Quaida terrorist, especially in the evening when it isn't crowded, so it was probably just some nutcase. For the leos here, what would you do if you responded to such a call and saw him spraying? Like I said, my first choice would be to get out and call you guys.


  2. #17
    Ex Member Array Kerby's Avatar
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    celticredneck.... Roanoke ???? I am originally from your area (close) Princeton WVA. I have a lot of relitaves in Roanoke....

  3. #18
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by celticredneck View Post
    For the leos here, what would you do if you responded to such a call and saw him spraying? Like I said, my first choice would be to get out and call you guys.
    Attempt to determine from persons there if liquid caustic, etc. Don gas mask brought from field bag and duty helmet, jacket if available, gloves already on. Progress from verbal commands to oc or taser (whatever is available) to hands on, or final option depending on circumstances. Use of other LTL tools if available.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  4. #19
    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    Attempt to determine from persons there if liquid caustic, etc. Don gas mask brought from field bag....
    Are you trying to determine if it's caustic before you decide to don the gas mask? Because I'd put it on no matter what.
    My blog

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  5. #20
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    No, gas mask "will" be worn confronting susp. Attempt to ascertain imformation, such as visible burns on victims, while determining exact position of susp within the location, prior to donning of GM.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  6. #21
    VIP Member Array Old School's Avatar
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    On duty I have many options as Guantes has stated in his post. Off duty my options are limited but I am always carrying a quality pepper spray in addition to my firearm. Calling 911 and identifying myself as an off duty officer and giving as much information as I can to dispatch to assist responding officers would be my first response. If this subject is showing no other weapons but the garden sprayer then a available fire extinguisher or firehose may be a viable arternative to his actions.
    "Violence is seldom the answer, but when it is the answer it is the only answer".

    "A nation of sheep breeds a government of wolves".

    http://www.woundedwarriorproject.org/

  7. #22
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    My reaction would be very different depending on the location of my family. Are they at home? I run away and go out a back door. Are they with me? I have my wife move the kids away to an exit and I set myself up in a position to block him from nearing my family. Once my family is safe then I run away. In this case I would draw my pistol early and let the BG know that any attempt to spray me will be met with violence.
    I havenít heard any of the journalists who volunteered to be waterboarded asking to have their fingernails wrenched out with pliers, or electrodes attached to their genitals.

  8. #23
    Member Array celticredneck's Avatar
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    Kerby, I live in Amelia county. It is my two daughters who live in the Roanoke area.

  9. #24
    Senior Member Array Phillep Harding's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Keep distance. Cover face. If he gets too close plus there is some real sense of harmful intent, not some clown trying to spray perfume or blow bubbles, either run or kick him back.
    If possible, I'd try that. If not, I'm putting a stop to it. Assault with an unknown chemical? With a bunch of suicidal fanatics trying to terrorize people known to be active?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    As for anthrax, it ain't going to happen. That is right at the bottom of any list of possible real life threats in a scene like that one. There is no way for a disorganized non-scientist non-worker in a specialized laboratory could get there hands on the stuff or any biological agent whatsoever.
    I don't see how you have any way of knowing what he is able to do, or where he got whatever he is spraying.

  10. #25
    Member Array ws76133's Avatar
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    My first thought was the exterminator arrived early & realized he screwed up...

  11. #26
    VIP Member Array Sticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by celticredneck View Post
    One thing I've been thinking about is that I just don't see a Kroger store in the Roanoke valley as being a high priority target for an Al Quaida terrorist, especially in the evening when it isn't crowded, so it was probably just some nutcase. For the leos here, what would you do if you responded to such a call and saw him spraying? Like I said, my first choice would be to get out and call you guys.
    This has been somewhat covered in another thread.

    Any type of terrorist attack in Anytown USA, population 50 to 5 million, will have the desired effect if there are casualties once the media gets a hold of it...presuming it is an actual terrorist attack not some wackjob. That more than anything would panic the grass eaters that nowhere is safe.
    Sticks

    Grasseater // Grass~eat~er noun, often attributive \ˈgras-ē-tər\
    A person who is incapable of independent thought; a person who is herd animal-like in behavior; one who cannot distinguish between right and wrong; a foolish person.
    See also Sheep

  12. #27
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    From hazardous spill response training... If you don't have the equipment, get away from the substance... opposite direction. Don't try to save any one that is down because of the "stuff," HAZMAT will be bagging you to the morgue, too.

    Call 911. You have no idea what the stuff is... is it an inhalant, contact poison, or innocuous substance.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  13. #28
    VIP Member Array TedBeau's Avatar
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    Wow scary scenario. There is no way to know what the chemical is. I would retreat and attempt to exit the building to fresh air. If he had me cornered and I had enough distance to warn him off, that I was armed and would shoot if he advanced or atttempted to spray me then that's my choice.
    You have no way of knowing if he's a discruntled customer spraying bottled water that he wasn't allowed to return for a refund, or if he's a true terrorist that has a deadly chemical and a suicide wish since he isn't wearing a gas mask.

  14. #29
    Senior Member Array Phillep Harding's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TedBeau View Post
    (snip) shoot if he advanced or atttempted to spray me then that's my choice.
    You have no way of knowing (snip) or if he's a true terrorist that has a deadly chemical and a suicide wish since he isn't wearing a gas mask.
    IIRC, there is something about a mask. Beside the point; he could be a dupe, told that the spray is harmless or who knows what.

    In any event, there are poisons sufficiently deadly that you don't need a noticeable amount on you for it to kill you, such as saran. Maybe someone with recent military experience could speak up, but I think sarin can be made from a bug poison, and fairly easily, if you don't mind the workers falling over dead. Hydroflouric acid is common (rust remover), I don't know how much trouble that is to purify, but the descriptions here:

    http://www.mnpoison.org/index.asp?pageID=151 had me feeling a bit sick.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    As a civilian? Get out. Every place has a back door.
    Exactly.
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