Re-arming at a friend's house when...

This is a discussion on Re-arming at a friend's house when... within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I understand that alcohol and guns do not mix. So removing it to a safe location is smart, but why unload it? He walked to ...

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  1. #16
    Member Array Sledzep01's Avatar
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    I understand that alcohol and guns do not mix. So removing it to a safe location is smart, but why unload it?
    He walked to the draw and felt (wrongly) that the gun was still safe. Do you think he would have gone to the bedroom where your Wife was sleeping and gone in your bag?
    You mention there are no kids. To me that would have been better than a drawer in the other room. Especially since you were then unarmed the entire night.
    I am not sure a mini safe is needed with no kids and only "trusted" adults.

    Sled

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  3. #17
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    Array gasmitty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trav View Post
    You should have never left it out of your control.
    This.
    Smitty
    NRA Endowment Member

  4. #18
    Distinguished Member Array sniper58's Avatar
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    +1 on a trip to the range.
    +1 on unloading, stowing the mag & loose round & reholstering your weapon.
    Tim
    BE PREPARED - Noah didn't build the Ark when it was raining!
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
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  5. #19
    Member Array crabbys44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sledzep01 View Post
    So removing it to a safe location is smart, but why unload it?

    Sled
    You unload it in case he has a brain fart and handles it. Kind of just like what happened.

    I looked at the gun vault and that seems to be a great option since you can't trust yourself with alcohol and guns.

    Take him and the girls to the range and teach them safety!

    BTW if my gun is not in it's holster or gun safe, the action is always open.

  6. #20
    Senior Member Array EvilMonk's Avatar
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    So...

    I'm adult enough to recognize that part of the problem was my own judgment.

    We used to have a saying: "Good initiative, bad judgment".

    Next time, I'll go Condition 4 (Unchambered, magazine removed) and simply reholster the weapon.

    And yes. Range time is in order.

    Thank you all for your opinions, ideas, and gentle admonitions.

    -EM
    That which does not kill us leaves us broken and bleeding...

    Donít mess with the guy who can barely stand up. His remaining options for self-defense don't include your survival.

    Convenire Volui Spectatus

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rks2 View Post
    but keep it in mind that alcohol and guns don't mix.
    Yeah, I can never get one to dissolve into the other, and which one's the chaser anyway?

    OP, you may want to double check state law. NC has no distinction between loaded and unloaded, in a legal sense. I understand private residence and all, just a thought. I OC at home anyway, takes the legal/alcohol issue out of it.
    I prefer to live dangerously free than safely caged!

    "Our houses are protected by the good Lord and a gun. And you might meet 'em both if you show up here not welcome son." Josh Thompson "Way Out Here"

  8. #22
    Senior Member Array GlockJS's Avatar
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    I understand the logic with unloading and reholstering at someone else's home.

    My question is, those of you who do drink at your own home, do you unload your HD weapon when you drink? Do you all of a sudden place that weapon in the safe? And what is the difference of protecting yourself in your friend's home and your home?
    Glock 26 9mm, Ruger LCR .357mag

    "Protect yourself at all times."

    "Don't forget, incoming fire has the right of way."-Clint Smith

  9. #23
    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlockJS View Post
    I understand the logic with unloading and reholstering at someone else's home.

    My question is, those of you who do drink at your own home, do you unload your HD weapon when you drink? Do you all of a sudden place that weapon in the safe? And what is the difference of protecting yourself in your friend's home and your home?
    Don't unload it, don't put it in the safe either. It stays on my hip. And I have this crazy idea, that if I don't pull it out of the holster it won't go off. Now, if you're going on a bender or have more drinks than usual, then by all means disarm. But having a drink with the wife while watching a movie, not going to do it. Not going to touch it either. I take the holster off, SERPA, and store it in the nightstand like any other night when I go to bed. I prefer judgement calls over absolute rules in cases like this. I quit getting plastered years ago, it started taking too long to recover. Two or three day hangovers will do that to ya. As with other things, YMMV and do what you feel safe doing.
    I prefer to live dangerously free than safely caged!

    "Our houses are protected by the good Lord and a gun. And you might meet 'em both if you show up here not welcome son." Josh Thompson "Way Out Here"

  10. #24
    Senior Member Array GlockJS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chiefjason View Post
    Don't unload it, don't put it in the safe either. It stays on my hip. And I have this crazy idea, that if I don't pull it out of the holster it won't go off. Now, if you're going on a bender or have more drinks than usual, then by all means disarm. But having a drink with the wife while watching a movie, not going to do it. Not going to touch it either. I take the holster off, SERPA, and store it in the nightstand like any other night when I go to bed. I prefer judgement calls over absolute rules in cases like this. I quit getting plastered years ago, it started taking too long to recover. Two or three day hangovers will do that to ya. As with other things, YMMV and do what you feel safe doing.
    I agree with you. My question goes out to all the ones who says to basically make themselves robber friendly when Jack, Jim, or Jose visit the home!
    Glock 26 9mm, Ruger LCR .357mag

    "Protect yourself at all times."

    "Don't forget, incoming fire has the right of way."-Clint Smith

  11. #25
    Distinguished Member Array kelcarry's Avatar
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    Hey Evil: I, for one, appreciate your response to the comments. Hopefully we all learn from everyone's threads and replies. God Bless.

  12. #26
    New Member Array nels's Avatar
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    Thank you for sharing. Your friend does not need training. However, you need, at the very least, a trigger guard.

  13. #27
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvilMonk View Post
    File this under "Carry Scenario":

    I go to my best friend's house from time to time. etc.....
    ......Friends can be a real frightening experience sometimes...
    DO NOT GO OUT AND DRINK LIKE THIS WITH YOUR GUN - AND ESPECIALLY DISARM OR HANDLE THE GUN !

    This is a very serious error on YOUR part. The friend is besides the point, you can't control other people - especially when they and you are drunk or hung over.

    These are GUNS - and you are responsible.

    If you hadn't created and participated in this kind of environment while armed - you wouldn't have had this situation to post. Be thankful it wasn't a worse one you're writing about and take the hint from the one you were in.

  14. #28
    Senior Member Array EvilMonk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamlet View Post
    DO NOT GO OUT AND DRINK LIKE THIS WITH YOUR GUN - AND ESPECIALLY DISARM OR HANDLE THE GUN !
    I appreciate the concern, but perhaps some clarification.

    I brought over a six-pack and almost eight hours later, I left with a two-pack. I drank about one an hour for the first few hours of our conversation. In hindsight, this (at my 235 lbs weight-class) isn't enough to dent my sobriety even though I hardly ever drink at all. I was just not sure how much I was going to drink and how fast, so I attempted to err on the side of caution.

    I made a mistake of which I now know better, but it was not, say again, not an alcohol soaked evening of debauchery (not your implication, I realize).
    That which does not kill us leaves us broken and bleeding...

    Donít mess with the guy who can barely stand up. His remaining options for self-defense don't include your survival.

    Convenire Volui Spectatus

  15. #29
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvilMonk View Post
    I appreciate the concern, but perhaps some clarification.

    I brought over a six-pack and almost eight hours later, I left with a two-pack. I drank about one an hour for the first few hours of our conversation. In hindsight, this (at my 235 lbs weight-class) isn't enough to dent my sobriety even though I hardly ever drink at all. I was just not sure how much I was going to drink and how fast, so I attempted to err on the side of caution.

    I made a mistake of which I now know better, but it was not, say again, not an alcohol soaked evening of debauchery (not your implication, I realize).
    Well, then I took the wrong story out of what you wrote, sorry.
    I'd just be hyper-careful when carrying and staying at someone's place or being around anyone - friend or not - if alcohol is involved. Or maybe take one of those small lockable one-gun transport cases if you do know you're staying over. When you disarm for the night, lock it up and put the case somewhere you maintain some kind of control. That would have prevented your friend from the "almost" you both found yourselves in. Scary..............

    Best

  16. #30
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    I won't reinvent the wheel here, but this cracked me up:

    Tax code arguments have been known to last several hours.
    I've been hunting for some to argue S. 1.368-1(d)(4)(ii) with for a long time. Where ya been?

    Here it is for starters:

    (d) Continuity of business enterprise—(1) General rule. Continuity of business enterprise (COBE) requires that the issuing corporation (P), as defined in paragraph (b) of this section, either continue the target corporation's (T's) historic business or use a significant portion of T's historic business assets in a business. The preceding sentence applies to transactions occurring after January 28, 1998, except that it does not apply to any transaction occurring pursuant to a written agreement which is binding on January 28, 1998, and at all times thereafter. The application of this general rule to certain transactions, such as mergers of holding companies, will depend on all facts and circumstances. The policy underlying this general rule, which is to ensure that reorganizations are limited to readjustments of continuing interests in property under modified corporate form, provides the guidance necessary to make these facts and circumstances determinations.
    (2) Business continuity. (i) The continuity of business enterprise requirement is satisfied if P continues T's historic business. The fact P is in the same line of business as T tends to establish the requisite continuity, but is not alone sufficient.
    (ii) If T has more than one line of business, continuity of business enterprise requires only that P continue a significant line of business.
    (iii) In general, a corporation's historic business is the business it has conducted most recently. However, a corporation's historic business is not one the corporation enters into as part of a plan of reorganization.
    (iv) All facts and circumstances are considered in determining the time when the plan comes into existence and in determining whether a line of business is “significant”.
    (3) Asset continuity. (i) The continuity of business enterprise requirement is satisfied if P uses a significant portion of T's historic business assets in a business.
    (ii) A corporation's historic business assets are the assets used in its historic business. Business assets may include stock and securities and intangible operating assets such as good will, patents, and trademarks, whether or not they have a tax basis.
    (iii) In general, the determination of the portion of a corporation's assets considered “significant” is based on the relative importance of the assets to operation of the business. However, all other facts and circumstances, such as the net fair market value of those assets, will be considered.
    (4) Acquired assets or stock held by members of the qualified group or partnerships. The following rules apply in determining whether the COBE requirement of paragraph (d)(1) of this section is satisfied:
    (i) Businesses and assets of members of a qualified group. The issuing corporation is treated as holding all of the businesses and assets of all of the members of the qualified group, as defined in paragraph (d)(4)(ii) of this section.
    (ii) Qualified group. A qualified group is one or more chains of corporations connected through stock ownership with the issuing corporation, but only if the issuing corporation owns directly stock meeting the requirements of section 368(c) in at least one other corporation, and stock meeting the requirements of section 368(c) in each of the corporations (except the issuing corporation) is owned directly by one of the other corporations.
    Just teasing ya..........

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