7-11 Robbery on Video

This is a discussion on 7-11 Robbery on Video within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; As Chad said, they might be "tune up" jobs....

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  1. #16
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    As Chad said, they might be "tune up" jobs.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

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  3. #17
    Member Array 1911 mike's Avatar
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    When they walked out that door--Game On!!! I would have been at the door as they left and tried to get information, Para Warthog in hand. During the robbery, just lie still putting hand on gun and letting they do there thing...

  4. #18
    Member Array Timezoneguy's Avatar
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    One thing to always keep in mind. If two people are both standing there looking at each other ( with guns), you and the BG, rember this; the BG has already decided long before he saw you what he is willing to do regarding the use of his gun. You on the other hand are forced to react to his movements. You will ALWAYS come in second. Your ONLY chance is ( if you are going to bring your gun into play)is to move undected or by surprise. then the BG is forced to react to your movement. Swift , sure, accurate may level the field. I have never been exposed to anything like the video and hope I never do. I suppose I would do as directed and while on the floor try to get my weapon in hand. Hopefuly no shots would be fired. Once I hear the first shot, and hopefully its not me, I would think engaging the shooter is a must. Huge amount of information to process and endless variables to consider all in 36 seconds. It does not look like a very winable situation for me.
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  5. #19
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timezoneguy
    One thing to always keep in mind. If two people are both standing there looking at each other ( with guns), you and the BG, rember this; the BG has already decided long before he saw you what he is willing to do regarding the use of his gun. You on the other hand are forced to react to his movements. You will ALWAYS come in second. Your ONLY chance is ( if you are going to bring your gun into play)is to move undected or by surprise. then the BG is forced to react to your movement.
    I have to partially disagree with the above. I have also decided what I am willing to do regarding the use of my gun, all that is required to do so is that my criteria are met. I see no difference or advantage between us in that respect, both drawn, nose to nose. In fact, I would suggest, that sometimes the BG is unsure how far he will go, I am not.
    I agree, that stealth or surprise are often your best options.
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    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    I have to partially disagree with the above. I have also decided what I am willing to do regarding the use of my gun, all that is required to do so is that my criteria are met. I see no difference or advantage between us in that respect, both drawn, nose to nose. In fact, I would suggest, that sometimes the BG is unsure how far he will go, I am not.
    I agree, that stealth or surprise are often your best options.
    Agreed, also, when you commit he will have to react. Then its your game.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

  7. #21
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    I have no idea what the two off-camera dirtbags were doing. If it were the perp at the register only, he would have had some surprise lead headed his way. Three on one victim...not good odds. No way to decide...had to be there. Glad all were left alive, but I don't like the dirtbags making 'live or die' decisions.
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  8. #22
    Senior Member Array deafdave3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old School View Post
    If your going to try anything it is going to take more than a 5 shot snub or a .380...
    If you don't mind my asking, what qualifies you to make that statement?
    A CCW is like a parachute; if you need one, and don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.

  9. #23
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old School View Post
    Good point. Maybe they just wanted to keep in practice for bigger and better things.
    Good point.

  10. #24
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    I have to partially disagree with the above. I have also decided what I am willing to do regarding the use of my gun, all that is required to do so is that my criteria are met. I see no difference or advantage between us in that respect, both drawn, nose to nose. In fact, I would suggest, that sometimes the BG is unsure how far he will go, I am not.
    I agree, that stealth or surprise are often your best options.
    I would add that it is not infrequently the case that dirtbags don't expect any resistance whasoever. Resistance can upset their their mental operating mode. But I tend to look at this type of death duel response mode as a very high risk one which ought to have the very high risk overall circumstances to support such a choice.

  11. #25
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timezoneguy View Post
    One thing to always keep in mind. If two people are both standing there looking at each other ( with guns),
    If we arrived at that point in time where we are looking at each other (with guns) I feel pretty sure I will also be pulling the trigger repeatedly. The only logical conclusion is if I don't he will. That's one time I would always rather go first.

  12. #26
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    I agree that it could be a tune up or a practice run. They were certainly well coordinated.

    I suspect we have more info on what the two off camera perps were doing than we give ourselves credit for. At least one was clearly watching and controlling the patrons. The patron on the left moved a couple of times and was pretty obviously told to move back and stay still - he complied. IMHO, at least 1 of the perps was watching the patrons with his weapon already drawn (we saw that on the way in) and probably pointed in the general direction of the patrons (a guess on my part).

    I am not sure what more I could have done than the patrons did. Armed or not, the BGs had the drop on the patrons - period. As for running to the door with gun drawn as they are leaving - well I could see a jury looking at that video and concurring that the threat had ended by then - bad news for the would-be GG.
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  13. #27
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deafdave3 View Post
    If you don't mind my asking, what qualifies you to make that statement?
    Three perps and you with a 5 shot snubbie or a 6 shot 380...It really speaks for itself. Just saying. I think this would be a worse case scenario. You need more, thats all
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

  14. #28
    Member Array Savage206's Avatar
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    hmm I don't know....that was a REALLY fast robbery...unless you see them coming through the door I am not sure there is much you can do. This is a tough one. Be a good witness for sure though.
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  15. #29
    Senior Member Array deafdave3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Three perps and you with a 5 shot snubbie or a 6 shot 380...It really speaks for itself. Just saying. I think this would be a worse case scenario. You need more, thats all
    First of all, not all .380's are six shot. Some are seven, eight, nine, or 10... upwards to 15.

    Secondly, a very close friend of mine, who is a Concealed Carry instructor actually stopped an assassination attempt on his client with just four shots of a .380.

    My apologies, Sir, but I beg to differ: the .380 is not inadequate.

    BUT! In this situation... I would be lying down and hoping they won't hurt me. If I take actions into my own hands, I probably will get hurt. I'm not confident enough of my abilities to take on three professionals.
    A CCW is like a parachute; if you need one, and don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.

  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by deafdave3 View Post
    If you don't mind my asking, what qualifies you to make that statement?
    I frequently carry a 5 shot .357 snubby. While I can shoot it well, having less than 2 rounds per perp would not be a confidence-inspiring situation. I am moving, the perps are moving and even if they did not have the drop on you, it is a gamble taking out 3 perps with 5 shots. It is possible, but in no way is it a certainty. I would not count on having time to reload even with a speed loader.

    If you want to operate under those odds, knock yourself out. It has me rethinking my carry options - not that I think it would have made a difference in this scenario. I can't wait to get my new Black Ops Pro for my Taurus PT-145 Pro. That doubles the rounds and speeds up the reloads.
    It's the Land of Opportunity, not the Land of Entitlements - Vote America!!!

    "When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny." Thomas Jefferson

    You are only paranoid until you are right - then you are a visionary.

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