Do you shoot the robber if he has a toy gun??

This is a discussion on Do you shoot the robber if he has a toy gun?? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; With any kind of robbery to a business, they have this thing called Insurance. So unless this robber is pointing it at me(or a family ...

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Thread: Do you shoot the robber if he has a toy gun??

  1. #76
    Member Array dojoman's Avatar
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    With any kind of robbery to a business, they have this thing called Insurance. So unless this robber is pointing it at me(or a family or friend) and saying he will kill me or whatnot,.....nope, sorry, Mr Shadow(my Ruger LC9) will stay in his home. To me, sometimes with these situations its better for them not to know. Having said that, How do you know that they dont have a real gun? well calling his bluff might make the possible real deal come out...and you made what would of been a minor situation more complicated. I guess its just up to the situation and how you see it at the time.

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  3. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by dojoman View Post
    Having said that, How do you know that they don't have a real gun?
    Well, realistically you don't know 100% if it's a real gun or not. Realistically, you play things out as if it is a real gun.

    However, in this particular scenario, it is made implicitly clear that for this situation you do know with 100% certainty it is a non-functioning toy gun. And so, all my responses are based on that detail within the confines of the scenario.

    In real life, I can assure you, my actions are most certainly going to be much different. I may not even intervene at all. Not unless forced to because of a direct threat leveled at me personally.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  4. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN_Mike View Post
    The story about the soldier on leave in Florida who stopped the bank robber sparked this thought in my mind.

    Say you are standing in line at the bank or a convenience store or somewhere and a guy comes in waving what you recognize as an obvious toy gun. Plastic, an obvious seam from the molding process down the top of the slide, you know, everything just screams "toy gun" to you, a gun savvy person. Maybe the non-gun types in the store/bank have no idea but you KNOW that isn't a real gun. There is no danger that you will be shot if you draw on this guy.

    So what do you do? I'm kind of torn on this because there isn't a real danger, I mean it's a plastic toy gun. But, the guy is obviously a general danger because he is in the frame of mind that he thinks it's OK to commit armed robbery.

    Do you draw and tell him you know his gun is a toy and he is about to get shot and make him wait until the police get there? Or do you just laugh at his stupid butt and tell him you can tell it's a toy (without ever drawing) and shame him out of the business? OR, do you not take the chance at all that he may have a knife or some other weapon, because let's face it, he obviously isn't in a good state of mind if he is willing to try to rob someplace with a toy, and just shoot him?

    What does everyone think?

    **Addition** If you do engage the scum bag and shoot him, do you tell the cops that you thought the gun he had was a toy??
    If I genuinely believe it is a toy, he's going to get the opportunity to be an uncompensated pepper spray taste-tester. Because painted green and crying is a funny way to go to jail

    If there is any iota of doubt in my mind, though, I am just going to be a good witness. Unless he tries herding everyone into a corner or back room. Then, he gets treated as though actually armed - i.e. shot to the ground without warning at the first opportunity.
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  5. #79
    VIP Member Array TedBeau's Avatar
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    We had something simular happen here about a year ago. Two guys force their way into an insurance agents home office. Apparently he does a lot of cash transactions. He shoots one of the guys twice. Turns out both bad guys were carrying air soft guns. Insurance agent gets an "atta boy" from the police.Bad guys each get a few years guest of the state. One gets a few pints of blood at the local hospital first.

  6. #80
    Senior Member Array Tzadik's Avatar
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    Shoot him and then argue that your gun wasn't a real toy.



    On a side note... if it was in a bank it would be a moot point, I wouldn't be carrying.

  7. #81
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    Why not? No law against it in VA.
    Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
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    Guns are like sex and air...its no big deal until YOU can't get any.

  8. #82
    VIP Member Array smolck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN_Mike View Post
    So what do you do?
    Again, I can't overstate the effectiveness of a solid pistol whipping. One of the benefits to carrying a 2.5lb 1911 around with me. And I would probably say something like, "that ain't a gun......THIS is a gun!" (reference to Crocodile Dundee in case you missed it)

    Quote Originally Posted by Tzadik View Post
    On a side note... if it was in a bank it would be a moot point, I wouldn't be carrying.
    Really? Is this a law in VA? I carry in the bank all the time.

  9. #83
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    No law against it in Virginia. I OC in my bank a lot and my investment guru is always interested in what I'm carrying. We step into his office and he checks it out. I'm on another board with the bank president and he has never once shown any concern with my carrying whatsoever.
    Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
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    Guns are like sex and air...its no big deal until YOU can't get any.

  10. #84
    Senior Member Array Tzadik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BugDude View Post
    No law against it in Virginia. .

    I am not a laywer, but my impression was that it was illeagal.

    I will have to check into that. I had always been told that Federally insured banking institutions
    were gun free zones.

    Oh well... life is a continuing education.

  11. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzadik View Post
    I had always been told that Federally insured banking institutions
    were gun free zones.
    FDIC provides insurance to banks against loss. Banks are neither owned or operated by the FDIC or the federal government, with the exception of Federal Reserve Banks which are owned by the government and guns are very much off limits in a Federal Reserve (and that has nothing to do with FDIC).
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  12. #86
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    OP pointed out that the BG is not in the correct frame of mind.That being said there's no telling what else he may do. Even if it is a toy gun he could convince everyone else in the bank that it is real. me,I'm playing cool and quiet until things indicate its time to do something else.
    I would rather die standing up than live life on my knees.

  13. #87
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    Fun To Do: Point. . . Laugh. . . Ask him which Toys-R-Us he bought it from. . . Dial 911.

    Reality: Observe, stay quiet, cooperate, be a good witness.

    Question is. . . Would you tell the police that it was a toy gun?
    Somewhere in the Pacific NW

  14. #88
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    I will shoot any one who try to rob me, armed or disarmed.
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  15. #89
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    I am a civilian. The guy poses no real threat to anyone with a toy gun. It is my job to be the best witness I can be for the police.
    "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain."
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  16. #90
    Member Array gunsite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN_Mike View Post
    The story about the soldier on leave in Florida who stopped the bank robber sparked this thought in my mind.

    Say you are standing in line at the bank or a convenience store or somewhere and a guy comes in waving what you recognize as an obvious toy gun. Plastic, an obvious seam from the molding process down the top of the slide, you know, everything just screams "toy gun" to you, a gun savvy person. Maybe the non-gun types in the store/bank have no idea but you KNOW that isn't a real gun. There is no danger that you will be shot if you draw on this guy.

    So what do you do? I'm kind of torn on this because there isn't a real danger, I mean it's a plastic toy gun. But, the guy is obviously a general danger because he is in the frame of mind that he thinks it's OK to commit armed robbery.

    Do you draw and tell him you know his gun is a toy and he is about to get shot and make him wait until the police get there? Or do you just laugh at his stupid butt and tell him you can tell it's a toy (without ever drawing) and shame him out of the business? OR, do you not take the chance at all that he may have a knife or some other weapon, because let's face it, he obviously isn't in a good state of mind if he is willing to try to rob someplace with a toy, and just shoot him?

    What does everyone think?

    **Addition** If you do engage the scum bag and shoot him, do you tell the cops that you thought the gun he had was a toy??

    Base on your words of KNOWING a Robbery is being committed with a fake gun... there's two ways to look at it, if you shoot, you have to testify you DIDN'T know the GUN was Fake, and the other option and best outcome would be to NOT Shoot since your 100% sure the Gun is fake. Call 911

    Would you shoot a person holding a Gun which had a CORK in the Barrel with a string attached to it that pops-out when you pull the trigger... lol

    Conceal Carry people have to realize they are NOT the Police, carrying a conceal weapon is for personal protection and used when NO other option is available, keep that in mind you and your family will live a long and Happy life. When you draw your weapon....and/or shoot, your whole life changes. Good Luck

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