This murder in my town last night.

This murder in my town last night.

This is a discussion on This murder in my town last night. within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Popular store co-owner killed in Fort Worth robbery | wfaa.com Dallas - Fort Worth Unfortunately, I think this is a situation where carrying a firearm ...

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Array adric22's Avatar
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    This murder in my town last night.

    Popular store co-owner killed in Fort Worth robbery | wfaa.com Dallas - Fort Worth

    Unfortunately, I think this is a situation where carrying a firearm might have done no good. There was no warning and no time to react. Not sure if anyone else was in the store.

    That brings up a question, though. Lets say you were in the store, shopping on a back isle. The guy has already killed the employee, he's digging around in the cash register. You can shoot him, but he isn't paying attention to you. Should you? A week ago I would have said yes. But not sure anymore after what happened to the pharmacist.


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    VIP Member Array Hiram25's Avatar
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    He's already shown no qualms about killing, when he gets done with what he's doing, he strolls around the store looking for something else to take, and finds you, what do you think your chances of him letting you go would be? If I can put him down, he's going!
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    Member Array tomtsr's Avatar
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    The key to intervention is are YOU in imminent danger and since ethe clerk is already dead there is no defense of others claim. You are in the back of the store and have not been detected, I would have to say this is the time to be a good witness.

    If, however, he starts moving around the store, you are now in imminent danger because as James Yeager says, the 2nd killing is free.
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    Member Array MAINE0388's Avatar
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    You dont know if hes dead yet. I think at this point he needs to go down. YOU may not be in imminent danger but do we also know the store and outside is clear. I would have to assume the cashier is still alive or might have even escaped unharmed. I know that I would be ducking in cover once I hear the first shot. Im sure I wouldnt see whats going on. I know someone just walked in and fired upon another citizen so I would do my best to protect myself as well as him even if hes taken a round idk his status till its over.
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    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    If in a position to under the circumstances in this case I would open fire. Justification(s) are easy. This is not like the Oklahoma pharmacist's case.

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    Distinguished Member Array claude clay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomtsr View Post
    The key to intervention is are YOU in imminent danger and since ethe clerk is already dead there is no defense of others claim. You are in the back of the store and have not been detected, I would have to say this is the time to be a good witness.

    If, however, he starts moving around the store, you are now in imminent danger because as James Yeager says, the 2nd killing is free.
    this

    you are not empowered as a law enforcement agent nor as the courts get involved do you have the financial backing of their union.
    you will be in court for a number of years. emotionally draining years. cost you your marriage kind of stress.

    unless the danger is directed and immediate to your loved one or your self...the way the laws are today, firing on the BG may be
    the morally right thing , but is it legally defensible?

    the last thing you ever want to do is shoot someone
    though we train cause it may be the 1st thing we have to do
    its why we carry throw down $ and wallet--cheaper to give em $30 than the lawyers $30,000 and 2 or 3 years of your life as the case winds through the justice system
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    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
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    He is still in the commission of a violent felony, bang, bang, bang.
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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    A week ago I would have said yes. But not sure anymore after what happened to the pharmacist.
    The pharmacist executed an incapacitated robber,This guy just committed a murder and he is a THREAT,I'm gonna move to get a shot from cover and shoot til the threat is over
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    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    He is still in the commission of a violent felony, bang, bang, bang.
    This right here.

    Also being in texas, If im not mistaken you can defend your property and the property of others.
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    VIP Member Array TN_Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adric22 View Post
    Popular store co-owner killed in Fort Worth robbery | wfaa.com Dallas - Fort Worth

    Unfortunately, I think this is a situation where carrying a firearm might have done no good. There was no warning and no time to react. Not sure if anyone else was in the store.

    That brings up a question, though. Lets say you were in the store, shopping on a back isle. The guy has already killed the employee, he's digging around in the cash register. You can shoot him, but he isn't paying attention to you. Should you? A week ago I would have said yes. But not sure anymore after what happened to the pharmacist.
    This is not at all the same situation as the Pharmacist. In this situation, the bad guy has already shot and possibly killed someone. This is completely self defense. So I say yes, I would shoot him as many times as it takes to convince him he is dead.
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    First off your reaction needs to be based on the laws of your state and the circumstances you are in.

    As to what happened to the pharmacist in OKC. He crossed to line from defending himself and co-workers to being judge, jury and executioner. I don't care what state you live in, you cross that line and your going to prison.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomtsr View Post
    The key to intervention is are YOU in imminent danger and since ethe clerk is already dead there is no defense of others claim. You are in the back of the store and have not been detected, I would have to say this is the time to be a good witness.

    If, however, he starts moving around the store, you are now in imminent danger because as James Yeager says, the 2nd killing is free.

    Texas allows the use of lethal force in the case of murder, attempted on myself or attempted/completed on someone else. Mulitple Portions of Section 9.

    Moreover, Texas allows the use of lethal force for aggravated robbery on a third party or myself.

    It is reasonable to conclude perp attempts to murder clerk when he shoots his gun, period. He commits aggravated robbery as well.

    Perp is two for two. How much more legal cover does a Texan need?

    Its legal for a CCH to open fire and neutralize him.

    Do it and fast to get help for the clerk. RIP


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    PS: Its really sad how the son just cant believe how this could happen, how peaceful his father was, yet they own a C-Store. His father had 11 grandchildren who will miss him. :-(
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  13. #13
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    Based upon the facts of this case...Bang, Bang, Bang...Bang, Bang.
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    Member Array The Dark's Avatar
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    I'm thinking, given the facts of the case, the cold-blooded manner of his killing the clerk - apparently no warning, no demands - that I am, with very good reason, in fear for my life and am going to have to take that shot (and serveral more as needed).
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    Senior Member Array Hot Wing's Avatar
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    Take him empty mag or wheel done

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