When would you fire warning shots?

This is a discussion on When would you fire warning shots? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 9MMare Yup, when someone is running off with someone else's child and I cant catch up to them and have no way ...

Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ... 3456789 LastLast
Results 91 to 105 of 132
Like Tree46Likes

Thread: When would you fire warning shots?

  1. #91
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Lansing Mi
    Posts
    6,942
    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    Yup, when someone is running off with someone else's child and I cant catch up to them and have no way to stop them, I may very well take that HUGE risk of hitting a rock in the grass to attempt to stop the kidnapper or get them to drop the kid. As I said, I would appreciate someone doing all they could to save my child.

    Same if a predator(s) is chasing my livestock and I cant get a clean shot. Absolutely.

    Funny, I thought I wrote all this already.
    Or a father sees a man pointing a gun at someone else that you do not see, and picks up his kid (of course the kid freaks) and you put your cape on and start shooting warning shots to stop the father from taking his own child to safety. I guess warning shots are like statistics, if you turn them the right way, youll never be wrong.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #92
    Senior Member Array dripster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    618
    Warning shots are never justified in any scenario. If that weapon gets pulled the bang switch is being applied to stop a threat not scare anyone!
    One more step and it's on!

  4. #93
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Outside Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,309
    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    Got it....you're willing to possibly kill/wound someone else (innocent bystander) by firing your weapon in a negligent manner....but then again, I guess you could make up any scenario to fit your needs.

    Let us know how that works out for you.

    No credible defensive training course/program I am aware of has advocated the use of warning shots--and in fact, discouraged their use...If I am incorrect, please cite a source. This is why there are laws on the books that prohibit discharge of a firearm (with exception of defensive purposes).
    Maybe you should re-read the OP and then my original response.

    The OP asked for examples IF and WHY someone would fire warning shots.

    My original response said I didnt advocate it but could indeed imagine some scenarios.

    And in my kidnap example, I hope you wouldnt think differently if it was your kid being abducted.

    As I mentioned earlier...you make the call based on the circumstances...that includes bystanders, physical surroundings, weighing risks, etc...***just like any other time you fire your weapon***.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  5. #94
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Outside Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,309
    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Or a father sees a man pointing a gun at someone else that you do not see, and picks up his kid (of course the kid freaks) and you put your cape on and start shooting warning shots to stop the father from taking his own child to safety. I guess warning shots are like statistics, if you turn them the right way, youll never be wrong.

    You are assuming things not in evidence (not me). Who the heck said I would ever do such a thing? I am one of the people that posts NOT to do such a thing. I'm sorry if I have to spell out non-relevant details for people that wish to nitpick. If you can find a real issue with my stance, fine. Man up.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  6. #95
    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    4,766
    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    Actually, ricochets happen in "dirt" all the time. Most of the time, no, they do not have the energy to bounce back ALL THE WAY to the shooter and because of geometry they usually end up buried in another part of the berm.

    Ricochets are no small issue and should never be discounted (even in dirt). They happen way more than people think they do and just because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Not to mention it doesn't take a full bullet either.. parts of the jacket or even just parts of broken bullets are enough to cause quite a bit of damage.
    The types of ricochets you are refering to happen when the bullet hits the surface at a low angle for the most part. Oh and the you tube video, at least the one I have seen with the 50 bmg is a spoof I believe where it knocks the guys hat off. There may be others out there though that aren't spoofs.

    I don't believe that a handgun round impacting the dirt at a 45 degree or greater angle is going to present near the issue with ricochets as any type of bullet that hits the dirt while you're shooting in a "down range" direction.

    Of course my assumption (we know what that gets us) is that folks who would use a warning shot into the dirt would be taking that shot very close to them at something close to perpendicular angle to the ground, and not aiming at a distance where the likelyhood of ricochet is very probable.

    BTW, nothing came back out of the dirt berm yesterday when we were trying out the wife's new gun.
    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
    www.ddchl.com
    Texas CHL Instructor
    Texas Hunter Education Instructor
    NRA Instructor

  7. #96
    Senior Moderator
    Array limatunes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    4,247
    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    You are assuming things not in evidence (not me). Who the heck said I would ever do such a thing? I am one of the people that posts NOT to do such a thing. I'm sorry if I have to spell out non-relevant details for people that wish to nitpick. If you can find a real issue with my stance, fine. Man up.
    Time out.

    We're getting close to personal attacks and it doesn't need to go down that road.

    Obviously there are a vast number of people who do not agree with the concept of a warning shot. Can we definitely say what we would do in all scenarios, ever, for all time? No.. because the possibilities are infinite and so are our abilities to respond.

    BUT it is NOT a bad thing to set your mind to rule OUT a possibility that 99 times out of 100 is going to be a bad option.

    I would hope that everyone here would say "Never ever ever" to plenty of scenarios put before them but when push comes to hard shove the impossible can become possible. Does that change the principle or "never!"? Of course not. It simply changes the situation.

    Having the mindset of "I'll never do this" keeps your options limited which, in a life-threatening situation IS good when it comes to gunfights. Sure, in fighting in general you want lots of options but in gunfights it's pretty simple: shoot the bad guy or don't shoot the bad guy. The fewer options you choose to embrace the less you will have to think about "Hmm, should I do this or this or this or this or maybe this or well, there's that, too." Sure, there could be lots of other options.. shooting the chandelier cord and dropping it on the bad guy's head, or whatever.. but for most of us, most of the time we consciously limit ourselves to shoot the bad guy or don't shoot the bad guy because it's the safest bed that conserves the most ammo and keeps us on target.

    As for warning shots, most of us have a "never" mindset. It takes out the guess work of "hmmm... would a warning shot work or be applicable here" where, in the vast majority of cases it will not and could actually be illegal and get you in far more trouble than it's worth. That "never" mindset saves us from possibly choosing option C when it is a bad option. Does that mean option C will NEVER EVER EVER EVER present itself. Not necessarily but I can pretty safely say that it probably never will. Which means it's a moot point.

    The fact of the matter is that options abound. In a gun fight we could all decide to stand stock still and scream at the top of our lungs while we fire shots straight up into the air. We could decide to jump on one foot and recite the Gettysburg address, punctuating each sentence with a shot into the ground. We have those options and we can do whatever we want. But that doesn't make those smart or good options and so we don't sit there and think, "Hmm, when would be it be applicable for me to stand straight and scream at the top of my lungs while firing my gun in the air?" It's not an option because most of the time it would be a bad option and don't want to have to reap those consequences. Can you say with certainty that it would NEVER EVER BE an option? Hey, nothing's impossible right?

    Stoically defending your opinion that you would fire a warning shot does not make it any more of a valid option. It doesn't make it any less of an option either. What I believe most of us find disturbing is that one would so readily embrace it as a viable option when it clearly is not a vast majority of the time. It means one might choose it as an option at the wrong time and end up reaping the consequences (whatever those may be) and forcing others to live with your consequences as well.

  8. #97
    Senior Moderator
    Array limatunes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    4,247
    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    Of course my assumption (we know what that gets us) is that folks who would use a warning shot into the dirt would be taking that shot very close to them at something close to perpendicular angle to the ground, and not aiming at a distance where the likelyhood of ricochet is very probable.

    BTW, nothing came back out of the dirt berm yesterday when we were trying out the wife's new gun.
    No, I wasn't referring to that video in particular, just the number of other ricochet videos you could watch making the point that they do happen... even in dirt.

    Yes, due to geometry/trig/whatever, most of your ricochets happen because of low-angle glances almost like skipping a pebble off of a pond. While your assumption is that people would be smart about their "warning shots" and shoot for what would most probably not cause a ricochet you cannot disregard the possible.

    As stated several times before by many different people, the POSSIBILITIES of something goes wrong are always there and while we're facing enough problems by having to pull our firearms to begin with, why take on the trouble of the POSSIBILITY of messing up a warning shot if it's not necessary and/or negligent or even illegal.

    As I said in my last post.. I've witnessed enough scary and impossible ricochets in my short lifetime to know that they are unpredictable and sometimes even downright amazing and sometimes very painful and/or damaging.

  9. #98
    Member Array tomtsr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    186
    I dug a 9mm slug out of my shoulder due to a ricochet that was at nearly 90 degrees shot by someone next to me. He hit a rock and next thing I knew, I was bleeding.

    No warning shots, ever.
    Train like your life depends on it, because it does.

    NRA Life Member

  10. #99
    VIP Member
    Array Thumper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    7,228
    I'm also not inclined to ever fire a warning shot. If my weapon comes out, it's because threat to life is imminent.

    Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk
    ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!

    "A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
    judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
    superior skills."

  11. #100
    GM
    GM is offline
    VIP Member Array GM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    6,866
    No warning shots here
    "The Second Amendment: America's Original Homeland Security"

  12. #101
    Member Array ISR MATRIX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    SW Florida
    Posts
    51

    From an LEO perspective

    Quote Originally Posted by Snider View Post
    You didn't specify whether the individual was armed or not, so I'll assume he was unarmed, intoxicated and walking towards your officer friend. Ninja/taser stuff aside, how does this constitute a need to draw, let alone fire on the suspect? I'm no LEO, but I would be appalled to hear that an officer shot and killed an unarmed man who was walking toward him.
    In the case above, we have to remember that cops are not stuntmen or rodeo clowns or Master Ninjas. Based on certain "officer/subject factors" such as size, indication of stimulant drug influence, indication of propensity for violence, etc. (absent actual weapons), an officer might be justified in drawing a firearm on an otherwise "unarmed" subject. I work with some people who are in their 50's have an accumulation of work related injuries over the years. When faced with the threat of a a 20 year old "unarmed" drugged up whacko coming at them threateningly, I would not want them to get beaten up, disarmed and/or killed because they were worried about a policy.

    Police are held to a standard of "objective reasonableness" and their actions will be held up against their training and experience and ultimately what another reasonable officer might do under the same circumstances... not necessarily what someone might see as appropriate with the luxury of 20/20 hindsight.

    Many agencies have policies against firing warning shots but these policies simply serve as general guidelines in general circumstances. Tense, uncertain and rapidly evolving circumstances may justify actions that violate policy if they are found to be "objectively reasonable". We are taught to not fire warning shots for the reasons that I mentioned before... but in some rare circumstances, we MIGHT take that chance if we reasonably believe that the warning shot may get us out of having to shoot someone. We might take that chance and deal with the consequences later.

    Every officer, just like every citizen will have his or her own threshold for use of deadly force. Some virtual "line in the sand" that will tell them that there is no alternative to pulling the trigger. Cops are different in that they receive a lot of training and tend to draw their guns more frequently than their armed citizen counterparts... but they all have to face those demons.

    Remember, as an armed citizen every confrontation is an armed confrontation because there is always at least one gun... yours.

  13. #102
    Senior Member Array Hot Wing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Melbourne Florida
    Posts
    688
    Quote Originally Posted by WHEC724 View Post
    A warning shot means that I missed.
    Me too

  14. #103
    VIP Member Array TN_Mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Shelby County TN
    Posts
    11,102
    Quote Originally Posted by tomtsr View Post
    When would you fire warning shots?
    That's a simple question to answer. Never.
    ,=====o00o _
    //___l__,\____\,__
    l_--- \___l---[]lllllll[]
    (o)_)-o- (o)_)--o-)_)

  15. #104
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Outside Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,309
    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    Time out.

    We're getting close to personal attacks and it doesn't need to go down that road.

    Obviously there are a vast number of people who do not agree with the concept of a warning shot. Can we definitely say what we would do in all scenarios, ever, for all time? No.. because the possibilities are infinite and so are our abilities to respond.

    BUT it is NOT a bad thing to set your mind to rule OUT a possibility that 99 times out of 100 is going to be a bad option.

    I would hope that everyone here would say "Never ever ever" to plenty of scenarios put before them but when push comes to hard shove the impossible can become possible. Does that change the principle or "never!"? Of course not. It simply changes the situation.

    Having the mindset of "I'll never do this" keeps your options limited which, in a life-threatening situation IS good when it comes to gunfights. Sure, in fighting in general you want lots of options but in gunfights it's pretty simple: shoot the bad guy or don't shoot the bad guy. The fewer options you choose to embrace the less you will have to think about "Hmm, should I do this or this or this or this or maybe this or well, there's that, too." Sure, there could be lots of other options.. shooting the chandelier cord and dropping it on the bad guy's head, or whatever.. but for most of us, most of the time we consciously limit ourselves to shoot the bad guy or don't shoot the bad guy because it's the safest bed that conserves the most ammo and keeps us on target.

    As for warning shots, most of us have a "never" mindset. It takes out the guess work of "hmmm... would a warning shot work or be applicable here" where, in the vast majority of cases it will not and could actually be illegal and get you in far more trouble than it's worth. That "never" mindset saves us from possibly choosing option C when it is a bad option. Does that mean option C will NEVER EVER EVER EVER present itself. Not necessarily but I can pretty safely say that it probably never will. Which means it's a moot point.

    The fact of the matter is that options abound. In a gun fight we could all decide to stand stock still and scream at the top of our lungs while we fire shots straight up into the air. We could decide to jump on one foot and recite the Gettysburg address, punctuating each sentence with a shot into the ground. We have those options and we can do whatever we want. But that doesn't make those smart or good options and so we don't sit there and think, "Hmm, when would be it be applicable for me to stand straight and scream at the top of my lungs while firing my gun in the air?" It's not an option because most of the time it would be a bad option and don't want to have to reap those consequences. Can you say with certainty that it would NEVER EVER BE an option? Hey, nothing's impossible right?

    Stoically defending your opinion that you would fire a warning shot does not make it any more of a valid option. It doesn't make it any less of an option either. What I believe most of us find disturbing is that one would so readily embrace it as a viable option when it clearly is not a vast majority of the time. It means one might choose it as an option at the wrong time and end up reaping the consequences (whatever those may be) and forcing others to live with your consequences as well.

    Wow, I disagree with almost every single paragraph you wrote.

    Esp where you seem to imply that I readily embrace warning shots as a viable option in self-defense shooting. I clearly stated I did not in my first post.

    As I just wrote *sigh*...I answered the OP's questions where he asked for examples. He didnt ask how common such examples might occur.

    People seem to be so blinded to their own opinions that they completely reject being prepared for things outside of the box. So be it....I dont think that the general public is at more risk because of people NEVER firing warning shots. That's a good thing that so many are restraining themselves.

    So, no attacks from me...and I wont be offended that people just assume I would fire warning shots with less consideration for surroundings than I would if I fired at a threat.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  16. #105
    VIP Member
    Array ppkheat's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Louisiana
    Posts
    4,064
    Quote Originally Posted by 9MMare View Post
    People seem to be so blinded to their own opinions that they completely reject being prepared for things outside of the box.
    Very good point. A LOT of emphasis here has been put on the hazards/liability of that traveling bullet someone used for a warning shot; I think the same concerns can be said (it's not often discussed) about the hazards/liability of that bullet that traveled through or completely missed the BG.

    As stated earlier I'm no advocate of warning shots, but what happens and how we process our thoughts can be much different under extreme stress vs. calmly typing our thoughts on the computer.
    Turn the election's in 2014 to a "2A Revolution". It will serve as a 1994 refresher not to "infringe" on our Second Amendment. We know who they are now.........SEND 'EM HOME. Our success in this will be proportional to how hard we work to make it happen.

Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ... 3456789 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

are warning shots illegal

,
can i fire a warning short in florida
,

can you fire a warning shot

,

firing warning shots illegal

,

is it illegal to fire a warning shot

,

is it legal to fire a warning shot

,
is it legal to fire warning shots
,
ny state for firing 4 warning shots
,
should you fire a warning shot
,
warning shot illegal
,
warning shots are illegal
,

warning shots illegal

Click on a term to search for related topics.