Road Rage (Real Incident + Video) - Page 3

Road Rage (Real Incident + Video)

This is a discussion on Road Rage (Real Incident + Video) within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Billspider How do you know the attacker is unarmed. Do you know how many people have died from a blow to the ...

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  1. #31
    Senior Member Array Bubbiesdad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billspider View Post
    How do you know the attacker is unarmed.
    Do you know how many people have died from a blow to the throat?
    In either Florida or Utah as long as the attacker crossed the threshold of the vehicle the attacked would be protected by state law if he used deadly force.

    Let me make this clear I wouldn't have used deadly force in this situation. I am just stating state law
    Well this wasn't Utah or Florida. Neither was the person I quoted who said THEY WOULD SHOOT and not wait to find out if the person was armed.
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  2. #32
    Member Array Billspider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bubbiesdad View Post
    Well this wasn't Utah or Florida. Neither was the person I quoted who said THEY WOULD SHOOT and not wait to find out if the person was armed.
    You are right, sorry I missed that.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Array adric22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azchevy View Post
    If he hit me, I would have accidentally moved my foot from the brake to the accelerator and ran his bike over
    Well, that is the last thing I'd do.. I care a lot more about my car than I do about his bike.
    "Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws." -Plato

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billspider View Post
    The motorcyclist commited a felony.
    Assaults can become a felony, but it really depends on the seriousness of the injury. I can assure that in most jurisdictions, simple assault, (those which leave no lasting injury) and I can bet it didn't even bloody the guys nose, is almost certainly a misdemeanor.

    The motorist never missed a beat after getting punched and was able to continue driving and made no comments regarding a serious injury.

    If every one who ever shoved, slapped or popped someone on the chin was convicted of a felony, there would be a prison in every neighborhood.

    If you're referring to castle doctrine inside a vehicle, that's going to be a big stretch since the driver escalated the situation.
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  5. #35
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by adric22 View Post
    Well, that is the last thing I'd do.. I care a lot more about my car than I do about his bike.
    caring about inanimate objects is strange

  6. #36
    VIP Member Array rammerjammer's Avatar
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    Idiot driver almost took out a bicyclist and a motorcyclist in one instance of crappy inattentive driving.

    The biker never should.have gotten off his bike and assaulted the driver. Up until that moment he was in the right.
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  7. #37
    Member Array Billspider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    Assaults can become a felony, but it really depends on the seriousness of the injury. I can assure that in most jurisdictions, simple assault, (those which leave no lasting injury) and I can bet it didn't even bloody the guys nose, is almost certainly a misdemeanor.

    The motorist never missed a beat after getting punched and was able to continue driving and made no comments regarding a serious injury.

    If every one who ever shoved, slapped or popped someone on the chin was convicted of a felony, there would be a prison in every neighborhood.



    If you're referring to castle doctrine inside a vehicle, that's going to be a big stretch since the driver escalated the situation.
    There is no escalation defense once you pass the threshold of either home or vehicle. You can not cross the line from verbal to physical stating you were provoked by words unless you want to be laughed out of court. The court might accept that, if you were 12 but not by an alleged grown, mature man.

    You are right about the charge whether it be a felony or misdemeanor.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billspider View Post
    There is no escalation defense once you pass the threshold of either home or vehicle. You can not cross the line from verbal to physical stating you were provoked by words unless you want to be laughed out of court. The court might accept that, if you were 12 but not by an alleged grown, mature man.

    You are right about the charge whether it be a felony or misdemeanor.
    Well, you may get away with it. I dunno, maybe I would get away with it. I just can't wrap my mind around shooting everyone who comes up to me and yells Boo! And then maybe giving me a punch in the nose. To me it's kind of like shooting someone in the back. And I don't plan on being a test case.
    -Bark'n
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  9. #39
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    All I saw was a whole lot of stupid on both sides.
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  10. #40
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    What I would have done differently is this, first I would have been paying better attention as a driver. I always scan ahead of me to make sure I know what is going on. IF I made the mistake of pulling in to the lane of a motorcycle I would have apologized and then dropped it.

    I think this guy in the car was trying to show out for his girl. I personally don't need to show off for my Wife, she knows I'm awesome already; plus she would call me on it as soon as I started acting like a fool.

    If I did that and apologized and then the biker looked at me cross ways again, like at the stop light, I would have simply waved as to say "dude, really I apologize." I don't have pride issues and can drop things like that.

    Now, for whatever reason all of this happened and the guy still came up to my window and assaulted me, I'd deal with it swiftly using as much violence as the situation required. But I doubt it would have ever started, again I scan ahead to make sure I know what is going on.
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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paco View Post
    What I would have done differently is this, first I would have been paying better attention as a driver. I always scan ahead of me to make sure I know what is going on. IF I made the mistake of pulling in to the lane of a motorcycle I would have apologized and then dropped it.

    I think this guy in the car was trying to show out for his girl. I personally don't need to show off for my Wife, she knows I'm awesome already; plus she would call me on it as soon as I started acting like a fool.

    If I did that and apologized and then the biker looked at me cross ways again, like at the stop light, I would have simply waved as to say "dude, really I apologize." I don't have pride issues and can drop things like that.

    Now, for whatever reason all of this happened and the guy still came up to my window and assaulted me, I'd deal with it swiftly using as much violence as the situation required. But I doubt it would have ever started, again I scan ahead to make sure I know what is going on.
    I like that, Paco. I also have learned the lost art of apologizing when I've done something dumb in traffic.
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  12. #42
    Distinguished Member Array 21bubba's Avatar
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    I think the guy driving the car and the the guy on the motorcycle should have waited for the guy on the bicycle to catch up and then kicked his butt.
    Last edited by Paco; July 29th, 2011 at 09:06 PM. Reason: language
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  13. #43
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    Car was wrong for crossing over into bikes lane. He should have slowed for the bicyclist and stayed in his own lane and only moved over after it was clear to do so. Bike rider was wrong for assaulting the driver of the car. Two wrongs don't make a right, but as I see it, the car driver should have called the cops, gave them the tag number, and filed assault charges on him. He has the proof on video.
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  14. #44
    VIP Member Array shockwave's Avatar
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    I noticed a Canadian flag so It looks like this could have happened in Canada.
    Also, did you notice how the driver phrased his question to the biker? He said, "Did you not see the ..." That's Canadian, as any American would have said, "Didn't you see the..."

    As for justification for shooting, a major problem is going to be the "reasonable person" test. There's a biker in front of you. He is angry that you almost clipped him in traffic because you weren't paying attention. He yelled at you for almost hitting him. Then, in a fit of utter stupidity, you start yelling back at him.

    So he gets off his bike and comes back to your car. You could roll up your window, take evasive action, etc. But failing all that, the guy pops you one.

    Up to this point, we have a standard case of mild road rage. The "in fear for my life" standard has not been met. Biker pulling a weapon, biker making a sustained assault, biker adding language to assault, that could start to get you there.

    And this has been another edition of: "Hey, can I shoot him now? Is it OK to shoot him? Can I? Please?"
    "It may seem difficult at first, but everything is difficult at first."

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by shockwave View Post
    Also, did you notice how the driver phrased his question to the biker? He said, "Did you not see the ..." That's Canadian, as any American would have said, "Didn't you see the..."

    As for justification for shooting, a major problem is going to be the "reasonable person" test. There's a biker in front of you. He is angry that you almost clipped him in traffic because you weren't paying attention. He yelled at you for almost hitting him. Then, in a fit of utter stupidity, you start yelling back at him.

    So he gets off his bike and comes back to your car. You could roll up your window, take evasive action, etc. But failing all that, the guy pops you one.

    Up to this point, we have a standard case of mild road rage. The "in fear for my life" standard has not been met. Biker pulling a weapon, biker making a sustained assault, biker adding language to assault, that could start to get you there.

    And this has been another edition of: "Hey, can I shoot him now? Is it OK to shoot him? Can I? Please?"
    You are correct. However, under Florida law, as soon as the individual unlawfully enters your vehicle the use of deadly force is presumed to be reasonable.

    It's a case of just because a thing can be done not meaning it should be done.

    Matt
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