Disparity of Force - When Does It Swing? - Page 2

Disparity of Force - When Does It Swing?

This is a discussion on Disparity of Force - When Does It Swing? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Forget all this stuff and "disparity" too. Assault & battery is pretty much the same anywhere. No 98 lb. woman (or anyone else) has any ...

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Thread: Disparity of Force - When Does It Swing?

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array OldVet's Avatar
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    Hiding inside a bottle of Jim Beam Black in S. FL.
    Forget all this stuff and "disparity" too. Assault & battery is pretty much the same anywhere. No 98 lb. woman (or anyone else) has any legal right to assault and batter anyone, regardless of height and weight.

    Research and go with what your state statutes say in regards to assaults, deadly weapons, and personal defense.

    And as for being a "bouncer," I put that job in the same catagory as repo agents and EOD specialists: Don't go in expecting the outcome will always be in your favor!
    Retired USAF E-8. Curmudgeon at large.
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    Paranoia strikes deep, into your life it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... Buffalo Springfield - For What It's Worth

  2. #17
    Senior Member Array sjones's Avatar
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    I'm a small man,5ft5 and 150lbs+ I'm 67.I'm not taking a butt whipping from anybody,if they try,they are dead,simple as that.

  3. #18
    Ex Member Array Yankeejib's Avatar
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    Nov 2009
    Tampa, FL
    Self defense shootings are typically judged by AOJP. It can solve nearly every "what if" scenario:
    Ability: does the attacker have the ability to cause you IMMEDIATE grave injury? Weapons presented as well as preponderance or disparity of force comes into play here. A grown man threatening a smaller woman would qualify. Four teens threatening to beat you up would qualify. A 90 year old man threatening to beat an 18 year old up would not. Someone waving a knife and calling you out across the street would not qualify. Someone pointing a gun at you from across the street would qualify.
    Opportunity: does the attacker have the opportunity to cause you IMMEDIATE grave injury. Proximity comes into play here as well as the type of weapon. Again, the threat must be immediate. Someone comes up and puts a gun in your face, they are an immediate danger. They take your wallet and run, they're not an immediate danger at this point.
    Jeopardy: if you do nothing, will you suffer injury or possible death? Is your life hanging in the balance between action and no action?
    Preclusion: did you do everything in your power to avoid or de-escalate the situation? Kinda hard to call someone out and then shoot them and prove preclusion. Some states even have the obligation to retreat from a threat before you can shoot. A bouncer following a customer outside would have a difficult time with this.

    You might consult an attorney. I've just seen too many incidents of bouncers going beyond the limits of their job and getting arrested/convicted/ and sued beyond your life earnings. I would think your employer would have a pretty cast iron employment contract that outlines what you can or can't do, so that if you exceed your limits, it's on you and not their insurance company. If you're a big dude, and you seem to have a keen mind, you would do well to use words to influence others more than brute force. Some mental case on whatever jacked up drugs she/he's on might be sorely deserving a whack, until they go into cardiac arrest at your feet, and you find yourself facing a manslaughter charge, jail time, and a civil suit filed by the vic's family.
    varob likes this.

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  5. #19
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    Array WHEC724's Avatar
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    It's all fun and games until someone demonstrates the ability and intent to kill me.
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  6. #20
    Member Array localgirl's Avatar
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    Jun 2011
    Sandpoint, Idaho
    Worst case scenario is you end up having to explain yourself in a court of law. If you have the luxury of a few seconds to react, think of this possible scenario.

    Generally, with someone much smaller than you, and barring the immediate need to react, such as them rushing you with a firearm or knife, I say use your size to deflect, block, and even shove. Not too many people are going to excoriate you for pushing down a little lady if you've made it clear she was pummeling you. After that point, once you have made it clear you do not want to be touched or further antagonized, and especially if you have witnesses, you would be justified in using more extreme force.

    The circumstances, however unfair it might be, are going to make it less defensible for you to use deadly force. Being in fear for your life is simply more understandable when a big, scary man in a dark alley comes at you, versus a tiny woman in a well-lit place.

    Sometimes life sucks being a wee female, but it does have its advantages when it comes time to defend your actions against aggressors.

  7. #21
    Member Array BigRay's Avatar
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    Jun 2011
    Very interesting thread!
    A couple of years ago, I was 6'3" and 295 lbs, and never gave much thought to being bigger and stronger than most. Then a little run-in with a Chevy 4X4 on my KLR 650 in April, 2010, suddenly put me on the other side of the equation. The one thing that did not change for me — even while going from healthy and strong as an ox to permanently disabled — are the legal requirements for use of deadly force in my state.

    Springfield TRP Armory Kote, Springfield Trophy Match, Sig Sauer P220R SAO, Glock 35 with Heinie Slant Pro sights, Springfield Armory XDs 45, S&W Model 29 Mountain Gun, PTR-91F in 7.62mm NATO, Springfield M1A1, Sig 556 Patrol Rifle and Benelli M2 with 10-round magazine

  8. #22
    Distinguished Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    Disparity of force can sometimes be fickle, but with thought it can be dealt with.

    In the case of the smaller woman trying to beat on you. Do not strike her, do not grab her, merely block her attempts to strike, scratch you. In that case you actions are strictly defensive with no offensive connotations and if done correctly will be sufficiently unpleasant that it is likely that she will either stop her actions or escalate to where you may take more positive actions.

    The use of a stick or knife by them give you considerably more latitude in defensive/offensive actions as the threat becomes more of a lethal threat.
    This would probably be my initial reaction to.

  9. #23
    Distinguished Member Array ArkhmAsylm's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    St. Paul, Minnesota
    Block, jab, pepper spray.

    Unless you see a dangerous weapon & are in fear for your life, the firearm should stay holstered IMO.
    "Historical examination of the right to bear arms, from English antecedents to the drafting of the Second Amendment, bears proof that the right to bear arms has consistently been, and should still be, construed as an individual right." -- U.S. District Judge Sam Cummings, Re: U.S. vs Emerson (1999)

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