This isnt even funny anymore, time for a career change.

This is a discussion on This isnt even funny anymore, time for a career change. within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; First I'd like to thank you for service to the criminal justice system. Good attorneys are IME few and far between. I think you should ...

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Thread: This isnt even funny anymore, time for a career change.

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Secret Spuk's Avatar
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    First I'd like to thank you for service to the criminal justice system. Good attorneys are IME few and far between.

    I think you should take this extremely serious. In my humble opinion... the incidents seem to be esclating. The latest incident with someone on your property. With the information you've given I believe this to have been a probe of your reaction, reaction time, and defense capability. As everyone else suggested I think you should document these incidents with the police. Record any threatening calls. Notify the Judge in the trial part of your ongoing issues.

    Tacticaly speaking ... some great suggestions from the members. My tactical advice would be to get a small revolver that you can keep in hand, and hidden, when entering or leaving your home... Carried in addition to your regular autoloader. The advice about the shotgun is priceless IMO. Nothing says "maybe I should reconsider" like the sound of a pump gun being cycled. Being a gun nut I tend to see a firearm as a valid soloution to a lot of problems... But sometimes the option of a firearm is the best soloution

    A dog and or a camera are great... but they are easily dealt with by a professional. The whole idea of yhese folks doing reconisance(sp) at your home... That kind of un nerves me.

    Good Luck!
    Spuk!

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  3. #32
    Ex Member Array MadMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xsigma40cal View Post
    Ok, if you all followed my last post, I helped a free-lance client of mine on a pro-bono assignment of putting her ex in jail for nearly killing her. In turn, one of the ex's buddy's approached me in a bar and made his presence known with hostile over-tones.
    Lots of "squishy" words in there: client is "free-lance", you are working for her pro bono, she's "nearly" killed. You're approached while drinking in a bar by one the perp's friends. Sounds like the opening chapter for a new Elmore Leonard novel.

    Here's another classic movie line: "Guys are always suckers for a dame." It's a story as old as time.

    If you're both working off-the-books, it's going to look suspiciously like romance is the glue in a possible love triangle, and your professional ethics can get called in to question. Add in an angry ex-paramour with nasty friends who comes to your watering hole, and you're looking at the trifecta of the Rule of 3 Stupids. That's what I read into your little essay. I may be completely off-base, and I realize you purposely wrote it to disguise the players.
    --------

    "She was married when we first met,
    Soon to be divorced.
    I helped her out of a jam, I guess,
    But I used a little too much force."

    ~Bob Dylan

    Tanged up in Blue
    Last edited by MadMac; September 7th, 2011 at 03:07 PM.

  4. #33
    Member Array xXMens ReaXx's Avatar
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    There is only one area of law I will never practice and you named it.

    Get out while you can.

    Beware of jaded post below:
    In law school I spoke with several criminal defense professors and attorneys about this area of practice. They all told me that 99% of their clients were guilty, but it was their job to get them off. Essentially they were in it for the money.

    Screw that. I am looking to make this world a better place and the 1% or so of innocent people do not justify getting the rest off. It's not for me, but to each his own. Good luck and be safe my friend. Maybe family law is safer lol.
    They don't call him lucky Ned Pepper for nothing

  5. #34
    Senior Member Array xsigma40cal's Avatar
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    Though your criticism would be considered to be common sense, Id have to refer you to your own emphasis on my current profession which is currently criminal law. With the common sense that most would have on this forum and even in the laymans circle, people who commit crimes or are caught up in these sort of affairs often dont have the money to afford an attorney let alone provide for their basic needs. I dont have a choice of the cases I take and I am only payed a certain amount by firm, which is not that much. And even if I have to sell my guns (HA!!!)for a fancy-pants white picket fence, as you said in your post, they will only jump that fence to demonstrate their intent...then what?

    Maybe you should think that one through.

  6. #35
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    Being scared is no way to go through life.

  7. #36
    Senior Member Array xsigma40cal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadguy View Post
    Keep this job. Keep defending the innocent if you truly believe you are helping. Every job has potential life threatening risks.

    Carry where legal and secure your home. If you wake up to a burning cross, call Gene Hackman
    Mathew Mcconaughey would work too, he played a lawyer that actually shot a woman so he knows what he's talkin about.

  8. #37
    Senior Member Array xsigma40cal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadMac View Post
    Lots of "squishy" words in there: client is "free-lance", you are working for her pro bono, she's "nearly" killed. You're approached while drinking in a bar by one the perp's friends. Sounds like the opening chapter for a new Elmore Leonard novel.

    Here's another classic movie line: "Guys are always suckers for a dame." It's a story as old as time.

    If you're both working off-the-books, it's going to look suspiciously like romance is the glue in a possible love triangle, and your professional ethics can get called in to question. Add in an angry ex-paramour with nasty friends who comes to your watering hole, and you're looking at the trifecta of the Rule of 3 Stupids. That's what I read into your little essay. I may be completely off-base, and I realize you purposely wrote it to disguise the players.
    --------

    "She was married when we first met,
    Soon to be divorced.
    I helped her out of a jam, I guess,
    But I used a little too much force."

    ~Bob Dylan

    Tanged up in Blue
    Dating my clients? no way, I dont bring my work home, Im not even happy about if following me home.

  9. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis1209 View Post
    A rottweiler is so mean that, after eating the BG, it will consume its own feces just to get the taste of the BG out of his mouth... Got to get one myself!





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  10. #39
    Member Array Blindeye's Avatar
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    xSigma40cal,

    You've made my point exactly. When they jump the fence, their intentions are clear (that's why the fence is there).
    They weren't pulling the driveway to turn around, lost, etc.
    My response depends on the circumstance, but usually it is me exiting the house through a side door with a Remington 11-87, and a holstered side arm that is a highly custom 1911.

    I'd like to think I bring some judgement with me. I had the unpleasant experience of seeing a car come through my gate at 2 am, and sneaked around the porch to intercept.
    The male intruder was fumbling with the door when I realized he had a child with him. I hit him the flashlight beam on my weapon, and it was my father-in-law.
    He wanted to surprise us by coming to visit (from 800 miles away) a few days early. The girl was my wife's niece.
    I was upset.
    G.

  11. #40
    Ex Member Array MadMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xsigma40cal View Post
    Dating my clients? no way, I dont bring my work home, Im not even happy about if following me home.
    So, I guess I can assume you also work pro bono for men going though similar situations.

    ...and if you do, what does your firm think about that? Don't they need to collect money from your clients to pay the rent and light bill as well as your salary?

  12. #41
    Distinguished Member Array deadguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadMac View Post
    So, I guess I can assume you also work pro bono for men going though similar situations.

    ...and if you do, what does your firm think about that? Don't they need to collect money from your clients to pay the rent and light bill as well as your salary?
    what does this have to do with him fearing for his life?
    There's nothing like a funeral to make you feel alive

  13. #42
    Ex Member Array MadMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadguy View Post
    what does this have to do with him fearing for his life?
    This is a discussion. If we don't have the freedom to talk about how he got here, we won't be able to determine how he can get to a less risky place in life. The incident in question is now over. He didn't have to shoot anyone, and he was unable to ascertain the intent of the person he saw in his driveway and near his home. We can all make suppositions (as the OP is doing), but no one can yet be sure.

    I point up the fact he has involved himself professionally (and perhaps personally) in what is decidedly a domestic violence situation. Since he is doing it pro bono (lawyer talk for "free of charge") for a woman, he has chosen sides in this violent relationship, and is taking action against the other party. This is what he feels is exposing him to danger and to fear for his life.

    My contention is that had his professional services been accomplished while "on the clock", it would have mitigated his risk, and his need to fear for his life.

    Ask any LEO how they feel about involving themselves in a domestic violence situation.

  14. #43
    Distinguished Member Array deadguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadMac View Post
    This is a discussion. If we don't have the freedom to talk about how he got here, we won't be able to determine how he can get to a less risky place in life. The incident in question is now over. He didn't have to shoot anyone, and he was unable to ascertain the intent of the person he saw in his driveway and near his home. We can all make suppositions (as the OP is doing), but no one can yet be sure.

    I point up the fact he has involved himself professionally (and perhaps personally) in what is decidedly a domestic violence situation. Since he is doing it pro bono (lawyer talk for "free of charge") for a woman, he has chosen sides in this violent relationship, and is taking action against the other party. This is what he feels is exposing him to danger and to fear for his life.

    My contention is that had his professional services been accomplished while "on the clock", it would have mitigated his risk, and his need to fear for his life.

    Ask any LEO how they feel about involving themselves in a domestic violence situation.
    I know what pro bono means, and I don't see how that would play into what "George" and his buddies at a local bar would do if the client was paying or not. It's a domestic.

    He briefly mentioned the story about the pro bono work in his OP here.
    Quote Originally Posted by xsigma40cal View Post
    Ok, if you all followed my last post, I helped a free-lance client of mine on a pro-bono assignment of putting her ex in jail for nearly killing her. In turn, one of the ex's buddy's approached me in a bar and made his presence known with hostile over-tones. Havent heard anything of "george" or his ilk since that case but now it seems that a threat could be arriving on the radar here pretty soon. And this one is getting way too close for comfort. Keep in mind, I am leaving out some details at my own discretion.
    He then went into another case he is working where I feel he is in more danger of being attacked than by "George".
    Quote Originally Posted by xsigma40cal View Post
    Ok, if you all followed my last post, I helped a free-lance client of mine on a pro-bono assignment of putting her ex in jail for nearly killing her. In turn, one of the ex's buddy's approached me in a bar and made his presence known with hostile over-tones. Havent heard anything of "george" or his ilk since that case but now it seems that a threat could be arriving on the radar here pretty soon. And this one is getting way too close for comfort. Keep in mind, I am leaving out some details at my own discretion.

    One case that I am working is a 2nd degree murder charge where, my client, a transgendered woman, is accused of inflicting a fatal wound to a middle aged man, who I suspect (I havent confirmed) had affiliations with the Aryan Brotherhood or a similar extremist group. As I have reviewed the discovery packets, conducted interviews, visited the scene of the crime, and made my calculations, I have come to the conclusion that my client is truly innocent and I will serve her interest's to maximum effect. However, there are a great number of people out there who would rather not see my client go free, and I am starting to worry that measure's on their end are taking a new precedent. As of recently with the trial date merely a few weeks away, there have been a number of harassing and even a few threatening voice & emails being thrown around.
    I read the point of his post being that his decision to defend the accused or to represent a client that was almost murdered has led him to believe his life may be in danger. To the point where someone possibly drove into his driveway and scared him enough to pull a weapon. The nature of his job is dangerous in and of itself, regardless of whether or not he is sleeping with a client and/or getting paid to represent her/him.
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    There's nothing like a funeral to make you feel alive

  15. #44
    VIP Member Array zonker1986's Avatar
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    have to agree with Deadguy......this thread is about how a man in a dangerous profession goes about defending himself from the creeps that come out at night.
    Whether he is dating his clients or sleeping with all the clowns in Barnum & Bailey Circus has no relevance to the discussion. Who cares how he is paid, or why he is representing this client?
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  16. #45
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
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    Bottom line is many have chosen professions where they can become targets on and off the clock. Carry, train in force on force, be vigilant and aware and for gods sake, do not have to run into your room and "gas up" your XD when you are threatened. It should already be ready to go.

    My suggestions to you:

    1. Do not run your life by patterns. i.e. visiting the same places at the same times every day, driving the same routes every day....

    2. Get some kind of early warning driveway or front porch monitor. Trim bushes and hedges, Install motion lights outside. get a dog if possible, doesn't need to be a rott or anything big, even a small yapper will alert you as they smell and hear what you cannot. Always lock your doors. Be aware when approcahing vehicles.

    3. But yourself a nice ruger lcr or smith j-frame to carry on your person AT ALL TIMES with 5 .38+p or .357 cartridges at home and have a scattergun or the xd ready to go at a moments notice. That way if necessary no matter where you are on your property you can potentially fight your way back to your autoloader or scatter gun. Did I remind you to carry ON YOUR PERSON??? Even a small LCP or P3AT in a pocket holster can allow you the time to get to the bigger weapons. There is no excuse unless you have kids for you to have to rack the slide to chamber a round when you are home. If you are concerned, purchase a quick open safe for it.

    4. Be more aware of your surroundings, kind of like when riding a motorcycle, be constantly evaluating your surroundings identifying potential threats and be proactive to them not reactive.... this is not only necessary in your line of work, but good for your mind in terms of keeping it sharp. Do it daily, stay alert. Do not get complacent.... eventually it will be so normal that you will do it without even thinking about it.

    5. Train. TRAIN TRAIN TRAIN. Don't just go push paper at a range, go find a school that teaches combat shooting and force on force classes. Take them. learn to defend yourself not just grab a weaver stance and get a pretty sight picture before you shoot. Learn to shoot under duress and movement. Learn to defend yourself when someone is on you by surprise and already has "hands on". Leanr to defend against knife and blunt object attacks, not just firearms.

    My 2 cents: I have been threatened, intimidated, and harassed by unsavory individuals due to my past. DO NOT let ANYONE intimidate you into making a career change. Continue on with your life and make small adjustments to your life. Do what you do. Criminal defense sucks. Learn it and move on to your own or someone else private practice or apply at the local city/county/federal attorneys office. Start doing some cases pro bono to get more experience in other types of defense..... maybe self defense cases..... specialize.....

    Even criminals require defense. Just think for the 99% of people you defend that are guilty, there will be that 1% that actually are innocent and require competent caring counsel. Always remember that.



    Good luck dude.
    zonker1986 and Secret Spuk like this.

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