This is a discussion on incident while camping yesterday... within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Pot farmers????...
"If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan
wow, thank god you were armed...a fist sized rock to the head or face is goin to ruin your day quick....
Glad this one doesn't have a bad ending
Then too, it is hunting season. Lots of times I have sat real quiet in the woods and waited for folks with little or no awareness skills to move on thru my hunting area. I sure would hate to be hunting and get shot because someone wanted to fire off some warning or angry shots.
I think there are better ways of handling the situation, which the op did.
I'm curious how large and what kind of rock it was. If it was a dirt clod, it might hurt but not do much serious damage. if it was an actual heavy rock, it could knock you unconscious or even kill you if it hit your head just right.
Now, I know I'm probably going to catch flack for this but I'll say it anyway. I'm under the impression that the guys did not know you were armed. I'm also under the impression that they didn't make their presence known to you and you had no direct eye contact (before seeing them in the truck). This is one of those rare cases where I might have fired a warning shot. Probably only if I had my Glock which has 15 round magazine where I'd feel like I could spare a round. That would leave absolutely no doubt in the minds of the bad guys that you were armed and meant business. So even if they couldn't see you and you couldn't see them, they would probably start running like crazy because they'd most likely think you had spotted them and were firing directly at them. I believe "threat of deadly force" would be perfectly justifiable when they would have already committed an act of deadly force towards you.
"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws." -Plato
I am glad you are alright. Perhaps you should think about arming your son all the time.
No not dirt, a fist sized rock. Plain o'le sedimentary type 1 each. We saw it and recovered it...rock. It'd have given a concussion possibly if it connected..
My kids are both proficient marksman, and well versed on firearms safety and requirements for deadly force. My youngest was with me and understands that stuff can happen anytime. It scared him.
Good point of view. Good discussion.
Re-reading your last post. I did not interpret the sole action of the rock throwing as a deadly force situation. I understand your point however. I'd need more before I dropped someone. IE; rushing/advancing on us at that moment. Also, I do not believe in warning shots period. If deadly force requirements are met, act without hesitation. If not, and you discharge your weapon. The opponent HAS cause to act in self defense. Do not escalate imho.
Semper Fi. I admit I found it comforting 4 Marines were camping near us that day. My son laughed when I told him the Marines are here and the area is secure...
It's a possibility local LE will know them or the truck by description, bad guys tend to have reputations and prior run in's with the law. The act of throwing a rock at you is fairly serious, that's a missile and would have caused severe injury. I'm glad it worked out this time, but use this as a learning experience so that if there is a next time your response will be immediate; mentally recording pertinent information, reporting the incident right away, ensuring you and your son are safe. I think you should let LE know what happened still, it would put them on alert and possibly bring this to the attention of campers using the site to be aware of these men. This wasn't the first time they've done this.
Yeah, I think they probably pull this if they notice anyone camping down there. I don't know how I could have reacted differently. Had I been able to locate those two and rush up on them. That probably would not have ended better than it did. In court it may have made me look more as an aggressor than victim. Don't know. I regret not being more focused on the license plate , but I thought at the time these guys were gonna stop and we'd have a confrontation. That was where my head was then. As for LE notification I've learned from past experience that not having enough proof of a crime gets you no where with them and may create a worse threat. I had problems with some thieving lowlifes and involved LE before. All it did was make it worse for my family. At first reporting every incident, which turned their focus on me I think. That is the reality sometimes. Lessons learned for sure.This forum is a place where we can learn from each other. Most in society don't even consider self defense or taking steps to protect themselves. I'm of the belief all we can do is take care of our own. Cynical I know...