Dementia

This is a discussion on Dementia within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; A while back a discussion took place regarding a scenario of a person coming into your home and refusing to leave, the question was shoot ...

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  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array kapnketel's Avatar
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    Dementia

    A while back a discussion took place regarding a scenario of a person coming into your home and refusing to leave, the question was shoot or not. One of the discussions centerd around a possible alzheimer sufferer being the "intruder" and the members thought it very unlikely. Well, here ya go:

    Grand jury will look at Hamilton shooting | Cincinnati.com | cincinnati.com
    I'd rather be lucky than good any day

    There's nothing that will change someone's moral outlook quicker than cash in large sums.

    Majority rule only works if you're also considering individual rights. Because you can't have five wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for supper.

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    Distinguished Member Array bigmacque's Avatar
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    Actually one of the better news reports I've read in some time -- at least there's no readily apparent bias from the reporter.

    It will be interesting to see how the facts play out.
    I'm in favor of gun control -- I think every citizen should have control of a gun.
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    Member Array kukla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kapnketel View Post
    A while back a discussion took place regarding a scenario of a person coming into your home and refusing to leave, the question was shoot or not. One of the discussions centerd around a possible alzheimer sufferer being the "intruder" and the members thought it very unlikely. Well, here ya go:

    Grand jury will look at Hamilton shooting | Cincinnati.com | cincinnati.com
    alzheimers or not, this news article was not about someone mistakenly walking into someone elses house
    "He told police that a man, later identified as Stevens, forced his way into the house, kicked his cat, began tearing up his basement and assaulted him with a board."
    "I plan ahead. That way, I don't have to do anything right now!"

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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kukla View Post
    alzheimers or not, this news article was not about someone mistakenly walking into someone elses house
    "He told police that a man, later identified as Stevens, forced his way into the house, kicked his cat, began tearing up his basement and assaulted him with a board."
    You forgot about the part about him crashing a car into the garage. You are right, this isn;t even a debatable situation. Homeowner sound 100 percent justified. It is terrible the old man got killed. But the homeowner wouldn't have know under that kind of duress.
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    If I was 84 and this happened in my house, there is a good possibility that I would shoot the person as well.

    Being that I am about half that age, and if old person did what was described in the news article, I would probably refrain from shooting them as I believe I could find a way to either restrain him, disable them or get him to stop kicking my dog.
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    Yep, I'd say he definitely picked the wrong house! I'm not a doctor, so if you come into my house and attack me with a board, BANG.
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    Ex Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    You forgot about the part about him crashing a car into the garage. You are right, this isn;t even a debatable situation. Homeowner sound 100 percent justified. It is terrible the old man got killed. But the homeowner wouldn't have know under that kind of duress.
    This right here.....

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    Distinguished Member Array bigmacque's Avatar
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    We may find that alzhiemers or dementia is just a side note, and there's a reason the guy crashed into his garage with his car. Not justifying it, not justifying tearing up his basement, but there still may be more to the story.
    I'm in favor of gun control -- I think every citizen should have control of a gun.
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    Distinguished Member Array kapnketel's Avatar
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    I wasn't arguing the justification of the shoot, but merely the scenario actually happening shortly after a discussion thread on the possibility. More of a "it can happen" point.
    I'd rather be lucky than good any day

    There's nothing that will change someone's moral outlook quicker than cash in large sums.

    Majority rule only works if you're also considering individual rights. Because you can't have five wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for supper.

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    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    If I was 84 and this happened in my house, there is a good possibility that I would shoot the person as well.

    Being that I am about half that age, and if old person did what was described in the news article, I would probably refrain from shooting them as I believe I could find a way to either restrain him, disable them or get him to stop kicking my dog.


    ^^^^^^^^^^YEP^^^^^^^^^


    I'm kinda in this camp on this one.

    If an old-timer barges in, goes through a routine like this, I'm heading for a safe spot, cops get called, and told to get here ASAP.
    Longs as the dude doesn't threaten me or mine he'll live to see the end of a psyc. evaluation.

    If ,in 15 20 years from now somebody pulls a stunt like this, don't know if I'd have the patience for too much of this kinda drama.
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    This is a touchy situation. Many early onset Alzheimer patients get extremely combative when they are confused. They also are usually in denial and can be delusional and that just compounds their problems. My brother, early on, was sure I was calling him on the phone and swearing at him and calling him names. For two yrs. he refused to talk to me and told friends he had no brother. When he advanced to the next stage, acceptance, he had no recollection of any of this and made me his legal guardian. It's all about recognizing the symptoms and getting the right medications. I feel for the victim but he should have been watched more carefully. I'm sure the law doesn't expect the shooter to ask the victim if he is of sound mind as he is trashing the garage and house and attacking him with a board. It would be smile, wait for the flash!

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    Don't underestimate the Alzheimer's patient.

    My grandfather had Alzheimer's, and they had some guy break into their house. He was 81 and a bit frail at the time.

    When he was in the Seabees as a young man, he was a champion boxer. In his mind, when he woke up to confront the intruder, he was back in the Seabees. He beat the ever loving heck out of the guy, inflicting severe injuries including facial fractures and breaking the guy's jaw in two places.
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    What an unfortunate situation. It is now made all the more unfortunate that the homeowner has to face a grand jury. This is pretty clear proof that no matter how justified we think we are, we may end up in court anyway.

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    Bad situation but the homeowner did what HE felt was right. Remember the "reasonable man"?

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    I dont know all the particulars in this case, but I will say this...

    Sometimes, when in doubt, shooting someone, even if legal or justified, may not always be the best answer to the solution.
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