Suddenly a fistfight broke out and rolled onto the hood of my truck!

This is a discussion on Suddenly a fistfight broke out and rolled onto the hood of my truck! within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I think it was brandishing. I think if you told the cops about it, which per your story you didn't, and if they were interested ...

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Thread: Suddenly a fistfight broke out and rolled onto the hood of my truck!

  1. #16
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    I think it was brandishing. I think if you told the cops about it, which per your story you didn't, and if they were interested (which they wouldn't be since the potential complainants were now gone) you might then have had a problem.

    As it is all was good. I think you had no choice to at the very least have your hand on it. Showing it and ordering them to stay put and wait for the cops was maybe a bit over the top.

    Glad it worked out for you. Now try to be more careful where you go with the kids. Though that said, it can happen anytime and anyplace.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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  3. #17
    Distinguished Member Array Tally XD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    I think it was brandishing. I think if you told the cops about it, which per your story you didn't, and if they were interested (which they wouldn't be since the potential complainants were now gone) you might then have had a problem.
    Brandishing apparently means different things in different states. It would not have been brandishing in Florida. What is the definition of brandishing in VA?
    I am consistently on record and will continue to be on record as opposing concealed carry.
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  4. #18
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    I'm no coward, not a hero and not a cop. I'd have left the scene or retreated with primary objective to get my kids outta there. That given that specific fists only scenario . What if the kids got to watch another version where a perp unseen by OP approached from behind emptying a pistol into his brain housing group(reacting in "self defense" of others)? Or deadly force applied by OP, long court battle risking prison for a non family member?No one knows unless they were there in that situation, just saying not me. My two cents from the peanut gallery...
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  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tally XD View Post
    Brandishing apparently means different things in different states. It would not have been brandishing in Florida. What is the definition of brandishing in VA?
    VA is an open carry State I live on the boarder and cross state lines 10 or more times per week. Displaying a holstered side arm is not brandishing in VA or TN.

    To the OP I think you did great under the circumstances, review and modify according in your mind. Just as a coach reviews the game to find areas for improvment these situations are the "game" for us if you will. Please people understand I am NOT saying this was a game but these are the situations we may run into that let us change our reaction (play book) for SHTF.
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  6. #20
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    Just playing devils advocate here;

    So, a large fight just erupts and catches you totally off guard?

    There was no typical hollering chest pounding type stuff going on before the fight broke out?

    Where was your S/A?

    Why did you not just climb in the drivers seat and roll away?

    Why did you feel the need to introduce your gun into a fist fight?

    What would of done if they turned on you? How would you defend your actions after the fact?

    If you felt that life and limb were in danger, why did you not leave when you had the chance too?

    Could you not make your statement over the phone?

    Why not leave your contact information with dispatch, and leave it up to the deputy whether your perspective is even needed?

    All that is not intended to pick you apart, its just stuff to consider.
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  7. #21
    Senior Member Array Okemo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Just playing devils advocate here;

    So, a large fight just erupts and catches you totally off guard?

    There was no typical hollering chest pounding type stuff going on before the fight broke out?

    Where was your S/A?

    Why did you not just climb in the drivers seat and roll away?

    Why did you feel the need to introduce your gun into a fist fight?

    What would of done if they turned on you? How would you defend your actions after the fact?

    If you felt that life and limb were in danger, why did you not leave when you had the chance too?

    Could you not make your statement over the phone?

    Why not leave your contact information with dispatch, and leave it up to the deputy whether your perspective is even needed?

    All that is not intended to pick you apart, its just stuff to consider.
    It appears he was on the passenger side buckling his kids into the vehicle.
    And you know I could have me a million more friends, and all I'd have to lose is my point of view. -- John Prine (A Good Time)

  8. #22
    Distinguished Member Array kelcarry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tally XD View Post
    Brandishing apparently means different things in different states. It would not have been brandishing in Florida. What is the definition of brandishing in VA?
    Really? Since when, if you consider brandishing the pointing of a firearm at someone because you are a raving, irresponsible maniac who cannot control himself, a legal form of anything? Open carry means open carry in a holster, not open carry in your hand and waving it around as you try to make your point about some senseless road rage or whatever rage. As I said before, if this is legal and you do it to me in Florida, I will presume imminent danger of death and you will suffer the consequences.

  9. #23
    VIP Member Array searcher 45's Avatar
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    Very well done, good for OC in your state!!!!!!
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  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    Really? Since when, if you consider brandishing the pointing of a firearm at someone because you are a raving, irresponsible maniac who cannot control himself, a legal form of anything?
    This NOT what he did and NOT what he said. Either you are being deliberately disrespectful or you are the one who is acting like a raving maniac making up things that didn't happen.
    What he said was:
    I hitched my coat over my holster, exposing my sidearm, readied my pepper spray,
    At what point did he point a firearm at someone and act like a raving maniac engaging in road rage?

  11. #25
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    A fist fight is not a combat situation. It's a fist fight. Displaying your weaponry may have negated any tactical advantage of surprise you had. Without knowing any of the dynamics of the fight... There could have been others in the crowd armed as well or better than you. Usually bystanders are not seen as any threat. But by displaying weapons they may become percieved as a threat, and dealt with.

    I'm not being critical of your actions. After all ... All's well that ends well. I'm just trying to share some of my own experience, and observations.
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  12. #26
    VIP Member Array sixgun's Avatar
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    Great job you had a gun with you and didnt have to draw and use it. A win win situation in my book. Glad you and your boys were safe.

  13. #27
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    I would have grabbed me a beer and enjoyed the action... woman get brutal..... something so primal about a cat fight

  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Okemo View Post
    It appears he was on the passenger side buckling his kids into the vehicle.
    I'm aware of what was written. A really bad mistake in these types of situation is assuming your feet are now in concrete blocks.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  15. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by chiefjason View Post
    Nothing to offer, but curious. From when you realized it was starting to when they separated, about how long did it take? I would imagine it happened much faster than most would imagine. Not much time to do anything but prepare for the worst and hope for the best.
    About 10 seconds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    I think it was brandishing. I think if you told the cops about it, which per your story you didn't, and if they were interested (which they wouldn't be since the potential complainants were now gone) you might then have had a problem.

    As it is all was good. I think you had no choice to at the very least have your hand on it. Showing it and ordering them to stay put and wait for the cops was maybe a bit over the top.

    Glad it worked out for you. Now try to be more careful where you go with the kids. Though that said, it can happen anytime and anyplace.
    Not brandishing. They didn't see me uncover. OC is perfectly legal. Never put my hand on it.

    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Just playing devils advocate here;

    So, a large fight just erupts and catches you totally off guard?

    No I wasn't off guard. I was peripherally aware of them and was trying to get my kids in the truck and buckled.

    There was no typical hollering chest pounding type stuff going on before the fight broke out?

    They went from quiet conversation inside the store, to quiet conversation outside the store, to loud separating comments, to 'fighting words,' to attack, to traveling mutual combat, to separation.

    Where was your S/A?

    See above.

    Why did you not just climb in the drivers seat and roll away?

    Wasn't in position to. The end of the fight, separation, standoff and retreat all happened within spitting distance of my driver side door while I was on the passenger side.

    Why did you feel the need to introduce your gun into a fist fight?

    I didn't. I somply gave it easier access if I needed it, which is how I travel to this store quite often.

    What would of done if they turned on you? How would you defend your actions after the fact?

    Empty pepper gas while retreating until they could have gained an advantage over my truck and kids. Then take out the lead opponent physically unless overwhelmed by disparity of force. Then brandish and/or fire for effect.

    If you felt that life and limb were in danger, why did you not leave when you had the chance too?

    At first leaving was not viable, after that I certainly could have but I perceived the situation to be resolved.

    Could you not make your statement over the phone?

    I don't know. Usually the LEO wants to interview the witnesses in person, and get a written statement.

    Why not leave your contact information with dispatch, and leave it up to the deputy whether your perspective is even needed?

    Yep, I could have done that.

    All that is not intended to pick you apart, its just stuff to consider.
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

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  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tally XD View Post
    Brandishing apparently means different things in different states. It would not have been brandishing in Florida. What is the definition of brandishing in VA?
    I'm not in VA. We have a law prohibiting intentional display. Our law doesn't use the term brandishing.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson

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