Dead or alive? - Page 3

Dead or alive?

This is a discussion on Dead or alive? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Texas DPS has removed the requirement to "shoot to wound", according to my CHL instructor. If the gun needs to come out, somebody needs to ...

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  1. #31
    Member Array Walden's Avatar
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    Texas DPS has removed the requirement to "shoot to wound", according to my CHL instructor. If the gun needs to come out, somebody needs to die. I hope I'm never in that position and I am by no means trigger-happy; This technique just prevents being shot by a wounded aggressor or not stopping the threat in the first place. Other implements should be used for nonlethal situations
    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." - St. Augustine


  2. #32
    Member Array Walden's Avatar
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    ^

    Just to add: I don't think executing a downed aggressor would be acceptable.
    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." - St. Augustine

  3. #33
    Distinguished Member Array Stubborn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadMac View Post
    Or a Klondike bar, or a balloon, or an itchy arse, or a physical disability.

    I just love these "he could have a gun!" scenarios....

    The laws in my state doesn't allow me to gun down a "shady" character because he may have a gun or a knife. Additionally, I can't shoot him down even if he has a gun or a knife as those are not the criteria for justifiable use of deadly force in self-defense. YMMV.
    Nice of you to leave out what I said sounded about right to me...I'll put in in below...

    If the person's approach toward me is aggressive and he fails to stop after being commanded to do so, I would then place my hand on my pistol, slightly pulling it from from holster retention. Another forceful command would be issued. If at this point he still shows aggression and has refused to obey, I would be forced to clear leather and show this person I am not kidding. If he then continues to approach with a muzzle pointed at him, I have to assume he intends to harm me in some way.

    My shot(s) would be fired to stop his forward advances.
    If he/they are warned, then warned a second time with hand on gun, and warned a third time with gun drawn and pointed at him/them and they are still coming, he/they intend you harm.

    Like I put in my post #23 above, the business end of a handgun is THE universal international language for stop, hearing impaired or non english speaking alike.

    I'm so sorry to hear that you live in a state that will not permit you to defend yourself when someone is armed with a gun or knife and is advancing on you.
    My state will allow me to, with no duty to retreat.

    If you let an assailant inside your 7 yards, you're in trouble. It's been proven time and again, if they're that close you can not defend against them.
    "The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it".
    Thomas Jefferson

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  4. #34
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    He is merely a potential assailant until he does something legitimately aggressive. Walking toward me in a parking lot doesn't fit that bill. For all I know, I am standing beside his car.
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    "If I had my choice I would kill every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting reports from Hell before breakfast."
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  5. #35
    Senior Member Array TheShadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevolvingMag View Post
    That would be why you carry your 'less-than-lethal' in your off hand. So, if you need to have your pepper spray ready, it's ready in one hand, and your other hand is free to handle your weapon.
    I agree...

    don't forget we're multi-tasking here as we still need to sweep the cover garment.

  6. #36
    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
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    "A shady character" is too ambiguous a term. For defensive purposes, and especially if we wind up explaining it in court, we need to be able to articulate why we think he is "shady". That is what profiling is all about. Unfortunately profiling has gotten a bad rap lately and has been co-opted for use by the Politically Correct. To work correctly, one must continue to evaluate the appearance and behavior and it is not an either/or assessment; it is a continuum of assessment of the possibilities that leads us through the color codes. If you are not profiling then you aren't thinking. At any point in the process the profile might be proven false. So, yes, profiling can be taken too far, but it is still a valuable part of the process.

    Also, we need to remember that merely "fearing for one's life" is not the criterion but rather what the "average" person would feel in the same situation. It is a subtle, but important distinction and could be the difference between remaining free and going to jail. Finally, don't forget: Ability, Opportunity, Jeopardy must all be present.

    P.S. We won't react using something we read on a forum unless we incorporate it into a valid training regimen.

  7. #37
    Member Array Outer_Heaven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by STLRampage View Post
    Since this is a hypothetical what happens when you pull spray and the BG is closing on you and pulls a knife/gun? At this point it would seem your choice of a less lethal option puts you at a huge disadvantage as you would then have to attempt to draw and fire with the BG close range with a ready weapon.

    Thoughts?
    Deploy your OC with your weak hand. While doing Bail Enforcement/Armed Security in VA I learned that you are always going to want to have your gun hand free.

  8. #38
    VIP Member Array Secret Spuk's Avatar
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    And if the guy turns out to be a deaf mute? I had this happen to me... I was on the subway train alone in a car early in the AM. Big guy comes from another car... looks at me and stalks toward me. I told him to back off... twice. He kept coming... I loosed my gun (S&W 640) and put it in my pocket aiming at him... He pulls his hand out of his pocket... in it is a yellow card with sign language on it. He was a deaf mute panhandling.

  9. #39
    Senior Member Array Sig35seven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Spuk View Post
    And if the guy turns out to be a deaf mute? I had this happen to me... I was on the subway train alone in a car early in the AM. Big guy comes from another car... looks at me and stalks toward me. I told him to back off... twice. He kept coming... I loosed my gun (S&W 640) and put it in my pocket aiming at him... He pulls his hand out of his pocket... in it is a yellow card with sign language on it. He was a deaf mute panhandling.
    Did you give him anything?
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    "Confidence is food for the wise man but liquor for the fool"

  10. #40
    Senior Member Array BkCo1's Avatar
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    I would keep observing said person and move out of his way. Preferability looking for something to put between me and him. I would need further proof of his actions that he meant harm to me before taking action. Then go home and watch CSI.
    Semper Fi
    "Marines don't surrender-they win or die." from Brute

  11. #41
    VIP Member Array Secret Spuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig35seven View Post
    Did you give him anything?
    Yes... his life And kept my freedom in the bargan

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