Man with a baseball bat

This is a discussion on Man with a baseball bat within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; This is based on a situation I saw before CCW was available here. My family and I were walking out of a large department store ...

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Thread: Man with a baseball bat

  1. #1
    Member Array sevesteen's Avatar
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    Man with a baseball bat

    This is based on a situation I saw before CCW was available here. My family and I were walking out of a large department store in a medium-sized city. Walking in was a man with a baseball bat, muttering angrily. I got the clear impression that the bat was intended as a weapon, at least to intimidate, possibly to use. Since I was not carrying, I decided the best thing to do was to call the police.

    If you were carrying, what would you do besides that?

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Ti Carry's Avatar
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    Hum, not much info to make a reply really. But a baseball bat is a weapon if intending to cause harn to another person.

    911 is a must, than I would keep an eye on the situation at hand and see where it goes. If he is not directly after me with it I stay way back from this and observe for a good witness. If this guy starts using heads as baseballs I can not guarntee his safety.

    Although you didn't say what store, he could have been made that he couldn't hit a home run at the company picnic's annual softball game and wanted his money back!

    But,

    I would draw first, if he did not back down at the site of my weapon I would shoot to wound, if he still did not back down, I would shoot to wound again (depending on distance) the third warning, it would have to be light's out!

    Actually, If it was like you say and I was leaving the store I would for sure call 911 and observe for a good witness. If I am already outside, it is not likely I will be going back in unless this guy was causing a lot of damage to people and no one alse could handle the situation. I am saying, if someone is going to die I will go in to try and stop it.


    Ti
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    Member Array steve_db's Avatar
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    being licensed to carry a concealed weapon does not a deputy make.
    I'd call 911 and observe from a distance.
    Any other actions, on my part, would depend on the circumstances.
    If he started attacking some helpless person (an elderly person or child for example), I might draw on him as a last resort and verbally warn him off.
    If he then came at me, I'd shoot him.

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    Distinguished Member Array jarhead79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_db View Post
    If he started attacking some helpless person (an elderly person or child for example), I might draw on him as a last resort and verbally warn him off.
    If he then came at me, I'd shoot him.
    I think a situation like this where you draw your weapon is going to have one of those two results. He is either gonna run like hell, or turn on you. That definitely brings to light the result of clearing leather.

    I too would not stand idly or flee and allow someone to be done harm. It's just not in me.
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    Distinguished Member Array dimmak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ti Carry View Post
    I would draw first, if he did not back down at the site of my weapon I would shoot to wound, if he still did not back down, I would shoot to wound again (depending on distance) the third warning, it would have to be light's out!

    If lethal force is necessary, "shooting to wound" is not an option...
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    Member Array WorldPax's Avatar
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    Guy just had a fight with his wife in the car while they were at the mall to return the bat e bought for his son. Turns out they don't allow wood bats in their league.
    Pax
    Tulsa, OK

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    Member Array sevesteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve_db View Post
    being licensed to carry a concealed weapon does not a deputy make.
    I'd call 911 and observe from a distance.
    Any other actions, on my part, would depend on the circumstances.
    If he started attacking some helpless person (an elderly person or child for example), I might draw on him as a last resort and verbally warn him off.
    If he then came at me, I'd shoot him.
    There wasn't any way to observe from outside--Front windows were covered in "AMAZING CLEARANCE SALE!!!!" signs. We were way too far away to see inside when he passed--I guess what I was asking is whether you would follow inside.

    I think what I'd do now is have my wife call 911, remind her to describe me and tell them I had a CHL. I'd follow inside, don't draw or otherwise call attention to myself, and hope I wasn't needed. As long as he's not about to use the bat, I'd just watch.

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    VIP Member Array Ti Carry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimmak View Post
    If lethal force is necessary, "shooting to wound" is not an option...
    If he has just a bat it is an option for me! While he could possibly kill me with the bat it is not a weapon of equalness. Do what you feel is right and so will I.

    My idea of this is he is a diranged person and not really a killer as much as he is jacked in the head. Why else would someone bring a bat into a store that is pissed off? In a case like this he at least deserves the warnings before deadly force is applied giving him the chance to reconsider his actions. In court I can at least show that I exausted all my options as well as his options.


    Ti.
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    Member Array Leadslinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimmak View Post
    If lethal force is necessary, "shooting to wound" is not an option...

    If your idea of "shooting to wound" is a double tap Center Mass ....

    well then I'd "shoot to wound" too .

    I also believe in "warnings" ................

    BANG !!! BANG!!!! BANG!!!! .... "put the bat down or I'll shoot ."

    A LTTLE TRAINING IS A DANGEROUS THING ....

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    Distinguished Member Array lowflyer's Avatar
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    I probably would have ignored the whole thing unless I saw him going after somebody. Just carrying a bat while angry is not justification enough for me to even get involved. Rest assured if he threatened a person or tried to hit someone with the bat, I would dail 911, tell him I called the cops, and then ask him politely and in a calm voice to drop the bat. I would keep talking to him. If he persisted or got more threatening, I would draw and shoot him without warning until he dropped the bat. I am not schooled in deescelating techniques or negotiations with an armed assailant so he would just have to deal with what I am schooled in (1911). When I practice, all of my rounds go to CM and head. I never practice winging somebody, so he would not receive the benefit of my having that skill either.
    Whatever doesn't kill you postpones the inevitable.

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    Member Array soundwave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowflyer View Post
    I am not schooled in deescelating techniques or negotiations with an armed assailant so he would just have to deal with what I am schooled in (1911).
    I am trained in crisis intervention, suicide intervention and hostage negotiation... I can tell you, as well as any LEO (trained in the same or not), if he continues to pose a threat and not comply, intervention and negotiation goes right out the window with a BANG.

    Cheers.

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    Member Array TattooWings's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sevesteen View Post
    There wasn't any way to observe from outside--Front windows were covered in "AMAZING CLEARANCE SALE!!!!" signs. We were way too far away to see inside when he passed--I guess what I was asking is whether you would follow inside.

    I think what I'd do now is have my wife call 911, remind her to describe me and tell them I had a CHL. I'd follow inside, don't draw or otherwise call attention to myself, and hope I wasn't needed. As long as he's not about to use the bat, I'd just watch.
    I'm trying to put myself in this situation and second guess. Simply leaving without doing anything would keep me up at night. I'd hate to read about something heinous this guy might have done the next day.

    Without knowing the source of his anger, it's impossible to tell his intent by the details provided, as WorldPax pointed out.

    I might delay even dialing 911 at this point, and do as you describe, simply observe from a distance, until I'm convinced this guy isn't going after people's noggins.

    You would have to be within earshot, however. Without hearing the conversation, raising a bat to demonstrate his stance would look just like rasing a bat to knock the clerk's head off. Too many other possibilites here besides homicidal intent. Was he going to see someone to vent his anger on or was he leaving someone who was the source of his anger? Or was he just an angry kind of guy?

    I'd hate to shoot a guy who was driven to talking to himself over something which had nothing to do with carrying the bat or returning to the retail store.

    At the point where I'm convinced from eavesdropping that this guy is definately angry with the clerk, the store, or intending to vent upon either, I'd dial 911.

    But... if he really intends to brain a hapless clerk, "This'll learn ya for short-changin' me!" (as he raises the bat to swing), then a sharp, "I wouldn't do that!" with piece de-holstered and aimed might get his attention. He'll certainly look at you. Then if he returns to follow through with obvious intent, DROP HIM!

    Much better to have the clerk telling the police, "That guy with the bat was going to kill me!" than "This guy was trying to return a baseball bat when this maniac just shot him for no reason!"

    Long post, I know, but you went and got me to thinkin'...

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    Not Your Biz...

    keep on walking! A cop you are not!

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    Walking in was a man with a baseball bat, muttering angrily. I got the clear impression that the bat was intended as a weapon, at least to intimidate, possibly to use. Since I was not carrying, I decided the best thing to do was to call the police.

    If you were carrying, what would you do besides that?
    Nothing. There is nothing agaisnt the law that says you cant carry a ballbat and mutter to yourself.

    As long as he kept on his way, everything is good. Make an aggresive move towards me or mine, and things change quickly. Until then, I just watch him and leave him to his own desires.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    I would always call the police if I thought He was intending to use that bat on someone. Since I have a family and if they are with me, I have a priority to safeguard my children then my wife and myself. The only action that I am willing to take with a family in tow is to call 911, unless I'm pushed to do otherwise.

    If I am alone, I would call 911 and observe from a safe distance. If he went after someone I would try first to verbally warn the victim. If the psycho continued hitting someone, than I would draw and issued verbal commands. From this point if he doesn't comply I would have little choice.

    J.S.

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