Barber and customer robbed

This is a discussion on Barber and customer robbed within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; What would you have done in this incident? Even though I'm armed whenever I get my haircut (and my barber fully knows and supports this), ...

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Thread: Barber and customer robbed

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array MotorCityGun's Avatar
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    Barber and customer robbed

    What would you have done in this incident? Even though I'm armed whenever I get my haircut (and my barber fully knows and supports this), I'm wondering myself what I would've done. Keep in mind, according to the report, both robbers were armed with AK's and there were kids present.

    Man Says AK-47 Armed Robbers Targeted Detroit Barber Shop
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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array First Sgt's Avatar
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    Hmmmmm....Customer said "he had the gun on my head"....Does that mean the AK47 was trained on his head or resting on his head? If, you the customer, are carrying, what do you think the reaction of the robbers will be IF they discover your weapon?

    I think as an "armed" customer, you are behind the power curve IF the robbers find out you are armed. Most of the time, you have some type of covering over you if you are sitting in the barber's chair. Soooo, YOU have surprise in your favor...IF the weapon is resting on your head from the front, you are in a position to cut the odds by being within reach of the barrel...IF the weapon is trained on your head, then you have to say to yourself, "Do I want to die when they find my weapon and I do nothing or Do I want to try to survive by being more violent towards them than they have reason to expect?"

    I cannot be concerned with the others that are in the shop at this time. Unfortunately, they do not know I am armed, and unfortunately they cannot predict exactly what the BGs will do when they find out that information.

    Regardless of the position of the barrel, if I am covered while sitting in the chair, then the only way I can empty my pockets, per their request, is by standing up out of the chair. As I stand up, I can either reach the barrel closest to me while drawing and firing from beneath the cover, OR I can let the rustle of the covering create the initial diversion as I stand up out of the chair and then explode off the X while drawing and firing. There comes a point in your choice of carrying a weapon for self defense, that you have to decide, do I want to survive by trying to save myself or do I want to put my survival in the hands of the BG's and hope they let me live. Don't expect a BG to show either mercy or compassion.

    Sure, am I behind the powercurve...you bet! Are my chances good in surviving the ordeal?....MY chances are as good as the BG's will be! They will not be expecting any opposition whatsoever and will most probably be of the mentality that no one will test them simply out of fear of the AK's...

    If there is to be a fight, the best one is a short one. If a predator menaces me with a gun, I know, that before it is all over, there is a good chance that I will be shot. However, within that prison of circumstance, I also know that the faster I can end the fight, the less hurt I'm going to get! If there must be a fight, I must explode into action, move smoothly and quickly, in an effort to confuse and overwhelm my opponent before he has a chance to process all the information I'm throwing at him.

    What I'm tryin to say is, ultimately we must "have a plan." Potentiallly dangerous encounters must be thought about in advance. That is the beauty of discussing these scenarios. Decisions must be made. Skills must be practiced. Confusion, hesitation, and vacillation will only put you at a further disadvantage. Every move you make, everything you do that causes the BG to have to respond to your actions, means you are getting inside his O.O.D.A. Loop and slowing him down. Action always beats reaction, and by forcing the BGs to react to your actions, you are inducing stress in him, which adversely affects his reaction time, giving you additional advantage. Be fluid, be flexible. Use whatever means that are available for you to prevail.

    NEVER GIVE UP. You are going to die sometime. You can't stop it from happening. However, you have some control over how it happens and when it happens. Knowing this fact separates you from the rest of the population.

    Now, let the "Mall Ninja" accusations fly! I truly could care less. You handle it your way, I'll handle it mine. JMO
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    Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.

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    Member Array nti06's Avatar
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    I've been robbed at gunpoint before. At that time I was not armed. The only option I was left with was compliance. Fortunately the BG's were ok with leaving witnesses.

    Every situation is always different. There are calculations each concealed carrier has to compute to determine if drawing and firing is appropriate in their situation. Im not saying to be a hero but if you see the opportunity to guarantee your survival vs. the BG's, take it. Even if they weren't going to put a bullet in your skull, you just stopped them from inflicting the same terror on someone else or even killing somebody.

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    Member Array bigdogtx's Avatar
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    Your mindset sets up what you can and will do. If you are prepared, you will come out better than most BG's as they are NOT normally prepared for resistance.

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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    This is a tough one. If the one robber is close enough that I can reach him by standing up and feigning reaching for my wallet then... This might be a good time to grab control of the rifle and try for a well-placed shot to the brainpan. If you can drop the first one fast, perhaps take the rifle and use it to engage the other.

    I'm just armchair quarterbacking though. My reaction would depend on a huge number of variables.
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    Ex Member Array MadMac's Avatar
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    This has nothing to do with you or me being armed during a haircut. The concept of a "barber shop" is more of a social venue for a variety of business transactions (legal or not) in particular cultures. I suspect this is the case here.

  8. #7
    Distinguished Member Array DontTreadOnI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paaiyan View Post
    If you can drop the first one fast, perhaps take the rifle and use it to engage the other.

    I'm just armchair quarterbacking though. My reaction would depend on a huge number of variables.
    I wouldn't want to base my plan on if the thug had one in the chamber or even any in the mag!
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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    True enough, I thought about that. If nothing else, it'd be a good thing to be able to throw at the second assailant. People have a natural instinct to try to block things from hitting them.
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    My reaction in this circumstance is quite easy to decide. I give them everything I have. Even without other patrons around, I'm not going up against an AK with a handgun.
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  11. #10
    Senior Member Array Old Sarge's Avatar
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    What would I have done, you ask? I would have MOVED outta Detroit, 10 years ago. Wouldn't be worrying about it today.
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  12. #11
    VIP Member Array HKinNY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    My reaction in this circumstance is quite easy to decide. I give them everything I have. Even without other patrons around, I'm not going up against an AK with a handgun.
    AMEN

    I carry my cash and some credit cards in my right pocket and my Lic,ccw and debit cards in the left. I know my limits and two against one and each AK-47. They may be the worse shots in the world but anybody can pray and spray. Came for cash they get the cash. Now they start moving to back room. Then it is go time.
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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    This is where your gut and how much you follow the local crime can save your life or help make a decision. If there has been a string of robberries with the same guys and they leave folks alive then you have to factor that in. If they have a compulsion towards violence (besides the fact they are armed) towards the victims in previous robberies then you have to factor that in. Sometimes I hate agreeing with LEO's but nationwide they advocate do not resist because the odds are in your favor you will not be harmed. You know how you made the right decision? You can post your experience on this forum the next day. That most likely meant you did the right thing.

    First Sgt said
    You are going to die sometime. You can't stop it from happening. However, you have some control over how it happens and when it happens. Knowing this fact separates you from the rest of the population.
    I agree with that 100 percent. But we also don't want to hasten it also!

    I am not going to say what I would do in this situation because I do not know where they are standing, handedness, their demeanor, how many other folks are in their, position of the barber. They are all important factors.

  14. #13
    VIP Member Array First Sgt's Avatar
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    I agree with suntzu, toooo many factors in this situation....However...MY main question is: What happens when they discover you have a concealed weapon as they collect your goodies?
    Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.

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    New Member Array Greatllama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by First Sgt View Post
    I agree with suntzu, toooo many factors in this situation....However...MY main question is: What happens when they discover you have a concealed weapon as they collect your goodies?
    That all depends. More than likely they would just take your gun along with whatever goodies you have. I think if they were intending to kill anybody they would of done it as soon as they walked in.

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greatllama View Post
    That all depends. More than likely they would just take your gun along with whatever goodies you have. I think if they were intending to kill anybody they would of done it as soon as they walked in.
    That is not true if it is for a robbery. Even if they kill they usually get the goods first. It is quicker than taking it off of dead bodies. So I would not use that logic at all!!

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