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Robbery gets really bad at Olive Garden. What would you do?

4K views 35 replies 27 participants last post by  sm 
#1 ·
http://www.2theadvocate.com/wbrz/videos/3925457.html

Two Olive Garden employees were robbed in an Olive Garden parking lot at gun point. They were both in the car when it happened. After giving up all the money they had, they were still shot for no apparent reason. One died at the scene. This one hits me close to home. A girl that worked at my old restaurant transfered to the shooting location. Olive Garden kept it hush, hush. She called her old restaurant to tell them what happened. I used to work for an Olive Garden and I know what it is like leaving the store when no one is around. This makes me re-think my tactics in a confrontation of this sort. I assumed that my wallet was worth a human life(mine and robbers, or at least the personal torment involved in taking a human life) and if thats all he wanted I wouldn't draw down. Doesn't sound like all they wanted was the money does it? I would definitely be at a disadvantage with a gun already on me. There were also two robbers. I am not sure if there were two guns. Would you open fire immediately after being confronted, or would you size up the situation?
 
#2 ·
That's a very sad story, and I hope they catch the murderers. :mad:

I don't know the details of what happened in this case, but to improve my chance of avoiding a situation like this, I like backing into my parking spot so I can swiftly leave if I have to, and I try not to hang around inside my vehicle making phone calls and whatnot. I get in and leave quickly or exit the vehicle quickly to walk to where I need to go, and if I spot suspicious people around I find another parking spot further away.

I don't like having to shoot somebody over material things, but when that person's done taking my purse and jewelry, I've got a 50/50 chance of getting killed if he's armed, anyway, even if I've complied with his demands. Robbers don't want to be identified and some want to add to their "street cred," so they shoot.

Having to defend myself while someone already has a gun trained on me doesn't put odds in my favor, but if I'm going to get shot, I prefer to get shot while fighting back.
 
#3 ·
As stated many times...> does the BG have the tools needed to inflict great bodily harm?? Do you precieve this as a threat ?? Do you feel that your life is in danger ?? Why would you NOT feel that a person with a gun pointed at you is NOT going to shoot you ??

Hell,the BG wouldn't even need a firearm. One BG with a blade and he's gettin' shot. Two BG's with baseball bats or golf clubs are gettin'shot. This, if they get within my precived "safe" zone. Not after they already have closed, and raised the bat.

The very low end of the gene pool needs to be flushed down the crapper.

I would agree with Betty's last two para's. Only I'd make the chances more like 70/30. ----------
 
#4 ·
If a robber sticks a gun in your face demanding your wallet, "say ok let me get it for you", reach back and grab your pistol instead. It's all about misdirection.

We had an incident in Minneapolis this summer where a guy was robbed, and shot in the face after he coughed up his wallet. That isn't happening to me if I can help it.
 
#31 ·
If a robber sticks a gun in your face demanding your wallet, "say ok let me get it for you", reach back and grab your pistol instead. It's all about misdirection.

We had an incident in Minneapolis this summer where a guy was robbed, and shot in the face after he coughed up his wallet. That isn't happening to me if I can help it.
I think you said it all...
 
#5 ·
I consider being robbed at gun/knife/club/fist point a threat of great bodily harm or death. I would act accordingly as quickly as possible and in a manner that would put myself and others in as little danger as possible.

This seems to be happening too often these days for no reason. Recently we had a young man killed while he was handing over a team jersey for crying out loud. The fellow from what I have read put up no argument what-so-ever but was killed. This has got to stop and sending a few of these thugs to the happy hunting ground may just do that.
 
#35 · (Edited)
Police: Man Shot In Head During Uptown Robbery



Sadly as much happens all the time and is not unusual.
A recent example of as much that has stuck in my brains long term memory is the following. Be sure to read all of the details as there were various developments...



March 19, 2006 - 'Scholars for 9/11 Truth' student member and bioengineering student Michael Zebuhr dies from being shot twice in the head after his group of four people were mugged by two young individuals the previous night in Minneapolis even though no one in his group put up any resistance to the muggers.

Police: Man Shot In Head During Uptown Robbery
"A 25-year-old man is in critical condition at the Hennepin County Medical Center after a Saturday night shooting in Uptown.
The man was walking with his mother, sister and her friend after they finished dinner in a restaurant at Hennepin Avenue and Lake Street.
According to police, two men approached the group about 10 p.m. at 31st Street and Girard Avenue South. The suspects allegedly stole the mother's purse. Then, even though the victims didn't put up a fight, the suspects allegedly fired two shots, hitting the man in the head.
Kris Arenson, an inspector from the Minneapolis Police Department said, "Usually when the purse is given up, or even if the purse isn't given up, we haven't had any (people) that have been shot."
Police said the suspects immediately fled the scene, jumped into a white car and headed south on Girard Avenue.
Police gave vague descriptions of the suspects, only saying they are men between 17 years old and 22 years old and were both wearing dark clothing." - WCCO (03/20/06)
Link to news report; http://wcco.com/local/local_story_078110804.html


Man Shot In Uptown Dies
"A man shot in the head in the Uptown area of Minneapolis on Saturday night died late Sunday night at Hennepin County Medical Center.
Michael Zebuhr, 25, was a Ph.D. student at Clemson University in South Carolina. He was enrolled in the bioengineering program. He dreamed of working at NASA someday.
He was from Buckhannon, W.Va. and was a 2005 graduate of Davis and Elkins College, a private Presbyterian School in Elkins, W.Va. Officials there said he received B.S. degrees there in chemistry and math. They said he was a student leader as well as a member of the school's ski team.
Friends and family said Zebuhr also loved mountain biking, math and science.
Police said Zebuhr was walking to a parked car with family members, when robbers approached them and demanded his mother's purse. She gave it to the gunmen without any resistance. One of the men then shot Zebuhr.
Lt. Lee Edwards of the Minneapolis Police Department said, "Within a half hour of the incident, we had already had six homicide investigators or six officers with homicide experience already working this thing."
Police are hoping for a break in the case. Several security cameras were pointed in the direction where the shooting happened and police are now reviewing those tapes.
Anyone with more information is asked to call Minneapolis Police at 612-692-8477." - WCCO (03/21/06)
Link to news report; http://wcco.com/local/local_story_080101653.html


Uptown Residents Fight Back After Shooting
"Minneapolis Police are reviewing videotape from security cameras after a shooting in the Uptown neighborhood over the weekend.
Michael Zebuhr, 25, was shot in the head in the 3100 block of Girard Avenue around 10 p.m. Saturday.
Police said on Saturday night, Zebuhr was walking to a parked car with family members, when robbers approached them and demanded his mother's purse. She gave it to the gunmen without any resistance.
One gunman shot Zebuhr twice in the head. Police said the shooting appeared to be cold-blooded and unprovoked.
Uptown's usual upbeat atmosphere remains on edge with no suspects in the case.
She said that although the shooting is a tragedy, it was very unusual and similar crimes rarely happen in that area.
Devens and other neighbors said the rising rate in burglaries and robberies in the area has given them concern.
According to officials, burglary is up 14 percent and robbery is up 43 percent compared to one year ago." - WCCO (03/21/06)
Link to news report; http://wcco.com/topstories/local_story_079230508.html

Link to the above stories as reported at the source; http://killtown.911review.org/oddities/2006.html#March19,2006-Michael_Zebuhr_murdered
At the end of the day the bottomline is that some folks get 'lucky' as their attacker/robber/mugger/carjacker/home invader/attempted rapist choose in an instant to be merciful and leave us be and in intact.
To depend on mercy from wolves though is a fools folly.

- Janq

P.S. - For the record I am not a member of the organization that has reported this information nor am I a supporter of their theories.
I just happened to see this story at the time it occured last March at the Civilian Gun Defense Blog but could not find detail of it today. A Google seacrh on relevant keywords toward this event took me to the '911 Review' site and the story I was looking for.
 
#6 ·
NUMBER 1} Situational Awareness...I NEVER step out a door without doing a scan...I keep my head on a swivel at all times. Keeping the BG at a distance is key to surviving. I never dally after getting in my vehicle, if I have something to do once in my vehicle I will drive a short distance where I can park in "wide open spaces" to do it and keep scanning the area.

NUMBER 2} I have had 2 friends murdered by perps with only "stealing" charges on their sheets. I look at it as preventing someone else from getting murdered in the future. If the legal justification is there...........

NUMBER 3} Distraction. Bill Jorden wrote (paraphrase on) If you know you are going to have to kill a man; walk up to the distance where you intend to do the dead, smile real big and friendly and say "howdy". This will induce confusion in his mind and add at least a full second to his reaction time; guaranteeing that you will be the one to go home to summer (paraphrase off).

If facing a drawn gun do/say something totally out of context; say/do something to divert attention. I have decided (if I can remember if it happens) to look over the BGs shoulder or off to one side, obviously looking at something behind him and softly say "OH SHINOLA". Who could resist taking at least a quick look to see what is going on; and then do what has to be done.
 
#7 ·
USA Today reported a couple weeks ago how there is a distrubing trend in robbers, often teens, killing their victims even when no resistance is encounterred. It has become far more common than in the past and I think is easily tied to the devaluation of human life and lack of common respect instilled from an early age. The fact that it is yonger criminals doing this is the key.

Persoanlly, if I can resist I will. I will only resist though at the time that I feel I will be at the greatest benifit. Decieve and Confuse the enemy.

I had a girl I was friends with marched into the freezer at Taco Bell along with her fellow employees one night in Daytona Beach FL in 91 or 92 I believe. Every one of them was shot or stabbed but amazingly she was the only one who died. I am not dying on my knees in a freezer, I may die there but not on my knees.
 
#18 ·
I am not dying on my knees in a freezer, I may die there but not on my knees.

Hallelujah on that one.

I was discussing with my wife, what I would have done had I been on a 9/11 flight. Basically fight it out, not die like a sheep. She felt that we would be better served by "cherishing the time we had left." Besides the fact that the time left would be spent arguing about just sitting there:argue: , there is no way I'm going down without a fight. If for no other reason than to let the SOB know he picked on the wrong person. I did have to give her credit for her opinion, though. If you KNOW you are going to die, and your actions can't stop it, I understand a little better why some people choose to not fight. I'm just not one of them.
 
#9 ·
Thats nice in theory F350 (NUMBER 3}) but I don't think any Tom foolery will be in order if there is a gun in your face. I can't see myself asking for a quarter for the vending machine. What I am told is time will distort, I will have audio hallucinations, and unless your one cool cookie, all previous plans and thoughts will go out the door. On top of this, it will happen in a few seconds. I like the "here's my wallet shaped kinda like a .45 approach though". Thats pretty automatic and easy.
 
#12 ·
Well unfortunately in the state of Georgia, I couldn't legally carry into to Olive Garden because they serve alcoholic beverages. My wife likes to eat there and I'm in hell when we go because my pistol is in the SUV, not on me. Just tonight we ate at Applebees and I had to disarm before we went in. It is such a pain in the rear! Georgia's laws aren't as gun friendly as some think. Don't even get me started on the "Public Gathering" wording in our law. Some LEOs have misunderstood this wording and they think that anywhere is a public gathering i.e. the mall or Wal-Mart, when really it is a "gathering" like a concert or parade etc. Sorry for hijacking the thread, I needed to vent.
 
#13 ·
I have reconsidered my attitude towards armed robbery because of the people being murdered even though they do not resist.

1. I try to never go into a parking lot after dark. In their case they have no choice, I would use a technique of using a fanny pack unzipped with my hand in it holding the weapon.

2. Survey the lot and using a walking pattern so that no one can jump out of a hiding place with no warning, allowing you time to pull your weapon and use it if necessary.

3. Park your car under the brightest lights and in the most public area. This is what my wife and I do if we have no choice, like going after medicine for a sick child.

4. I also like to have remote start on my car so that lights and engine starting could rattle the criminals from their hiding places. Other options would be to request LEO to escort your employees to their cars at closing.

Just some thoughts, I know these things are easier said than done in a busy day and for people with limited funds. It’s a shame that we have to go to such extremes to protect ourselves from this scum:aargh4: .:mad:

J.S.
 
#19 ·
JS...Good Points...



We can not plan 'completely' for BG scenarios...we can ALL be caught off guard...but being VERY aware in obvious areas (and all other places) could prevent being a victim. BG's select victims ahead of time...DON'T look like a victim!

Stay alert...stay safe!

ret:urla9ub:
 
#14 ·
I will take measures to protect myself, many that have been mentioned before. I will not however, live in a daily fear of becoming someones victim.
 
#20 ·
Robbed at gun point while sitting in your car is going to be very hard to defend against. Thats what the two were doing if I'm not mistaken from the OP'ers report.

That means the BG's waited till they were seated and trapped. Same reason LE want you to stay in your vehicle when they approach it. Unless you had a gun in your hand when they approached and acted against you, you are in some serious trouble.

Car running? Gun it [ pun intended :wink: ], not running? Ouch, not many choices to make without making some moves that will bring about actions on their part that are not going to be conducive to your survival.

Maybe situational awareness could have been better, maybe not, we don't know the specifics. Anyone can be caught off guard no matter how observant they think they are based on terrain and other obstacles used for cover by the BG's. They are not stupid when these things happen, this one being one of the times they thought it out well and caught the two in the car and trapped.

The solution would have been to have a gun in your hand while moving to the car and until you were under way out of the lot. Not many will be able to do that as employees however.

Doc,
We have the same basic law out here, I still will not be disarmed at a restaurant, thats just the chances I'll take, no one is ever going to be the wiser until something happens I need it. Then I'll let the courts figure it out and take whatever comes down.

Unarmed s**ks, and seldom will I abide by some stupid rule if I feel it is not prudent on my part. I'm not alive by accident or by some ordinance/law at this stage of my life and I don't plan on that changing anytime soon.

Brownie
 
#21 ·
I assumed that my wallet was worth a human life(mine and robbers, or at least the personal torment involved in taking a human life) ...
I also strongly believe there are those who feel my wallet is worth a human life. Not my life, though ... I'll defend that, if it's being threatened. Simple parking lot scenario thuggery or not.

Every situation is different, of course.

In parking lots, I try very hard to maintain my situational awareness, given the ease of nearby BG's maintaining cover. My driver's door is the only one that unlocks when the alarm/key fob is pressed. I always immediately lock the door and start the car ... before I adjust the seat and get belted in. If someone were to come up to me and begin making violent demands, he'd likely find himself severely wedged by a 3600 lb car. If merely speaking, he/they would have a chance; if becoming violent, I'd defend.

The one and only time I ever drew was late at night in a parking lot, when two thugs surrounded me and advanced threateningly. I had just exited my car when they verbalized intent and rapidly approached. Since then (thankfully), heightened awareness, simple precautions and a bit of luck have prevailed.

... I still will not be disarmed at a restaurant, thats just the chances I'll take, no one is ever going to be the wiser until something happens I need it.
That's about it.
 
#29 ·
I also strongly believe there are those who feel my wallet is worth a human life. Not my life, though ... I'll defend that, if it's being threatened. Simple parking lot scenario thuggery or not.

Every situation is different, of course.

In parking lots, I try very hard to maintain my situational awareness, given the ease of nearby BG's maintaining cover. My driver's door is the only one that unlocks when the alarm/key fob is pressed. I always immediately lock the door and start the car ... before I adjust the seat and get belted in. If someone were to come up to me and begin making violent demands, he'd likely find himself severely wedged by a 3600 lb car. If merely speaking, he/they would have a chance; if becoming violent, I'd defend.

The one and only time I ever drew was late at night in a parking lot, when two thugs surrounded me and advanced threateningly. I had just exited my car when they verbalized intent and rapidly approached. Since then (thankfully), heightened awareness, simple precautions and a bit of luck have prevailed.


That's about it.
If you're seated in the car and the BG gets close to your window...quickly open the door..that should get his attention.
 
#22 ·
bando-
What I am told is time will distort, I will have audio hallucinations, and unless your one cool cookie, all previous plans and thoughts will go out the door
This is true, but just like "buck fever" when hunting; the more you experience it the better you can control it. I rode on patrol with a deputy sheriff buddy for 7 years, and had several opportunities to experience commercial building searches at night, night time foot pursuits and near gun fights. The first one I was a near basket case and can hardly recall anything, the last one kinda scared me as to the level of coldness I had developed; we stopped the suspects in an abduction/rape and god help me I was looking for justification to shoot.
 
#23 · (Edited)
The thoughts behind this post may not help to address the tactical issue in the situation, but I seem to detect some rationalizations which are being made on a premise that IMO is wrong.

When one sates that a wallet is not worth a life "mine or the BG's" I would agree as regards my life, but as the discussions have established, my life may end whether I give the wallet or not, making this issue moot beacuse it is simply a matter of chance whether or not this guy will or won't shoot. Once he has the wallet, the next move in the game is completely out of my control, because he now has all of the cards. Unless I am willing to gamble on his good intentions for my health, I must choose to defend myself and my wallet. Therefore my life's value has little to do with the value of the wallet in this situation.

I must choose my actions based on the value of his life, if I am to choose rationally instead of out of fear.

The other question with the logic here, as far as I am concerned, is when you face an enemy and that enemy is on the offensive, as in this case, your initial reaction must be shaped by the terms they they are playing by. Meaning:

I automatically assume that the BG must realize that perpetrating armed robbery could lead to his being shot by either the victim or the police (if not, I am not going to waste time accounting for his stupidity); therefore, THE PERP has already decided that my wallet is worth risking his life for, so I no longer need to contemplate this issue. If my wallet is potentially worth his life to him, and his life is certainly worth less to me than him, then my wallet is worth his life under the terms set forth by him. Hence,the BG has predetermined my attitude about his life by setting the terms.

Of course there is no time to think of such things when the crime is happening, so the logic should be thought through ahead of time so that one's mind will be made up. ie. Bad guy with a gun tries to take my wallet = I try to stop the bad guy (which may result in his death); stopping him from taking something that he is willing to risk his life to take, and potentailly save my own life by removing his ability to choose whether or not I live or die after he has my wallet.
 
#24 ·
+1 for sgtd :congrats: tht was well thought out and put my mind on this idea in perspective. it is real easy to say wht you can do but it is not as easy to do it at the time of the moment. Whn I leave my job every night I try everything that I read on here. I dont have many lights in my parking lot so I park under a lighted billboard. My company never has given me a solid answer on CCW so I keep it in my car. (I kinda need my job so as of now no risks) Everyday before I count my cash drawer I walk to my car strap up and finish up my day. As I close and lock the door I walk scanning like crazy and with me hand on my gun. Since my parking lot is so dark it looks like I am going to something in my pocket. Every since I started reading up on this site I have been more aware and have noticed things I would have ever noticed. So I thank everyone for your ideas and may we all be safe and successful when our time with a BG comes.
 
#25 ·
My company never has given me a solid answer on CCW so I keep it in my car. (I kinda need my job so as of now no risks)
You have your answer, carry. If there is nothing in your written policy and you have not been told you cannot do so then you can. To be fired for it when not told it is against policy would be an unjust firing and open them up to legal action. If you are a valued employee they will address the CCW issue with you directly if it is a problem and not coverred by existing policy. If you are not a valued employee you have no job security anyway so what is stopping you?

If the company has not given you a rule against blue boxer shorts would you ask for a written statement before wearing them? Of course you would not. The same applies to CCW. If anything you are lucky a written policy was not created simply becasue you asked about it. There is less than a 1% chance you are going to get a company to say "Why certainly you may CCW here!" The BEST you can hope for is silence on the issue. You have that.

What has happenned to this nation. We were built on the principal of "If the people are not told No the answer is Yes!" That appliedto the Constituion and everything after. We now have the mentality of servants of the crown "If not told yes the answer is no."

I have a new co-worker from Singapore and she has the same subservient outlook. It is frightenning that such a view is taking root here.
 
#26 ·
Quote : "My company never has given me a solid answer on CCW so I keep it in my car. (I kinda need my job so as of now no risks) Everyday before I count my cash drawer I walk to my car strap up and finish up my day."

To add to musketeer's post: If you get killed because you didn't have your gun at work with you, your won't "really need" your job anymore. I think it's a bigger risk that you go unarmed all day, and get your gun at the end of the night by walking to your car unarmed, than it ever would be to carry at work. Besides, it has to look suspicious that you go to your car at the same time every day and then come back. Just an opinion.
 
#27 ·
elrey, check you state laws on this........

In SC we cannot carry into our workplace UNLESS we have permission. Otherwise it's illegal carry.
 
#30 ·
This kind of stuff scares the hell out of me.

I really wish my CCW permit would arrive in the mail, I feel like a sitting duck without it.
 
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