Home intruder: do you have to announce that you're armed?
This is a discussion on Home intruder: do you have to announce that you're armed? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; The PA system in my house has an audible alarm that lets everyone know that an important message is about to be broadcast of the ...
August 6th, 2012 10:47 PM
The PA system in my house has an audible alarm that lets everyone know that an important message is about to be broadcast of the Public Address system. This is common in hospitals and other public places before various codes are announced to let people know to stop and listen to the important message. My pre-message alarm happens to be "bang! bang!" Then followed by, "May I have your attention please. By breaking into my house you won a special prize delivered personally to you at 1200 feet per second. I hope you enjoyed your brief stay in my humble abode. Clean-up on aisle 4."
Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
No Guns, No Safety, No Peace.
August 6th, 2012 10:51 PM
In my many years I have come to a conclusion that one useless man is a shame, two is a law firm and three or more is a congress. -- John Adams
If you think health care is expensive now, wait until you see what it costs when it's free! -- P.J. O'Rourke
August 7th, 2012 02:53 PM
Residents of Utah are allowed to use lethal force to stop a forcible felony....someone breaks in my house, I might shout a warning but I don't have to.
What immortal hand or eye
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?
August 7th, 2012 04:24 PM
Originally Posted by Harryball
I've been a victim of several "attempted" burglaries while at home; and I've been victim to two HIR's. I can tell you in a burglary attempt you may have a chance to call 911 & announce your intent to defend yourself. (maybe?)
In an HIR you may not have time to do anything!
Sometimes you may have a second or two to react. But, if you SA is a little off and you're faced with a professional HIR hit team, you may not even have that.
Personally, we had time to call 911 in the burglaries. But, my stepfather & I had to fight in the HIRs. (Calls to 911 came after it was over.)
August 9th, 2012 11:56 AM
Here's my $0.02:
First off, I agree with several other posters in that the laws vary from state to state. In addition, as part of preparation, might be worth it to consult with an attorney familiar with the laws in your location, and closely involved with these types of cases, to discuss potential scenarios so that you are well-informed. Having gotten that out of the way:
There is no question from a tactical point of view you're better off not announcing ANYTHING. Also, if you feel your life or the life of your family is threatened, you do what you have to to protect your lives.
However, your question was about the law.
If I were a prosecuting attorney in this case, assuming it went to trial, I would argue the following, or some variant:
1) The person "illegally" entering the domicile was drunk/mentally ill/or otherwise of diminished mental capacity and simply entered the wrong house. Therefore the shooting was a disproportionate use of force, as the entrant had no ill purpose. Sure, the house was locked, but I doubt that would be a significant mitigating factor with a jury.
2) The person "illegally" entering the house thought no one was home, and intended only to steal property, NOT to cause bodily harm - therefore the shooting was disproportionate use of force.
In a criminal case, it would depend on what the laws are in your locality as to whether defense would prevail.
In a CIVIL case, I would bet the case would be a 50/50 chance, and would depend on the skills of the attorneys on each side as to who would prevail.
I'm not saying this is right, or makes sense, but this is how I see it.
Like I said, you do what you have to if you think your life is threatened.
I am not an expert, or an attorney, but I do believe considering these types of scenarios in advance is very useful.
August 9th, 2012 03:30 PM
It may not be a law to comply with said request. However, it IS an action much obliged at times 'cause I'm tellin' you son well it ain't no fun starin' straight down a .44.
Originally Posted by l1a1
EDIT: Added link for those who've never heard it before. You can also play it from here LYNYRD SKYNYRD LYRICS - Gimme Three Steps
Last edited by mprp; August 10th, 2012 at 02:12 PM.
Vietnam Vets, WELCOME HOME
Crossman 760 BB/Pellet, Daisy Red Ryder, Crossman Wrist Rocket, 14 Steak Knives, 3 Fillet Knives, Rolling Pin-14", Various Hunting Knives, 2 Baseball Bats, 3 Big Dogs and a big American Flag flying in the yard. I have no firearms; Try the next house.
August 10th, 2012 07:48 AM
That locked door was there for a reason, to prevent you from getting in harms way: my loose bullets!
August 12th, 2012 01:28 PM
Yep! Another reason why I love this state.
Originally Posted by dukalmighty
"The Second Amendment isn't about protecting ourselves against criminals. It's about all of us protecting ourselves from all of you." ---Dr. Suzanne Gratia Hupp to Congressman Charles Schumer (D-NY), 1994**
August 12th, 2012 04:48 PM
Fortunately in SC we don't have to worry about those kinds of idiotic cases being made. Not only is the shooting justified, but you are immune from both criminal and civil actions.
Originally Posted by btanchors
August 12th, 2012 05:17 PM
There has been a number of cases in Texas were the homeowner has shot through the door w/o an entry and still a N/B by the GD (everything in Texas goes through the GD)
August 12th, 2012 07:18 PM
Here in FL you also can't be sued for killing or wounding someone who unlawfully enters your home.
Even better is our sheriff is a big believer in people defending themselves. Just a couple months ago, some drunk guy was banging on a door to be let in and screaming. For some reason the homeowner opened his door and when he did the drunk guy charged through the screen door and came into the home. The homeowner ended up shooting and killing the drunk guy after a confrontation. The sheriff's response in the paper was 'Cornwell "did exactly what he should have done. He protected himself, his wife and his family." I can't tell you how many times I've read similiar quotes from our sheriff when there's a story about a home invasion that ends with the bad guy getting shot. I called the police out here once to report a problem and the deputy's exact words were "m'am you got you a gun?" (At the time the answer was no) and he responded "well you better get you one" and proceeded to make recommendations.
I'd like to think I wouldn't announce anything. From a tactical standpoint it doesn't seem like a good idea and I'm not required to do so. It's hard to say though, in the heat of it - I can see me yelling to get out. When I practice drawing from the holster maybe I should also work on biting my tongue. My biggest concern is if I yell out that either my kids will come to see what's going on or I'll lose any advantage with the BG I may have.
August 12th, 2012 08:42 PM
I will announce to the bg with the muzzle blast from my firearm.
August 12th, 2012 10:14 PM
I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."
August 13th, 2012 12:21 AM
To the OP in response to your question. No there is not a requirement to announce.
Before I start this remember this is what I would do not anyone else.
First point is, as multiple people have stated, know your states laws. Yes your state may have the castle doctrine and that may be where your reading stopped in the manual but part of that may be "You must be in fear for your life or grievous bodily harm" before using force so again know your laws.
Secondly. As has been stated if the person is in the act of breaking in, i.e. still outside, yes a warning would be given. I am not going to shoot through the door, go outside and hunt him down or anything else. Should after the warning is given, from a position of cover, he continue to enter I would take whatever action needed to protect myself and my loved ones. Should he choose to leave great! Police come, file a report event is over and hopefully he is caught.
Lastly if the person is already in the house I would, again from a position of cover, give a verbal warning while having my weapon oriented toward the person. Could I legally shoot without it? Probably but I would rather give the suspect the option to stop that cap a 15 year old who broke in my house on a dare from his buddies. I also look at it this way. I will not fire without positively identifying my target. This includes using a WML to see the person before I fire. One to identify him and second to assure I make the most accurate shot possible given the circumstance.
Unless the bad guy or guys are walking around with a weapon in their hand that act of identifying them with the light or giving a warning does not put me at a tactical disadvantage due to the fact that I already have my weapon indexed and ready to fire. Action beats reaction everytime.
It is very easy to fall into the mindset of "Yep let someone break in and I will cap him in a heartbeat" but situations like this are not always black and white. If the suspect is presenting a clear and immediate threat by all means take action but I have the advantage in this situation so why not use it. Everyone has to make their own decision in regards to this and there is not one correct cut and dried answer to every situation.
As I stated the warning would be given only if there was no immediate threat presented. To me a drunk in my living room who entered the wrong house does not meet that criteria of an immediate threat but things can change in a instant so you have to be prepared for the worst.
"A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013
August 13th, 2012 08:37 AM
Originally Posted by tacman605
I got flailed on in another forum for saying this in so many words in reply to a 'scenario-based' question.
I also like to live by the mantra: "your words (verbal or online) are like bullets...once they leave the muzzle, you can't call them back."
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