Scenario: You come home from work & ........

This is a discussion on Scenario: You come home from work & ........ within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 40calcarry Try talking. The very moment he starts to talk, pop him. The human brain isnt built to multitask in a high ...

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  • Tell the guy to drop it or die

    17 13.49%
  • Shoot him in the head & call the police

    80 63.49%
  • Let him escape with your child & call the police

    0 0%
  • Try to reason with him & tell him that his only way out is to let your child go.

    38 30.16%
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Thread: Scenario: You come home from work & ........

  1. #166
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 40calcarry View Post
    Try talking. The very moment he starts to talk, pop him. The human brain isnt built to multitask in a high stress environment. As soon as he focuses on talking to you, your reaction and the bullet travel at a few feet will be way faster than his ability to fire.
    While he's doin' all this yammering, is his finger still on the trigger? Is it still aimed at your kid's head? When you pop him, is his finger gonna twitch?

    Just sayin'
    All that said....
    It could be worse.
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  3. #167
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 40calcarry View Post
    Try talking. The very moment he starts to talk, pop him. The human brain isnt built to multitask in a high stress environment. As soon as he focuses on talking to you, your reaction and the bullet travel at a few feet will be way faster than his ability to fire.
    I do not think anyone is disputing that folks can place a bullet into the BG. The question is what happens next? Involuntary twitch, his last conscious thought is squeezing the trigger. I do not understand why some folks do not believe that once you shoot the BG in the head that there is a chance your little girl will be dead also. It is not fiction. It is medical fact that he can still pull the trigger.
    oakchas and limatunes like this.

  4. #168
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    I do not think anyone is disputing that folks can place a bullet into the BG. The question is what happens next? Involuntary twitch, his last conscious thought is squeezing the trigger. I do not understand why some folks do not believe that once you shoot the BG in the head that there is a chance your little girl will be dead also. It is not fiction. It is medical fact that he can still pull the trigger.
    perzackly!
    All that said....
    It could be worse.
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  5. #169
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    I do not think anyone is disputing that folks can place a bullet into the BG. The question is what happens next? Involuntary twitch, his last conscious thought is squeezing the trigger. I do not understand why some folks do not believe that once you shoot the BG in the head that there is a chance your little girl will be dead also. It is not fiction. It is medical fact that he can still pull the trigger.
    Yep, he'll pee and poop to. We are making the assumption that the gun will still be pointed at the child. My guess is that the gun will be pointed in my direction, because as soon as I kick the door open, I am the threat.
    40Bob and tcox4freedom like this.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

  6. #170
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Yep, he'll pee and poop to. We are making the assumption that the gun will still be pointed at the child. My guess is that the gun will be pointed in my direction, because as soon as I kick the door open, I am the threat.
    Really? you knocked on the door in the scenario presented... no matter what threat comes through the door... his insurance against that threat is to increase his tension on the trigger finger... You're lucky it didn't go off and kill her when you kicked in the door. Now what?
    All that said....
    It could be worse.
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  7. #171
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Yep, he'll pee and poop to. We are making the assumption that the gun will still be pointed at the child. My guess is that the gun will be pointed in my direction, because as soon as I kick the door open, I am the threat.
    No he won't. The scenario is:
    After knocking, or calling out loud to see if everything is alright, there is still no sound except for a low whimper. You force the door & find your wife & child(dren) held hostage in the room by a home invader. He has your youngest child at gun point specifically pointing at there head.
    I didn't make up the scenario. My answer was in response to the scenario.

  8. #172
    Ex Member Array bmglock23's Avatar
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    So the guy's just sitting there with my wife and child(ren) in a back bedroom waiting for me to come in with my Glock? I think I'd ask him if he has any more of the stuff he's smoking.

  9. #173
    Member Array tricolordad's Avatar
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    Youd think that with the number of times other people posted that theyd do the same as me i wouldnt be catching so much flak...in those few seconds am i supposed to think of all that? All im thinking about is my kids not getting shot, sorry if my opinion differs from yours. How about this...ill protect my family my way and you protect yours in your own fashion.

  10. #174
    Member Array USPatriot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmglock23 View Post
    So the guy's just sitting there with my wife and child(ren) in a back bedroom waiting for me to come in with my Glock? I think I'd ask him if he has any more of the stuff he's smoking.

    No he's not just waiting there. When I created the scenario for the poll, I envisioned that the home invasion happens literally seconds or minutes before you arrive home. To me, if the BG was alerted, he would hole up in a room with your family hoping that you were just a visitor but using them as insurance in case you weren't. I don't think the scenario is far fetched at all & in fact think it is likely given the circumstances given.

  11. #175
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    Before you pull the trigger, you have to consider your ability, Can you hit a 6" diameter moving target?? If you graze him all it will do is piss him off and chances are your child will be killed.
    NOW, that being said, I would take the shot and 9 more.
    I wouldn't just shoot once; it would be multiple shots while moving closer to make sure I stop him.


    Ok I have to ask this. How does the above statement end this scenario without ending the life of your child?

    Great you fire 10 times while advancing on the bad guy hitting this "6 inch moving target" in the cheek, mouth, eye, ear, forehead and so on. He meanwhile due to either fear, involuntary response or a death roll pulls the trigger once, just once and ends your childs life. Now what? Ooops honey sorry, but the bad guy is dead.

    Do you think this guy is gonna sit still while you are advancing and firing? Chances are he will roll away from the threat pulling the child in front of him or on top of him. What now? I realize this is a scenario and there are several endings but come on guys. Can you sit there and honestly say you could do this, cold, with only the training you have had up to this point?
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  12. #176
    Distinguished Member Array tcox4freedom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USPatriot View Post
    No he's not just waiting there. When I created the scenario for the poll, I envisioned that the home invasion happens literally seconds or minutes before you arrive home. To me, if the BG was alerted, he would hole up in a room with your family hoping that you were just a visitor but using them as insurance in case you weren't. I don't think the scenario is far fetched at all & in fact think it is likely given the circumstances given.
    There is one thing that you didn't state in your scenario. But, it would change things drastically. HIR's usually involve more than one BG.

    I've been involved in two HIR's. One was done by only one individual. It started out as a burglary during daylight hours and turned into an attempted HIR after the BG realized someone was home. There was a brief physical altercation. But, I was able to get away & retrieve my SG.

    The other was four individuals in the wee hours of the morning. Two of them had firearms. If I had been alone or if my stepfather & I had not had access to weapons this one would have ended badly for us. But, we were able to get our weapons into play and ultimately that scared the BGs off. (Unfortunately, they were never caught; even though we thought one of them had been hit.)

    -

  13. #177
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    My youngest kid is a 3 year old boy that weighs 50 pounds and trying to hold him still for any reason is like trying to keep hold of a greased pig. He would have his hands full before I showed up. I can't even keep my finger pointed at that little turkey. Each scenario is unique, hard to predict.
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  14. #178
    Member Array tricolordad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    Before you pull the trigger, you have to consider your ability, Can you hit a 6" diameter moving target?? If you graze him all it will do is piss him off and chances are your child will be killed.
    NOW, that being said, I would take the shot and 9 more.
    I wouldn't just shoot once; it would be multiple shots while moving closer to make sure I stop him.


    Ok I have to ask this. How does the above statement end this scenario without ending the life of your child?

    Great you fire 10 times while advancing on the bad guy hitting this "6 inch moving target" in the cheek, mouth, eye, ear, forehead and so on. He meanwhile due to either fear, involuntary response or a death roll pulls the trigger once, just once and ends your childs life. Now what? Ooops honey sorry, but the bad guy is dead.

    Do you think this guy is gonna sit still while you are advancing and firing? Chances are he will roll away from the threat pulling the child in front of him or on top of him. What now? I realize this is a scenario and there are several endings but come on guys. Can you sit there and honestly say you could do this, cold, with only the training you have had up to this point?
    So what you're saying is that we're all untrained (by your standards), and that we should all do what you say because only you have enough knowledge to end this scenario well? Just because you're "on the x in afghanistan" doesn't mean that you are the only one who is or has been there or is proficient with their weapon. In the average home invasion situation, your training will amount to jack because it is a different place, different time and will have different rules. I'm willing to bet that on this site, there are more than a few who have served, be it OEF, OIF, Bosnia, Desert Storm/Shield, Grenada, Vietnam, Korea etc...I have also seen a few civvies at the local range and other shooting events who have attended Front Site or a similar training program and have a better proficiency with their little pocket rocket than I had with my M9 at the height of my service. I have also witnessed my wife's 17 year old sister pick up a pistol for the first time in her life and keep a little over a 1" group after only a few hundred rounds from 7 yards.

    Since you've constantly questioned everybody else, knocked every response and told us we're all unable to do it: enlighten us. Tell us the answer o accomplished one.

  15. #179
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    I don't think tacman is saying he's the only one proficient enough to handle this shot, or non-shot...

    I think he's trying to say what I'm saying. Until the muzzle is off my child's head, it's a mexican standoff.

    I will do whatever I can to make that happen, and no matter what, I am not standing down until he does. His only option for leaving alive is to put down his weapon.

    Now, lets make this scenario real.

    No changes in the sequence of events... Just the addition of Mike's laser... and adrenaline...

    You see something amiss as you arrive home, you decide to clear the house yourself, adrenaline starts to flow... but no real "dump" yet.

    As you proceed through the house, time s l o w s w-a-y d--o--w--n (that's what happens to me in adrenaline dump, ymmv.) As you reach the last door which is closed, and you knock on it... If Sam Peckinpah (sp?) hasn't taken over your brain yet, he probably will when you hear the whimper from within.

    You force the door. If you kick it in you will see the splintering, cracking, breaking pieces fly through the air. If the lights are off or down, you will see clearly.. If they are on, or you have a flashlight, everything will appear super-bright.

    You now see your child in wide eyed horror... And the gun to his/her head... And the finger on the trigger...and the tension in that finger... And you will see any changes in that tension... As you slowly bring your laser sight to just below the perp's closest eye... ... You advance, keeping your sight on his cheek bone... And you see the slightest change in the tension on his trigger... It's an increase... In fact, if it's a firearm with a visible hammer (D A), you see the hammer move a bit, away from the firing pin... The muzzle is still pointed at your child's head... Your wife is saying something, but it sounds like a charlie brown adult...wah wah wah wah wah....

    What's your move now, cowboys?
    tacman605 likes this.
    All that said....
    It could be worse.
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  16. #180
    Member Array CPanther95's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    You now see your child in wide eyed horror... And the gun to his/her head... And the finger on the trigger...and the tension in that finger... And you will see any changes in that tension... As you slowly bring your laser sight to just below the perp's closest eye... ... You advance, keeping your sight on his cheek bone... And you see the slightest change in the tension on his trigger... It's an increase... In fact, if it's a firearm with a visible hammer (D A), you see the hammer move a bit, away from the firing pin... The muzzle is still pointed at your child's head... Your wife is saying something, but it sounds like a charlie brown adult...wah wah wah wah wah....

    What's your move now, cowboys?
    If that is the scenario, it's very simple - you have no choice but to take your best shot. Hammer moving back and muzzle at your kid's head? It's a no brainer. Any hesitation means dead kid.
    tricolordad likes this.

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