Restaurant Shooting

Restaurant Shooting

This is a discussion on Restaurant Shooting within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; There was a shooting at a popular Mexican restaurant in September. The shooter ran into the restaurant, got in an argument with a guy at ...

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  1. #1
    New Member Array joeyturtle's Avatar
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    Restaurant Shooting

    There was a shooting at a popular Mexican restaurant in September. The shooter ran into the restaurant, got in an argument with a guy at a table, pulled his gun, shot him and ran out. My daughter had friends in the restaurant but I was not at the restaurant. The discussion came up about what a law abiding citizen with a weapon (and permit) would do at that point. No one truly knew the shooters frame of mind at the time. His gun swept across the restaurant as he was turning to leave. Do we have a duty to protect other innocents when someone is in the act of violent crime?

    Assume that the shooter was in an area where a safe shot could be taken.

    What do you think and why?


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    As you described it, it was quick and dirty. I would have most likely ducked and covered.
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    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... Buffalo Springfield - For What It's Worth

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    Member Array jryan630's Avatar
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    I agree with oldvet. i would probably have made sure my family is safe and on the ground.

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    Yes, you do have duty. A duty to insure you return home that night to your family. Take cover first. Do what you have to do to protect yourself and family. If he moves towards you, take him out if you can.
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    Distinguished Member Array Chaplain Scott's Avatar
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    Joeyturtle: Hey, WELCOME to the forum. Stick around, lots of wise and very experienced folks here, and mutual respect is the norm on this forum.
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    VIP Member Array rammerjammer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    Yes, you do have duty. A duty to insure you return home that night to your family. Take cover first. Do what you have to do to protect yourself and family. If he moves towards you, take him out if you can.
    Yup
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    Distinguished Member Array Bill MO's Avatar
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    Sounds to me as the fight was over before you would have known there was a fight. If that's it and he leaves then you are not LE so be a good witness get all the details you can, on what he looks like.

    If he threatens all those who are in the restaurant, then the situation has changed and all including you and yours are in danger. Stop the threat as soon and the best you can.

    Also welcome to the forum!
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    Senior Member Array royal barnes's Avatar
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    Secure your loved ones and, unless he threatens you and your family, be a good witness.
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    Senior Member Array DaGunny's Avatar
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    First: Welcome to the forum.

    Second: To answer your question...it depends on State law. In NC, once an assailant moves to withdraw, use of deadly force is prohibited (he's leaving and thus no longer posing an imminent threat).
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    Member Array JayTee's Avatar
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    I guess I'm going against the grain with most people here. Even if my family was totally secure and the bad guy posed no threat to me personally, I don't know if I could simply remain a "good witness" and stand idly by while he executes innocent people.
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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayTee View Post
    I guess I'm going against the grain with most people here. Even if my family was totally secure and the bad guy posed no threat to me personally, I don't know if I could simply remain a "good witness" and stand idly by while he executes innocent people.
    Nobody is standing "idly by as he exucuted innocent people". The OP said he was leaving AFTER he shot someone where there was no time for anyone to react. Different scenario.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaGunny View Post
    First: Welcome to the forum.

    Second: To answer your question...it depends on State law. In NC, once an assailant moves to withdraw, use of deadly force is prohibited (he's leaving and thus no longer posing an imminent threat).
    He's still armed and dangerous, isn't he. Is NC really that restrictive? If he's pointing at me, I'm likely pointing back--regardless of his direction of travel.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaGunny View Post
    First: Welcome to the forum.

    Second: To answer your question...it depends on State law. In NC, once an assailant moves to withdraw, use of deadly force is prohibited (he's leaving and thus no longer posing an imminent threat).
    Not saying whether I would engage or not, but how, precisely does one surmise he is moving to withdraw, rather than, say, retreating to a more defensible position? Unless he drops the gun, throws his hands in the air and screams "Don't shoot, I give up!!!", it reasonable to believe he still harbors lethal intentions to all present. He has shot one person, so why would he not shoot some more?
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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Not saying whether I would engage or not, but how, precisely does one surmise he is moving to withdraw, rather than, say, retreating to a more defensible position? Unless he drops the gun, throws his hands in the air and screams "Don't shoot, I give up!!!", it reasonable to believe he still harbors lethal intentions to all present. He has shot one person, so why would he not shoot some more?
    I see what you are saying in a tactical sense. But I highly doubt a person that killed someone during an arguement will be finding a defensible positionin the resteraunt to kill more people instead of just leaving........jusr saying it makes no sense. Every time we here of shootings like this the dude is leaving.

    That is not saying he is not a threat, but he isn't looking for cover and concealment.
    Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?”
    And I said, “Here am I. Send me!”

    Isaiah 6:8

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    Member Array LaraCroft10's Avatar
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    In this particular situation, it sounds like there's not much you can do. Now, you ARE legally justified to use deadly force in a defense situation if he is infringing upon the lives of others. So if he was "executing innocent people", yeah, I might try to get a good vantage point and take him out. But it's not your DUTY. If it's too risky - you do whatever you need to to protect yourself first and foremost. But in the OP's situation, sounds like he was out the door before you could really register what happened. I would not shoot if the dude was leaving the establishment. Get in a safe area and call 911 ASAP.
    Armey likes this.
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