Real Scenario at my local Wally World

[1MoreGoodGuy]

Sorry but I'm not the type of person who would just stand by and be a "good witness" when someone is in danger.

I'd quickly scan the people around me and I'd point to one of the more responsible looking adults and I'd give them the following command: "You! Call 911 immediately! Tell them they MUST send the police NOW! Will you do that for me?" Hopefully the first person I instruct responds with a yes. By doing this I can place my full concentration on where it needs to be.

Since he is already "threatening to hurt her" and "It really looked like it could go bad FAST!", I'd attempt to deescalate the situation while maintaining a safe distance. I'd shout from behind cover at the end of the aisle. I'd say something like, "STOP! STOP! STOP! The Police have been called! Please back away from one another! The police are on their way." Hopefully this will result in some sort of deescalation and we can all wait for the police to arrive without further incident. If it doesn't, I'd continue to say the same thing until the police arrive or until it became evident that physical harm was imminent.

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[tcox4freedom]

When are we going to get the rest of the story?

Now!

A manager came up talked into a radio and the cops were on the way. I just stood there watching for a few minutes to make sure it didn't get physical. After a few seconds I realized the guy had some kind of mental illness and wanted his mom to buy something and she refused.

He was a big guy; maybe in his early 20's; 6' 3-4" and easily 300+. He would have been a handful hth. But, I already made the decision if I had to intervene it wasn't going to be with a gun. Although, there was no security personnel anywhere to be seen, I think the brothers were doing the same thing I was. (Watching & waiting for the popo while staying close enough to grab the guy should he get violent with his mother.)

The cops came & he put up some resistance and threatened to fight the cops. But they got him under control pretty quick. They quickly assessed and were firm polite & professional; getting him under control and escorting him out of the store without hurting or killing him.

I hear all sorts of bad LEO stories. But, my boys here in the south do a pretty good job! (I'm glad we don't have those pansy cops we here about in NYC, DC & other places that shoot first.)

-

[Brad426]

What a let down. Really the suspense was built up to such a fever pitch there was no way you could live up to the hype. You know, kinda like Pearl Jam's second album...

[tcox4freedom]

One thing I thought about was the fact I was two isles away when this happened. However, I had just been within SIX inches of the guy as I walked by him on another isle. I thought;

What if he had exploded in the same way when I was only six inches from him; knocking things down & throwing cans down the isle?

I'm not sure what I would have done then. But, it most likely would have worked out differently.

[Brad426]

Move away quickly while assessing the threat to your person.

[1MoreGoodGuy]

Now!

A manager came up talked into a radio and the cops were on the way. I just stood there watching for a few minutes to make sure it didn't get physical. After a few seconds I realized the guy had some kind of mental illness and wanted his mom to buy something and she refused.

He was a big guy; maybe in his early 20's; 6' 3-4" and easily 300+. He would have been a handful hth. But, I already made the decision if I had to intervene it wasn't going to be with a gun. Although, there was no security personnel anywhere to be seen, I think the brothers were doing the same thing I was. (Watching & waiting for the popo while staying close enough to grab the guy should he get violent with his mother.)

The cops came & he put up some resistance and threatened to fight the cops. But they got him under control pretty quick. They quickly assessed and were firm polite & professional; getting him under control and escorting him out of the store without hurting or killing him.

I hear all sorts of bad LEO stories. But, my boys here in the south do a pretty good job! (I'm glad we don't have those pansy cops we here about in NYC, DC & other places that shoot first.)

-

Why would you leave out some of the key details in your original post?

[tcox4freedom]

Move away quickly while assessing the threat to your person.

Yep,
As long as his swings & threats didn't become personally directed at me.

Those of us standing around & watching were staying about 20-25' away and did NOT engage the mother or the man. But, mom did know we were there. I think any type of engagement or interference in this case would have only served to escalate the situation. By standing back and not engaging him or his mom, we left any escalation totally up to him.

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[Brad426]

Yeah, I'd have to say you and the other guys handled it well.

[tcox4freedom]

Why would you leave out some of the key details in your original post?

What details?

The manager came up only after four or five men were standing there watching things. She stayed behind all of us & never said a word. The only reason I knew the cops were on the way is because I heard the radio response on the managers radio before she left.

Me just passing the guy a few minutes earlier wasn't relevant.

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[1MoreGoodGuy]

What details?

The manager came up only after four or five men were standing there watching things. She stayed behind all of us & never said a word. The only reason I knew the cops were on the way is because I heard the radio response on the managers radio before she left.

-

Don't you think this is a key detail that totally changes the scenario:

After a few seconds I realized the guy had some kind of mental illness and wanted his mom to buy something and she refused.

And this statement is misleading since you knew that it was a mother and son:

My first thought is some guy is beating up on his wife.

You also said this:

When I get there I can see a BIG white man (6'3" 300+), cussing at this woman knocking stuff off the shelf & threatening to hurt her. (It really looked like it could go bad FAST!)

While true, that is not exactly what you witnessed. You witnessed what was obviously a mother trying to handle her mentally challenged son who was in the midst of an emotional outburst.

[lyz_grace]

Don't you think this is a key detail that totally changes the scenario:



And this statement is misleading since you knew that it was a mother and son:



You also said this:



While true, that is not exactly what you witnessed. You witnessed what was obviously a mother trying to handle her mentally challenged son who was in the midst of an emotional outburst.

I think you might be misunderstanding the thread. He was telling a story and just walking us through his thought process. All of those details you mentioned are things he learned after the end of the original post.

[ANGLICO]

Hey. I like this post! Made me think.

You can now commense to squabble of what was said when.... yada, yada....... (yawn).

One of the Posters here has a saying about your brain being your best weapon... Yep.

@ tcox4freedom (the OP) Thanks for posting. Like I said, made me think. Sometimes I don't do enough of that LOL

[CaveJohnson]

I don't see any reason to do other than call 911 and observantly stand by. No immediate threat to life or bodily harm, the ground rules for intervening.

This.

Sorry but I'm not the type of person who would just stand by and be a "good witness" when someone is in danger.

I'd quickly scan the people around me and I'd point to one of the more responsible looking adults and I'd give them the following command: "You! Call 911 immediately! Tell them they MUST send the police NOW! Will you do that for me?" Hopefully the first person I instruct responds with a yes. By doing this I can place my full concentration on where it needs to be.

Since he is already "threatening to hurt her" and "It really looked like it could go bad FAST!", I'd attempt to deescalate the situation while maintaining a safe distance. I'd shout from behind cover at the end of the aisle. I'd say something like, "STOP! STOP! STOP! The Police have been called! Please back away from one another! The police are on their way." Hopefully this will result in some sort of deescalation and we can all wait for the police to arrive without further incident. If it doesn't, I'd continue to say the same thing until the police arrive or until it became evident that physical harm was imminent.

This sounds like the poorly acted CPR/AED training videos I've had to suffer through. They go "You! Call 911 now!" in a horribly fake way.

[Blackheart6]

I need to remember the "video the incident" part mentioned by Wingit. I have that capability, but don't always think about it.

[BigStick]

When you say mental illness, do you mean phychological, or are you talking like Autism? Because that's what I think when I envision a mother with a son throwing an out of control/tantrum. You do NOT want to get wrapped up in that sittuation. The "man" may be an emotional 5 year old, and not be able to be reasoned with. His mother knows how to deal with him, but if another person gets involved, it may set him off even more. And autistic kids can be very violent and physical. Another reason to not get involved in domestic disputes.

I understand the feeling of not wanting to stand by while someone gets beat down, but this is another case where if you pull your gun, the mother will probably turn against you, just like a lot of battered women will. Ugly all around.