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I did not get my CHL to put on a super hero cape in the morning and stop criminals. It is there to protect MYSELF and loved ones, not to thwart every criminal that walks the on the face of the earth. So if the senario dictates a third party in peril, I will then use my discretion for that matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by pittypat21
Some states "allow" deadly force in defence of others, but none "require" it. Make you own decisions based on your experience and morals.
Cops aren't super heroes either, and no one expects you to be. But you are carrying a loaded weapon capable of taking down an active shooter/BG, and we would expect that if you are carrying it you would indeed know how to use it, and use it effectively. You are not a cop, but you have a one up on the cops: you are already there. you are at the scene of the crime. Why continue to let crime and evil happen when you can stop it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jdunn217
Maybe I just don't understand the selfish line of thinking that only me and mine matter.
It's the "Hey, as long as it's not me" thinking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pittypat21
I am not thinking selfishly. I was also not originally talking about an active shooter, just a bg doing a stick up cash grab(the ones where the greater majority of the time no shots are fired). What are you going to do when your gun happy thinking insinuates a shoot out and the bg hits an innocent? The blood will be on your hands. Are you able to cope with that? A lot of **** can happen that you are not thinking about. You can do everything right in a gun fight and still end up in a body bag. We do have the element of surprise that is strong with cc, but situations can still go sour. Either way you act it is still a very potentially deadly situation. Don't get me wrong. My thinking is the more criminals that get shot, the less that are likely to break into your home and cause you harm later. So I do agree with your points and would probably act in such manner. I'm just trying to think about the entire spectrum of events that could unfold since this is just a brainstorming senario.
And to answer your question why do I let evil happen? Because I can't control the presidential elections.
If you decide to act, yes it will be a mess. No matter the outcome, you are in legal jeopardy. If no one is hurt, or you are not directly threatened with the gun- be a good witness. Take cover if possible. So many bad possibilities here.
This is the voice of wisdom, not Internet bravado.Quote:
Originally Posted by oldnfat
I'll try to be the best witness for the police I can be. The threat has to be against my loved ones or me. Given the senario you described, I'll be at the ready, but taking overt action is probably escalating a situation that otherwise would have been a simple robbery. Don't give Piers Morgan more fuel for his little fire.
If you already have your cc permit, then you already know the answer to the question you asked.Quote:
Originally Posted by RightsEroding
So what is your real reason for this post? What exactly are you looking for?
It's a shame that when someone's opinion is not to run and hide he is accused of "internet bravado".Quote:
Originally Posted by GetSmith
That is the last thing it is.
I could not just take cover if I was armed and let the bad guy take the clerks life. I believe that would be harder to live with then taking the bad guys life. I would always remember that I had the means but not the courage. There is an opportunity cost for everything we do in life and the opportunity cost for me to save another persons life would be very small in my opinion.
I did'nt mean any ofense. If you actually have the training and experiance to deal with a situation like that your a good man. Most people on this board and probably over 90% of those that carry don't. All I'm saying is your actions can cause reactions that escalate the situation and might cause death that might not have otherwise happened.Quote:
Originally Posted by pittypat21
Your bullet could hit a single mother or you gun could scare the BG and cause his gun to blow the head of the cleark off.
I'm not saying I would necessarily do nothing but my first move isn't going to be going for my gun. I'm going to access the situation and use my weapon as a last resort if a life is in danger.
With all the training police have in the heat of the moment even thier choices turn bad. If that happens to them it's part of the job and they have a city and union representing them. If things go bad for a civilian you could cost your family everything they have become accustom to. Just because you can pull your gun doesnt mean you have to or should.
Coulda-shoulda-woulda applies in any situation, "loved ones" or not. If liabilities are your primary concern when carrying, maybe that needs a rethink.
If I can feel I have good odds of stopping it, I probably will. If I don't feel the odds are worth the risk, I probably won't. I say "probably" becuase I am not in that situation, and no one knows for sure what their reaction will be until in that situation. You only know what you think you'll do. Reality changes things in a hurry.
I have found my stance on this issue evolving of late. I used to hold the view that I would stay out of the fight as long as I am not in imminent danger. That is no longer my position. I will of course use SA as my first line of defense, and I will search for cover. But I am no longer willing to just stand by and let innocent people be murdered while simply protecting myself and mine. If I find myself in an active shooter situation and I am in a position to take out the threat, I will do so. Enough is enough.
Edit: I cannot stress enough the amount of soul searching I have done recently on this issue. This was not a decision reached without some degree of anguish. I have felt, and still feel that I have an obligation to come home to my wife safely. However, I have to put myself in the shoes of those who are being killed. How can I just stand by and let that happen? The answer for me is, I can't.
And one thing to remember is that if a BG shoots someone, anyone, this is now an active shooter situation. It matters not if one person is shot, or 10, or 20. He (or she) needs to be stopped before any more damage can be done.
In his scenario no one was murdered or shot. For all we know the gun might not have even been real. If the scenario was the BG ran in and began shooting, it's game on. No hesitation.