Draw? No draw? (Edit added again)

This is a discussion on Draw? No draw? (Edit added again) within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; It sounds like the "old fire horse syndrome" after thirty years of hearing the fire bell ring and reacting the same before realizing he's out ...

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Thread: Draw? No draw? (Edit added again)

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array NC Bullseye's Avatar
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    It sounds like the "old fire horse syndrome" after thirty years of hearing the fire bell ring and reacting the same before realizing he's out to pasture. Right response? Probably not, but understandable. Old habits die hard.
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  3. #32
    VIP Member Array xXxplosive's Avatar
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    In all honesty.....after 2 occasions of up close and personal in the dark, I have no problem with utilizing the Covert Ready Technique.......IMO, as long as it's not an advertised movement and not seen.....I've got no problem with having an edge......say what you will, but experience dictates differently and it's why LE likes it.
    Last edited by xXxplosive; January 31st, 2013 at 02:56 PM.

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by xXxplosive View Post
    IMO, as long as it's not an advertised movement and not seen.....I've got no problem with having an edge......say what you will, but but experience dictates differently and it's why LE likes it.
    I'm not arguing it can have its places for a civilian. I'm just saying a civilian has to be more cautious of when to use it than a LEO. With that said, just because a specific tactic make sense for a LEO does not mean it makes sense for a civi.
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  5. #34
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  6. #35
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    based on what was described... If it were me, and that is how I behaved and a LEO witnessed my actions. I'd be arrested for brandishing a weapon.

    what isn't known. non verbal behavior of the cig beggar. Most likely his voice was strained. Who wouldn't be at 3am outside a hospital. other behavior not noted. like was he wearing a hoodie. (joke) but you get my drift.

  7. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    For those who wish to see the original post and the responses, go to this link. If I am wrong, I'll stand corrected.

    Glad I was Packing My 442

    I went over and read some of the posts. In my view he was wrong to draw. It is true, some BGs use the can I bum a light or cigarette to get close enough to victimize you. But, as a former LEO he should have been able to verbally dis-engage before having to draw. It appears he felt threatened before there was a "credible" threat.


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  8. #37
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    No Draw first ... Then it would also depend on which State this was if he was seen walking into the hospital with the weapon on him. Florida it appears that would be a felony... Though it has not been tested in the system yet6 with a CWP holder

    Florida Statute § 394.458 states “except as authorized by law” it is a third degree felony (yeah – felony!) for any person to bring, carry, possess, or transport a “firearm or other dangerous weapon” upon the grounds of any “hospital (or mental health facility) providing mental health services”. Here’s the actual wording:

    (1) (a) Except as authorized by law or as specifically authorized by the person in charge of each hospital providing mental health services under this part, it is unlawful to introduce into or upon the grounds of such hospital, or to take or attempt to take or send therefrom, any of the following articles, which are hereby declared to be contraband for the purposes of this section:

    1. Any intoxicating beverage or beverage . . . .
    2. Any controlled substance as defined in chapter 893; or
    3. Any firearms or deadly weapon”.
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  9. #38
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    ^^ I know all that, and Jon Gutmacher says it's a gray areas as to carrying in hospitals. By law, hospitals are not on the prohibited places list for those with a FL license, as noted by Gutmacher. The question posed really has nothing to do with the location other than it's a public area, not some guy answering the door in his private residence. The OP states in his post that the hospital had "no weapons" signs posted.

    Still, the question was, in essence, does the OP has grounds to draw a firearm, seen or unseen?
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  10. #39
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    I would say he has no grounds to draw. I didn't see a threat. I have to agree with tcox4freedom. He could have dis-engaged. As a former LEO and if I would have been called to the scene with this information, I can tell you I would have arrested him.
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  11. #40
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    I agree, based on the information you provided in the first post, there is no reason to draw a gun. There is no threat yet. Hair on the back of the neck raised? Yes. Prepare to draw, maybe...

    Be safe!
    NEVER point a gun at something you are not prepared to destroy!
    AND for GODS sake, get your finger off the trigger until you are ready to squeeze the trigger!

  12. #41
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    IMO, no draw.
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  13. #42
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    After reading all the posts here and some on the other forum, I think he was very wrong in drawing. If the BG is that far away and the gun is in his pocket, I would have had my hand on the gun and ready, but once it is clear of your pocket, it is brandishing a weapon. Maybe the BG did not see it, but maybe someone else did. This has a lot of potential to go bad for the former LEO, IMHO.

    Be safe!
    NEVER point a gun at something you are not prepared to destroy!
    AND for GODS sake, get your finger off the trigger until you are ready to squeeze the trigger!

  14. #43
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    I can tell you this........if SHTF and you percieve a threat ....brandishing will be the last issue you'll be concerned with.

  15. #44
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    NO DRAW. Everyone else has already covered the bases on this one.
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  16. #45
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    Draw a weapon,because they asked for a cig?Uh no.I'd hate to know,i was that paranoid.

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