Real life 21 foot rule video

This is a discussion on Real life 21 foot rule video within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Not sure if this has been posted before, I didn't see it but it demonstrates (somewhat) the 21 foot rule in real life...Sure there is ...

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Thread: Real life 21 foot rule video

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array raysheen's Avatar
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    Real life 21 foot rule video

    Not sure if this has been posted before, I didn't see it but it demonstrates (somewhat) the 21 foot rule in real life...Sure there is a lot that doesn't apply to CCW (and most police in this country would probably handle it differently as well), but it's "impressive" to see how many officers the bad guy gets to with the knife before he is stopped. ...I can't imagine how big a knife like that would look when it was coming at you.

    Video

    another link if that one doesn't work

    Scary video, all of the officers involved lived.
    Last edited by raysheen; November 7th, 2006 at 12:11 PM.

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    The sheep-ification of LE. Take out the garbage. Getting killed or crippled is not an "honor" or "measure of restraint", it is usually the penalty for bad judgement.

    No will to kill. Minimal will to live.

    There was recently a Park service LE who was beaten/crippled, because he faced up to a group of "squatting" illegals- they mobbed him. When apprehended, one of them said essentially that they kicked his arse because he was alone, and Mexican Police run when confronted........

  4. #3
    Member Array Maverick7340's Avatar
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    They didn't seem very prepared for the "what ifs". Seems they lacked training. Very reactive and not active.
    Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway.

    John Wayne

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    I could not get that to play - site opened but that was it.

    It sounds like a clip we well may not have seen. I reckon most folks are initially more than surprised by just how rapidly a knife wielding BG can get close and do damage.

    In fact a fast moving and determined knife user can IMO close dangerously fast over even extended distances - more like 30 feet potentially. ......... That's only 10 yards - five long paces!
    Chris - P95
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    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Senior Member Array raysheen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P95Carry View Post
    I could not get that to play - site opened but that was it.
    added another link to another site in case it doesn't work for more people. post in first link and here:
    Video 2

  7. #6
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    Thanks - that one was fine - and I was able to download the file.

    Oh my yes - it does show how a determined knife person can be deadly. That is why it would have been IMO justifiable to have taken him down at the begining as soon as he made actual attacking moves.
    Chris - P95
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    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Distinguished Member Array Bob The Great's Avatar
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    wow. If that doesn't illustrate the danger of a knife-wielding opponent who doesn't care about his own life, nothing will.

    I counted four officers surrounding him (maybe more off-camera), and he managed to seriously injure three of them. I couldn't tell if any of the early shots hit him, but he didn't seem worried about them in the least.

    Scary stuff. Don't underestimate a knife.

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    Member Array jowgafist's Avatar
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    those officers are lucky he didn't grab one of there guns.

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    Senior Member Array jofrdo's Avatar
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    The LE officers completely surrounded the suspect, so that none of them could shoot safely without risking hitting fellow officers with missed shots or overpenetrating shots. Once one officer had been knifed, it took a long time for anyone to bring a firearm to bear.

  11. #10
    Senior Member Array jeephipwr's Avatar
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    Tueller Drill

    The 21 ft rule comes from an LEO in Utah with last name Tueller. I took a tactical pistol class this weekend and Massad Ayoob's video with this guy was part of it. Apparently another LEO found out about the 21 ft rule after he had to shoot a BG. Unfortunatley the judge would not allow the jury to hear the rule because the officer did not know it at the time of the shooting. As a result, the LEO went to jail.

    As part of our training, we did the drill and documented the times with all the students. The fastest time was 1.3 seconds. The slowest, (mine of course) was 1.7 seconds. We each had airsoft guns to draw and fire. Everyone one of use got the weapon out but could only point shoot with minor results. The hands were hit the most.

    Now that we have conducted the drills personnally, this can be used in court in case we are involved in a shooting.

  12. #11
    Member Array AZ Dog's Avatar
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    Unbelieveable that the police were not much more aggressive. May be a lack of training. Here in Arizona, knife wielding BG's don't fair very well against the police...if you know what I mean.
    "The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed." - Alexander Hamilton, The Federalist Papers at 184-188

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    VIP Member Array sgtD's Avatar
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    These cops must have watched too many Andy Griffith re-runs. I think they learned their lesson and I bet they will be more agressive next time. Too bad they had to learn the ard way, and they are lucky that the guy didn't really know how to properly use a knife as a killing device. If he had, there would have been 3 dead, instead of three wounded
    When you've got 'em by the balls, their hearts & minds will follow. Semper Fi.

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    Wow!

    I hadn't seen this film before!

    The cops didn't seem to have much of a plan...
    They should not have positioned themselves to shoot one another...
    It would have been easier open up on the first charge...

    ret
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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    "Detached reflection is not demanded in the presence of an upraised knife."
    -- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Chief Justice

    However, an action plan is, when facing an armed attacker. Planned to be implemented, in advance, to the degree possible. Executed quickly, deliberately and without remorse, lest the results we've just seen be the rewards.

    Brings into focus the phrase "contact distances."
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  16. #15
    Member Array Only Glock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob72 View Post
    The sheep-ification of LE.
    Ouch! That hurts.

    I couldn't agree more. I think in alot of cases, officers are under so much political pressure (politlcally correct pressure) that it causes hesitancy to react, or too much emphasis on non lethal options. I don't think I have to elaborate on it further, but I will not hesitate if the need arises. To me, the greatest dishonor to my oath and badge would be to allow an innocent citizen or another officer to be injured/killed because I hesitated or didn't act at all.
    Last edited by Only Glock; November 9th, 2006 at 03:15 AM.
    When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.
    From the essay "TRIBES" by Bill Whittle

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