Moron Spat at Me
This is a discussion on Moron Spat at Me within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I would call PD now. don't wait. Mob mentality doesn't take long to escalate things out of control.
As for open carry, seems like it ...
November 14th, 2006 02:54 PM
I would call PD now. don't wait. Mob mentality doesn't take long to escalate things out of control.
As for open carry, seems like it would just escalate the situation, what would you do if they decide to start a shoving match?
"In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson
Nemo Me Impune Lacesset
November 14th, 2006 03:57 PM
I like the OC idea. Just walk by and casually drop an OC grenade at your feet.
Seriously though if you were to walk by and blast some OC in the air they probably wouldn't know what hit them.
When OC is dispursed everyone gets a little. Just make sure you have some wipes handy for yourself.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft!
-- Theodore Roosevelt --
November 14th, 2006 04:07 PM
"They're mad because they think we think we're better than them."
You are! I'm with Musketeer, everyone should call the police every time they step out of line. What the heck, they don't like you anyway. I also like the open carry day idea. Bet they would run in panic at the sight of you packing.
DEMOCRACY IS TWO WOLVES AND A LAMB VOTING ON WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH. LIBERTY IS A WELL ARMED LAMB CONtestING THE VOTE.
Certified Instructor for Minnesota Carry Permit
NRA Pistol and Personal Protection Insrtuctor
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November 14th, 2006 04:34 PM
IMHO a real bad idea . Young men in packs tend to egg each other into stupid crap . Agression of any sort should be defensive , and harshly applied . If LE can discurage them its all well and good , and if not at least you are a step up on them by having tried LE first.
I also like the open carry day idea. Bet they would run in panic at the sight of you packing.
Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
We only begin to understand folks after we stop and think .
Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.
November 14th, 2006 05:19 PM
About ten years ago, I worked with a guy who I found out was a convicted felon (home burglary). He told me that he had worked as a salesman for one of the high end vacuum cleaner companies (I’m pretty sure he said Kirby, if I remember correctly). He said he used the job as a vacuum cleaner salesman to facilitate his real job as a burglar. He would use the in home appointments to case the houses he was going to return to later, to burglarize.
Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1
Si vis pacem, para bellum
November 14th, 2006 05:59 PM
Wow, what I missed today at work!
Betty, I helped a friend once in a situation like this. Get everyone on board who has been harassed then give 'em both barrels. Everyone calls the police for the slightest problem. They also seperatly complain to the building management, the local Kirby management, the district and national management. Let Kirby know everything in detail that was done. Then let them know that failure to clear this up fast will cause you to call in the media and every other public venue of complaint you can find. (Think complaining to the city about the public nusence problem, etc). Take pictures, log any contacts and try to pass these idiots in groups if you can.
Another internet resource:
to let the world know about Kirbies employees.
If you stand up and be counted, from time to time you may get yourself knocked down. But remember this: A man flattened by an opponent can get up again. A man flattened by conformity stays down for good. ~ Thomas J. Watson, Jr.
November 14th, 2006 06:09 PM
Oh, that's real nice. I don't let solicitors in my house, thank goodness.
I've done some more thinking on the incident, and I believe one of the men may have been the one who, when our offices didn't yet have a keypad entry installed, wandered into our office early in the morning. It spooked me because I didn't yet have all the lights on and I was alone. He just wanted to use our water cooler. I let him, and then I told him he couldn't come back because our facilites were for employees only. He copped an attidude and didn't bother to say thank you. So I just said "you're welcome" and showed him the door. I made a sign for the door and we eventually got our keypad lock on so not just anybody could wander in.
I'm fairly sure he's the one who gave me a big sneer when he walked back into his office after the incident.
"Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power." - Yoshimi Ishikawa
November 14th, 2006 07:27 PM
Why hasn't anyone contacted the owner of that local Kirby store? Apparently he/she is not there all day, so he/she should know how the employees are acting and treating "potential customers".
Tell them, you walk by the store everyday on your way to and from work, and had been interested in talking about the product, but definately not now.
I feel your complaints should always start with the local owner/operator. Kirby says they are all independantly owned, so start there.
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"You may know where you are. God may know where you are. If you don't tell your dispatcher where you are, you'd better be on speaking terms with God!"
November 14th, 2006 10:05 PM
Time for war.
Incognito of course.
They like to harass you...so harass them.
Pour Skunk Scent (avalibable at the hunting section in Walmart) in their chairs and under their desk on the carpet. Its very powerful stuff.
A dab of SuperGlue in the locks on their desks goes a long way.
Take a napkin, insert a wad of rotting hamurger in it and chunk it in their trash cans .
If they have a coffe machine around, substitute the sugar with salt.
There are many ways to fight back in a non violent,non confrontational manner and anonymous manner...
Just use your imagination.
hecks...the next step towards registration and confiscation.
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November 14th, 2006 10:10 PM
Betty, all Kirby dealerships are independently owned. Usually the owner of the dealership is very aware of the impression his employees make. A business that gets customers mostly by word of mouth usually is. I once worked for a Kirby dealership and the owner had a very specific image he wanted portrayed. Because often we were giving demonstrations in homes where only the lady of the house was present he was especially concerned about how we addressed the lady and had training for his sales people so that there was never an excuse for acting in a way that would cause any concern. Most owners have a lot invested in their business and want to know if there are problems. Providing the Kirby company information about the dealership in question should bring an immediate response both from Kirby and from the owner of the dealership.
I know it is possible for someone to have a dealership who doesn't care, but it is unlikely. If the company addresses a problem with the owner and it does not get resolved quickly the owner will likely lose his dealership. So there is a very good chance that the problem will be addressed very quickly. Keep us informed as to what happens.
Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein
November 14th, 2006 10:14 PM
I always hate to hear about this sort of thing. I agree with those who said, to call the police, kirby, their management, the owner, their grandmothers, and anyone else who will listen.
For now, I would suggest packing your lunch, or ordering it in, to minimize trips past these thugs.
November 14th, 2006 11:03 PM
Click on Legislation, then Tennesse Code. Link takes you to LexisNexis; click on left side of screen for Java applet to open...drop menu opens for State Code.
Title 39, Chapter 17, Part 3, Sub-Sections 305 & 309 may be of use to you in this case:
39-17-305. Disorderly conduct.
(a) A person commits an offense who, in a public place and with intent to cause public annoyance or alarm:
(1) Engages in fighting or in violent or threatening behavior;
(2) Refuses to obey an official order to disperse issued to maintain public safety in dangerous proximity to a fire, hazard or other emergency; or
(3) Creates a hazardous or physically offensive condition by any act that serves no legitimate purpose.
(b) A person also violates this section who makes unreasonable noise which prevents others from carrying on lawful activities.
(c) A violation of this section is a Class C misdemeanor.
39-17-309. Civil rights intimidation.
(a) The general assembly finds and declares that it is the right of every person regardless of race, color, ancestry, religion or national origin, to be secure and protected from fear, intimidation, harassment and bodily injury caused by the activities of groups and individuals. It is not the intent of this section to interfere with the exercise of rights protected by the constitution of the United States. The general assembly recognizes the constitutional right of every citizen to harbor and express beliefs on any subject whatsoever and to associate with others who share similar beliefs. The general assembly further finds that the advocacy of unlawful acts by groups or individuals against other persons or groups for the purpose of inciting and provoking damage to property and bodily injury or death to persons is not constitutionally protected, poses a threat to public order and safety, and should be subject to criminal sanctions.
(b) A person commits the offense of intimidating others from exercising civil rights who:
(1) Injures or threatens to injure or coerces another person with the intent to unlawfully intimidate another from the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured by the constitution or laws of the state of Tennessee;
(2) Injures or threatens to injure or coerces another person with the intent to unlawfully intimidate another because that other exercised any right or privilege secured by the constitution or laws of the United States or the constitution or laws of the state of Tennessee;
(3) Damages, destroys or defaces any real or personal property of another person with the intent to unlawfully intimidate another from the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured by the constitution or laws of the state of Tennessee; or
(4) Damages, destroys or defaces any real or personal property of another person with the intent to unlawfully intimidate another because that other exercised any right or privilege secured by the constitution or laws of the United States or the constitution or laws of the state of Tennessee.
(c) It is an offense for a person to wear a mask or disguise with the intent to violate subsection (b).
(d) A violation of subsection (b) is a Class D felony. A violation of subsection (c) is a Class A misdemeanor.
(e) The penalties provided in this section for intimidating others from exercising civil rights do not preclude victims from seeking any other remedies, criminal or civil, otherwise available under law.
Get local LE involved, these people are criminals and need to get taken care of.
Sorry for the long post.
November 14th, 2006 11:41 PM
I'm starting to wonder if it's just a Kirby thing!
All summer long, every 2-3 weeks a van load of them from the Sacramento area hit the neighborhoods here in Reno.
If you try to be friendly and say no thanks, you're in for an argument.
I actually had to physically throw one of their punk sales people off my property and call the police this past summer.
Nothing but high pressure sales tactics that leads to intimidation tactics!
I wouldn’t use a Kirby if they gave them away free! And now they're messin' with Betty!!!
ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!
"A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
November 15th, 2006 08:53 AM
So can we work for spitting/assault to become a Capital Offense, and legislatively authorize lethal force? I'm all for it!
Originally Posted by katmandoo122
Spitting on someone ranks pretty high on my list of ways to evoke a disharmonious response.
Yes and the situation is sure to escalate.
Originally Posted by Redneck Repairs
"Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18
Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
Paramedics With Guns Scare People!
November 15th, 2006 09:19 AM
Tennessee ... spittin' on the sidewalk is still an offense, yes? Wouldn't surprise me that spittin' on a person would constitute fighting words.
Hey, being controlled by Buffett, don't underestimate the power of a simple letter addressed directly to him. He's a stand-up sort, and I can't imagine he'd let such crap continue to fly at a company he's controlling, where the behavior of folks in the a company he controls are so vile.
These folks are hoodlums, dressed up in suits. They're going to step too far, at some point. It's a cauldron. They (the BG's) know what happens to cauldrons. They're counting on it, for jollies. Bad for you, if it reaches that point.
I like the idea of the camera concept. Hooking up a wireless minicam that monitors the sidewalk outside that business might be just the ticket to get the hoods on camera, doing what they're doing. Easily mounted in a discreet location. Want proof of their harrassing behavior? That'll do it.
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