Where/how/to what extent do you shoot?

This is a discussion on Where/how/to what extent do you shoot? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I teach handgun, shotgun, tactical rifle, and close quarters combat (hand to hand) to police officers and I have actual, sorry to say experience, in ...

View Poll Results: READ THE POST FIRST, THEN ANSWER.

Voters
213. You may not vote on this poll
  • Using sights - 2 COM shots, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    32 15.02%
  • Using sights - 2 COM + 1 Head Shot, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    13 6.10%
  • Using sights - All COM shots until slide locks.

    17 7.98%
  • Using sights - 1 Head Shot, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    0 0%
  • Using sights - All Head Shots until slide locks.

    3 1.41%
  • Using point method - 2 COM shots, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    70 32.86%
  • Using point method - 2 COM + 1 Head Shot, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    21 9.86%
  • Using point method - All COM shots until slide locks.

    39 18.31%
  • Using point method - 1 Head Shot, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    0 0%
  • Using point method - All Head Shots until slide locks.

    4 1.88%
  • Using laser - 2 COM shots, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    4 1.88%
  • Using laser - 2 COM shots + 1 Head Shot, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    5 2.35%
  • Using laser - All COM shots until slide locks.

    2 0.94%
  • Using laser - 1 Head Shot, then check if target keeps advancing towards me.

    1 0.47%
  • Using laser - All Head Shots until slide locks.

    2 0.94%
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 41

Thread: Where/how/to what extent do you shoot?

  1. #16
    TPO
    TPO is offline
    Member Array TPO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    26
    I teach handgun, shotgun, tactical rifle, and close quarters combat (hand to hand) to police officers and I have actual, sorry to say experience, in these type of scenerio(s)....At 15 feet with 2 seconds reaction time the vast majority of people cannot draw and fire before the BG is on them. If you personally can or know of those who can; then train with them and try to learn their skills; because in the real world at this distance its gonna have to be close quarters combat involving deadly force. If ya'll do not believe me then PLEASE try it with the BG, rubber knife and GG with paint ball gun or simmunations ammo. Unless the GG already has the firearm up and ready to shoot he/she will be stabbed, clubbed or shot. Even then as you are shooting you must be moving out of the direction of the attack----and under flight/fight psyhlogical reactions it is next to impossible without extensive training. Please try this before even think of trying to draw and shoot under these conditions.
    Only those with superhuman reactions and superb training are even going to come close to stopping a determined BG. If you are able to draw and shoot and move to the side in the given conditions then give serious consideration to teaching others how to also. I do not want to sound preachy but attenpting the wrong technique at a critical juncture could end with very regretable results or death.
    Handguns are terribly poor at effecting one or two shoot kills with a stoppage of action on the BG's part. You might get lucky and kill the BG but they will live long enough to kill you also. The whole purpose of self-defense is for the GG to go home the same way and in the same condition that they left-----ie not leaking blood, blouse still relatively intact, and healthy.

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #17
    Moderator
    Array RETSUPT99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    44,558

    I'm With Kimber On This One...

    Yep, my Kimber Ultra...probably not much time to think...just point and shoot...

    I will shoot to stop the threat...two shots...two mags...

    "I feared for my life, and I shot until the threat was stopped!"

    Officer, I will be glad to make a statement and speak with you as soon as I contact a lawyer to ensure that my rights are protected...
    Actually, we're in good shape in FL for the ability to protect ourselves...thanks to the FL legislature and Jeb!

    OMO

    ret
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

    ***********************************
    Certified Glock Armorer
    NRA Life Member[/B]

  4. #18
    Senior Member Array Devone6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    South of North, North of South
    Posts
    654
    Point and shoot, with an indirect focus on sights, as training should kick in. I'm a double tap man, but at 15 feet, if I could even clear leather, keep on shooting as he is on me at the first shot (if i get a shot off................).

  5. #19
    Administrator
    Array QKShooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Off Of The X
    Posts
    35,153
    At 15 feet & advancing & with a clear background then I am point shooting all head shots and I personally see no reason to move down to Center Of Mass.

    At 15 feet and coming at me...I might take #1 & 2 right out of the leather on the way up.

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    OBX, NC
    Posts
    2,655
    Under these circumstances, I would probably miss a few, but they would be bumper-to-bumper and the last few would probably impact his corpse as it slide toward me along the floor.

    However, I would probably have moved when I first saw this person - too 'spooky' for me not to give some distance or put an object between us. Sounds like some heavy drug thing got him.
    Last edited by obxned; January 17th, 2007 at 05:25 PM. Reason: additional thought

  7. #21
    Senior Member Array gwhall57's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Midlothian, VA
    Posts
    542
    My real nswer isn't listed as an option - keep shooting until the threat to my life ends. If the first shot does the job, then stop after 1. If it takes 2, 3, 4...keep shooting until the threat stops.
    I've read in "The Ayoob Files" where LEOs have been killed or injured because they fired a "double tap"COM, and then stopped to assess the result, while the BG just kept shooting...
    "Bad spellers of the world - untie!"

    DAV Life member, NRA Life member

    Springfield XD 9mm Sub-Compact
    Taurus PT111 Millennium Pro 9mm

  8. #22
    Senior Member Array PaulG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Fairfax, VA
    Posts
    1,126
    First, I apologize for screwing up the voting. I voted all head shots using sights but I meant all head shots point shooting.

    My best time drawing from concealment was 1.26 seconds. My second best time doesn't come close to that.

    At 21 feet Tueller's test shows that an out of shape male can cover that distance in less than 2 seconds.

    If your situational awareness is such that you know the bad guy is going to do something and you react immediately, unless you are very quick and get an immediate head shot, the bad guy will get to you whether he is shot or not.

    Getting of the X is crucial but depending on how fast he is coming at you, its possible that the best weapon to reach for is the bad guy's weapon.

    If you are me (old, fat and out of shape) that might not be the best option. But if I am going for my gun, I will be moving while drawing and planning a very close point shooting head shot.

  9. #23
    Distinguished Member Array lowflyer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Middle Earth
    Posts
    1,221
    I would draw, carefully line up my sights, eat a grilled cheese sandwich, and then unload a magazine into COM.
    Whatever doesn't kill you postpones the inevitable.

  10. #24
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    5,133
    First off I will " tacticly defficate " for lubrication while i move out of the charge , drawing all the time . Then at that range i will shoot head shots untill the bad boy goes into timeout . As far as sights go i suspect i will actualy think " Front sight " about the middle of the first mag. This does not mean that i will not use sights or index off of them , just that my focus will be on my movement and the bg's movement letting muscle memory and subconcious index howeaver it works take care of the close range rounds on target. oO( at 15 ft and considering i am 6' tall , its basicly a close to contact shooting . )
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
    We only begin to understand folks after we stop and think .

    Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.

  11. #25
    New Member Array LE743's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    10

    That's a bad situation.

    Contact weapon or not doesn't matter at this distance. Stepping off line during the draw stoke is mandatory, and there is a very real possibility that you will not complete the draw stroke. In that case you will have to go hands on with the hope of creating distance to take care of your business. As for how to shoot and how many rounds. The outcome of the previous action will dictate sighted or unsighted shooting, and always shoot until the threat stops. Then reload, access and scan for additional threats....Well, at least that's the easy answer.
    If trouble finds you, fight like the third monkey on the ramp of Noah's Arc.

  12. #26
    Member Array swedgin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    roy utah
    Posts
    76
    You didn't have enough options or specifics. Ayoob recommends a shot to the pelvis on an assailant with a contact weapon. I agree with Ayoob, but if it's a gun he has then it's 2 com and 1 to the head probably just pointing the damn thing. If I can't tell what type of deadly weapon he has than how do I know it's deadly?
    If he was gonna decorate his bar with my friend, he shoulda armed himself.

  13. #27
    Member Array shooter1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    198
    I voted: point and shoot to slide lock. It was the closest to best answer for me. What I hope I would do is point (no time or need for aiming at that range) and shoot until the goblin ceased hostile activities. A quick reload and a 360 check, call MEMS, my lawyer and the police, reholster. Render any reasonable aid to the subject. Get my ID out to identify myself as a good guy, and pray for the best.
    str1

  14. #28
    Member Array produman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Sunny,Fl
    Posts
    322
    double tap center mass. if still coming, continue doubles till threat is ended.
    "May God have mercy on my enemies, because I won't."
    General George Patton

  15. #29
    Member Array steve-o's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    42
    I would fire upon unholstering and keep shooting until there is no longer a threat.
    "Its's better to have it and not need it, Than to need it and not have it"
    [I]Steve-o

  16. #30
    Member Array fireman69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Fremont, Nebraska
    Posts
    38
    I voted for point shooting, 2-COM and 1-Head shot but realized this scenario is in a bank line. If that's the case I'm dead. I can't legally carry concealed into a financial institution here in Nebraska.
    Fireman

    Carrying either a Glock 23 or 30 each w/ TruGlo TFO in Comp Tac C-TAC holsters since obtaining Nebraska CHP in Feb. 2007

    <---------------------The reason I carry.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Road Rage Good Shoot / Bad Shoot
    By Hot Wing in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: July 13th, 2010, 06:54 PM
  2. Simple Shoot - No Shoot test Online
    By First Sgt in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 265
    Last Post: July 12th, 2010, 04:18 PM
  3. To what extent can you fit to your rifle?
    By Serendipity in forum Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: April 27th, 2010, 10:10 AM
  4. Interesting shoot no shoot at the local Wally World.
    By Riccur in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: January 27th, 2010, 12:47 PM
  5. Good Shoot/Bad shoot? Pastor Killed
    By Rustynuts in forum In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: September 3rd, 2009, 09:50 PM