Scenario: In home surprise

This is a discussion on Scenario: In home surprise within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; This is a situation I have considered on several occassions. You have returned home later in the evening. The sun has already set and night ...

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Thread: Scenario: In home surprise

  1. #1
    New Member Array Partisan_Ranger's Avatar
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    Scenario: In home surprise

    This is a situation I have considered on several occassions.

    You have returned home later in the evening. The sun has already set and night time darkness is becoming a factor. You exit your vehicle from where you normaly park it, arm full of groceries, dry cleaning...ect..and a hand full of car/house keys. You unlock the door and slip inside shutting it behind you. You turn around and find yourself faced with a unknown subject. He is average height, weight and is armed with a tire tool.

    He is about the length of the room from you and does not utter a word but advances toward you bringing his weapon up. Your hands are full, the subject is advancing making his weapon ready and your weapon is of course concealed. What is your reaction? Also consider, you donot know if he is alone or not and where other perps might be located.

    I'm very interested in the many options that people will come up with.

    Partisan Ranger :comeandge
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence in their behalf.

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  3. #2
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    Drop the stuff , get out the front door. Hold the door while drawing weapon. Retreat to neighbors and call PD. Turn on all outside lights at neighbors. Watch yer 6 and hold tight. Observe and stay sharp. Unknown # of intruders, + the burden to retreat if possible , sway my choice.

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    Ex Member Array F350's Avatar
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    Throw everything AT the BG; draw and fire; here in Missouri even inside your house you can not shoot unless in fear of life and limb, surprised in my own house, BG armed and advancing I am in fear. I have a 24% loss of use of my right shoulder so fighting is out, I have 2 bum knees (second surgery on right kness scheduled for FEB 14) so fleeing any distance is out, shooting is only real option.

    P.S. when first entering the house in said situation, I only have my left hand full. I live in a very rural area and I had a friend murdered in very similar circumstances. I enter, put groceries down and make a sweep of the house before any further unloading etc.
    Last edited by F350; January 27th, 2005 at 11:07 AM.

  5. #4
    Member Array WyattEarp's Avatar
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    I would drop everything i have, (I can always buy it again later, but i only have one life) pull out my gun & tell the perp to drop his weapon or i will shoot him. If he continues to come towards me with his weapon in hand, i will warn him one more time before i shoot him. If he drops the weapon, i will have him lie down on the floor face down while i call the police & sound my house alarm panic button. Since i don't know if there are others in the house & i don't have a way of restraining him so i can go check, i would put my self in a defensive position until the police arrive.

    In my case my damn house alarm should have gone off when they broke in!!!! lol
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  6. #5
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    As most of you have read in a different thread, I was burglarized a month ago. It was more than one person and they beat in the front door. Maybe they didn't care if I was at home or not. I'll probably never know.

    I did not describe the details of what I did when I opened the front door, but I will now. When I came home and found the chain lock mysteriously engaged on the door, it was then I realized I had been burglarized. Through the crack in the door I saw my living room trashed. A hard kick disengaged the chain lock, and I went from room to room, clearing the place. (Yes, I do know how to clear rooms, though one person room clearing isn't the greatest, safest thing in the world.) But - I've always said to never do such a thing unless you have a vulnerable loved one stuck in there. I didn't follow my own advice, and even though the outcome was satisfactory, I certainly won't be doing something like that again. My life is worth more than my property. After the police came and filed their report and I was left in a home that looked like a tornado went through it, the "what if" scenarios started going through my head. What if I didn't leave for the weekend and these guys came? What if I had been asleep or in the shower? What if they were still here when I came home?

    It angered me to know someone had been in my home and through every closet and dresser drawer. The feeling is violating. The anger itself makes me want to give them sucking chest wounds. All I know is that when I ran through my "what if" scenarios, I was happy there was no one there when I entered. It would have been bloody, and some of that blood could have been mine.

    So what would I have done in this scenario? I'd prefer rocky's answer. (I'd probably hurl my stuff at the guy as a disctraction.)

    If I don't think I can make it back out that door before he's on me... He's coming at me with a weapon. I'd hurl my stuff at him and draw and shoot. I do not have the distance and time to risk negotiating with the man - handguns aren't the best stoppers and I'm not a big person. After that one, I'm getting my butt out of there. I'm not going to stick around to see if he has sidekicks.
    Last edited by Betty; January 27th, 2005 at 12:01 PM.
    "Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power." - Yoshimi Ishikawa

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    Senior Member Array KC135's Avatar
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    First, if you are going to walk around in condition white, you will at some point have a problem.

    If I know no loved ones are at home, I exit the house. Use cell phone. Get out of the way. If subject follows me, I defend myself.

    If there are loved ones in the house, invader gets what I am carrying in left hand. Right had is empty, do not carry stuff in right hand. Handle invader as necessary, shooting in a direction that protects loved ones.

    Get loved ones out of house, call police.
    Keep the shotgun handy!!

  8. #7
    New Member Array Partisan_Ranger's Avatar
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    This is good stuff,
    I guess I'll toss in my opinion and possible actions.
    As I enter the door and see the subject, I would as several of you have suggested toss the contents of my hands to the intruder. Things being as they are in my home, my time to react is of the essance. I have no more then 12 ft at the max. for this guy to advance through before he is on me completely. All he has to do is cross 9-10 ft since he has a extended reach of his arm and the added length of his weapon.

    Since my T.V. and couch would have me pinned a bit I would have little choice then ethier attempted to evade, block and draw. Anyone closer then 20ft to you if they are set to do you harm they will be on you before you can clear and fire. If I try to open the door I have to turn and expose my back to the attacker, so no back peddle gonna happen here.

    My choice is limited by distance and speed. I am not a small man so a struggle could be a choice. But, size not withstanding and not truely a means to gauge the out come of a hand to hand type exchange I would rather not take a hit from the tire tool to draw so evade and draw is my option. The luck of my situation is you can see pretty much the rest of my house from the living room save of course the insides of the bathroom and bedrooms and the kitchen You however can see anyone coming out of those areas.

    Since I am completely engaged and the fight is on and I'm not gonna have time to tell this subject to drop anything. If someone else is in the house I'll let them know I'm home from the muzzle blast of my pistol. I figure fighting one at a time is enough. I would attempt to drop the attacker and take a position clear of the door way in my living room, take my cell and call the P.D. keeping my eyes on the other part of the house. I'll just hold on to what I got and oblige any of this guys friends in or outside the house to come to me.

    This is my best solution to this situation. It's my hope that it never need be resolved. To those of you who have suffered some sort of loss due to a break in or invasion I am honestly sorry.

    Partisan Ranger :comeandge
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence in their behalf.

  9. #8
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    Well since my alarm should have went off it shouldnt be a problem ina perfect world but i know better..

    So I would throw the crap i had in my hands at um while drawing and shoting my one stop if i have time if not and there no possibilty i could retreet out the door i would plug um plan and simple .

  10. #9
    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    In my case, he or they would have had to get past a burglar alarm and two 140 pound dogs. So if my wife is not home, then I back out after throwing stuff at BG. OTOH, if wife's car is in driveway, I still throw stuff at BG and draw going for one to the chest and followup to the head....and I clear the house until I confirm status of wife. Perhaps not the smartest move nor what I would recommend to anybody else (like Betty), but I don't turn my back on my wife. Our home is only single story and 1800sqf so IF I can get to my gun room and it's not been compromised, I can rearm with something major and suited to the role pretty quick.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  11. #10
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    I will remove the big dogs from my home to enter the scenario as described above.

    I woudl toss everything and anything I had in my arms to buy me a second or two and draw as quickly as possible. The fact that most doors open inwards does not bode well for an exigent evacuation. I have run drills with mock pistols and mock knives and you would be surpised how quickly a knived assailant can close distance on you and inflict mortal wounds before you have brought your gun into the mix.

    I suggest you all try this with a training buddy, it was a serious eye opener. I had originally felt a knife in a gun fight was a serious disadvantage till I was told to run a few drills. That is why I believe to get your gun out as fast as humanly possible because a knife can win in a gun v. knife fight.

    Start out at three yds seperating you and your trainign buddy, and see if yoru buddy can tag you before you draw and click (OBVIOUSLY MAKE SURE PISTOL IS CLEAR. We used a toy pistol that look sidentical and feels clos eto a 1911 (weight is off though). ANother reason I would like an airsoft in 1911. Next run drill @ 5yds, than 7yds, and then 10 yds seperation. You will be surpised. TRUST ME.

    I had a real life sit happen similar to this. We never use our front door and enter through the garage. I pull into the garage in wife's car after just having dropped her off at the airport to fly to NY. I was thinking how in the hell am I going to feed myself and sleep as I hate to cook for myself and we have been together for almost 10 years sharing the same bed. Head was not in the game is what I am trying to get at.

    I pull in as I was saying and have groceries in one hand and mail in the other. I usually just walk to the garage door entrance and hit the garage door button there. As I was walking I had a sense I was being watched. A male in black clothing with a large knife had entered my garage and was not prepared for me to turn around. I launched the groceries and mail at the guy and drew my weapon. I also opened the door and out came my dogs. They pounced on him quick. Quicker than I thought was possible. I honestly do not think I had a clean target acquisition before they were both on him. I reached for the phone (still in the garage) and called 911. I explained I had an armed individual in my garage. I told the Operator I was armed and that I would put the phone on speaker until the cops arrived. 9:24 seconds it took for them to arrive. Still gives me pause to think about this. I did not shoot as my dogs were in line of fire and I did not feel threathened. in retrospect that is bad order. I was nto in threat and dgos were in line of fire. He was taken to jail. I contacted my lawyer and told him the particulars and he said not to worry. He would handle it all. He filed a suit the very next business day against this male.

    I still wonder what I would have done had I not had dogs. I think I would have shot. I do remember his eyes when he saw the dogs and the pistol. I am glad he did not harm either of my dogs with the knife. That would have really set me off.

    I do know he has limited use of his right arm and left leg and he will be in jail for at least 4 more years and that I am to be notified should he come up for early release/parole.

    When my wife arrived home, I ran this scenario for her many times and we have tried many variations on this theme.

    We do things differently now that this situation has occured to me.

    ~A
    Last edited by APachon; January 27th, 2005 at 10:55 PM.
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  12. #11
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    The did a knife demo in our ccw class at 22 feet the gun can be on you and stab you before you draw and fire twice

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    See y'all. Bud thanks for the input. How long is your garage? I do not think mine is over 30 feet long. That is close.
    Fave Quotes

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    Henry Ward Beecher

  14. #13
    Member Array scbair's Avatar
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    OK, here's my course of action:

    Drop (or throw, as appropriate, depending on size & weight) packages. Use weak hand & arm as shield against raised bludgeon (pretty well accepted CQC response), either retreating out of reach or, more likely, charging into the assailant (stay OUT of "home run alley"). Draw CCW and apply as necessary!

    I'll accept an injured weak hand/arm to deliver threat-ending countervailing force ("... to slide-lock").

    I've been assaulted by individuals armed with blunt instruments, and the "rush" technique really does minimize damage! A bludgeon is only useful within a narrow range; in grappling range, unless the wielder is well-versed in stabbing and locking techniques, it is not very effective (one reason I prefer a blade as a last-ditch back-up; you can cut at any range within reach).

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    Membership Revoked Array clubsoda22's Avatar
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    ok, lets just say he jimmied the lock and i didn't notice anything wrong. In my state there is no duty to retreat in your own home. Drop the groceries, draw and shoot from guarded retention.

    1. ability: The tire iron

    2. opportunity: I am within striking distance

    3. manifest intent (imminent jeapordy): Approach in an aggressive manner, raising to strike

    4. preclusion: No duty to retreat in my own home

    That means it's a good shoot. If anyone has any questions as to what guarded retention position is, i'll post a picture if i can find one.
    Last edited by clubsoda22; February 1st, 2005 at 03:30 PM.

  16. #15
    Ex Member Array F350's Avatar
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    The did a knife demo in our ccw class at 22 feet the gun can be on you and stab you before you draw and fire twice
    That is why in many states there is codified the “Reasonable Man” in self defense; example, in Iowa when I took the CCW class it is codified that when threatened with a stabbing, slashing, bludgeoning or crushing weapon at 21 feet or less “A reasonable man has grounds to fear death or serious bodily injury” and you can shoot. Unfortunately here in the state of Misery in any case of self defense you have to introduce the affirmative defense and prove you were in fear of your life, even in your own house you can’t shoot unless being attacked.

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