This really irritates me...

This is a discussion on This really irritates me... within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Only Glock In general, to see/read/hear the unwritten rule that it is better to leave a place that you have every right ...

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Thread: This really irritates me...

  1. #46
    VIP Member Array TN_Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Only Glock View Post
    In general, to see/read/hear the unwritten rule that it is better to leave a place that you have every right to be, whether it is in a park at a picnic, or at a shopping mall, etc, than to stand up to some thug/troublemaker/scumbag, to avoid any type of confrontation. I am sorry, but even if I were not LEO, I cannot see myself retreating from somewhere I have a legitimate right to be at the time, and it irritates me to think that law abiding citizens are expected to do so. "Just give them what they want and don't fight back and they won't hurt you." "Just drop what you are doing and go to the trouble of finding another place to [fill in the blank] to avoid trouble." "Just give in to the predators in one way or another and let them come out on top."

    This is not the way things are supposed to be! The criminals should be afraid of the lawabiding people, not the other way around.

    I surely agree with you. I don't think it is right to expect or force by law the upstanding citizen to retreat or run away from the thugs and scum of the world. If we all just give in to them and turn tail and run any time one of them raises their voice, then how are we ever to take back our streets?

    No, I say the righteous and decent people of this world MUST stand up to the scum. That is the way it should work.

    But, it seems that the lawyers do not want it that way.
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  3. #47
    Member Array Only Glock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Trucker View Post
    As a LEO you have no requirement to back down, but you also have a department lawyer to help you if needed.
    With most, the department lawyers are there to look out for the department... not the officers.
    When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.
    From the essay "TRIBES" by Bill Whittle

  4. #48
    Member Array Only Glock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ayan View Post
    Do you run into many situations where you feel threatened or otherwise feel like you have to limit your actions because these thugs?



    Once again -- how often is it that you have to stop what you're doing because someone is threatening you? Are you threatened by the mere presence of these thugs or are you constantly being antagonized?



    Nothing about choosing a nonviolent way out of a situation implies fear. If presented with a situation you can't back out of, I can't imagine any court faulting you for defending yourself instead of retreating. I guess it is up to you to determine where your retreat/fight threshold is.

    It sounds like you're saying that you are often fearful and you wonder why you can't be just a s violent as the criminals.
    You have totally misread my posts. I have not been talking about myself specifically, I have been speaking in general terms. If you had read a little more closely, you would see where I said I don't back down. When I see trouble, as a LEO, I step in and do what needs to be done. Re-read my posts.
    When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.
    From the essay "TRIBES" by Bill Whittle

  5. #49
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    Do I read Thugs correctly.

    Og,
    Are you talking about Thugs as those committing violent acts or as your moron, as i had a few weeks ago, in the sporting goods shop screamming and curssing into his cell phone and making a situation uncomfortable for families and others around them.

    I read it as the general moron (do i read it correctly?), for these people I am even more willing to leave where I have the "Right" to be when I am carrying than i had been prior to carrying. I make it a point to be more calm when i am carrying then i had in the past (enough so that my 17 y.o. sister can tell when i am). I do not want to make it look like I am trying to cause trouble. When I was looking into getting my permit my uncle who is a wise man told me, "When you have a gun you MUST walk away or try to de-escilate every situation, you don't want to ever have to use that gun, it is there only if you have to use it. Walk away first, even if you have to swallow your pride, dont make it look like you wanted even any little bit of a probelm."

    Sound advise i have been following since i got my CCW permit. OG you have it a bit easier since you are LEO you have the ability to put a stop to things (I have sceen "Off Duty" LEO put a stop to things) because it is not looked upon as looking for trouble.

  6. #50
    New Member Array GRYGANDALF's Avatar
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    Legal justification for the use of deadly physical force.

    The good guys operate under the law. If they don't like it they change it, but that is another story. Each state has its own statute covering legal justification in the event that deadly physical force is used. If you don't know it, you should. Generally the acronym
    "Dr Barks" covers it. That is, deadly physical force is "justified" to "prevent or terminate" a deadly threat to you or someone else in the context of (D=defense, r=Rape, B=Burglary-generally in home, a=arson, r=robbery, k=kidnap, and, s=forcible sodomy, hence, Dr Barks. Note the prevent or terminate aspect, so chasing the perp down the driveway as the jerk is retreating is a problem if you hunt him down and execute him. No justification is murder and has criminal and civil ramifications you don't want to deal with. it is noytt about the lawyers and judges it is about the law of the land and hyour failure to understand and live up to it. Best advice, keep your weapon in your pocket for all but the most obvious defense situations.

  7. #51
    Member Array Only Glock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by me View Post
    Og,
    Are you talking about Thugs as those committing violent acts or as your moron, as i had a few weeks ago, in the sporting goods shop screamming and curssing into his cell phone and making a situation uncomfortable for families and others around them.

    I read it as the general moron (do i read it correctly?), for these people I am even more willing to leave where I have the "Right" to be when I am carrying than i had been prior to carrying. I make it a point to be more calm when i am carrying then i had in the past (enough so that my 17 y.o. sister can tell when i am). I do not want to make it look like I am trying to cause trouble. When I was looking into getting my permit my uncle who is a wise man told me, "When you have a gun you MUST walk away or try to de-escilate every situation, you don't want to ever have to use that gun, it is there only if you have to use it. Walk away first, even if you have to swallow your pride, dont make it look like you wanted even any little bit of a probelm."

    Sound advise i have been following since i got my CCW permit. OG you have it a bit easier since you are LEO you have the ability to put a stop to things (I have sceen "Off Duty" LEO put a stop to things) because it is not looked upon as looking for trouble.
    I am talking about (for example) someone going to the mall, grocery store, gas station, etc, for a legitimate reason, shopping, whatever, seeing a bunch of ghetto thugs hanging around the entrance giving everyone the hard eye, looking for trouble, intimidating, etc, and being expected/required to get back in their car and leave to go somewhere else. The thugs are there for no other reason than looking for trouble, the citizen being there for no other than a legitimate, lawful reason, and yet many people place the impetus on the citizen to avoid and go somewhere else. If you don't, you must have been looking for trouble, you didn't do enough to avoid trouble, etc. When someone lawfully defends themselves in an attack situation, it sickens me that they have to worry whether it will look like they were looking for trouble, whether they did enough to avoid it, whether they could/should have retreated and so on.

    I am NOT advocating using a firearm because someone jumped a parking space ahead of you, cut you off in traffic, got the last X-Box or whatever. Even as a LEO, a firearm is the last resort, and we have liability insurance/bond insurance, etc, and it is hands down, the last resort to a non LEO. And I DO advocate using common sense whether armed or not. A woman has a right to walk down a public alley at 3 AM, but it is against common sense to do it. Driving across town to a gas station in the middle of the projects to buy gas... sure you have that right, but again, not common sense. I use common sense myself, every chance I get. But I WILL NOT go out of my way to avoid someone looking for trouble, and it galls me that law abiding citizens should have to do so.
    When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.
    From the essay "TRIBES" by Bill Whittle

  8. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Only Glock View Post
    And I DO advocate using common sense whether armed or not.
    I could not agree with you more, the only problem is that as we know in todays society common sense is not common.

    When i said put a stop to things i was not just talking about using a weapon (which i believe you caught) but i have watched an "Off Duty" LEO walk up to a group of punks at a store just to bug ppl and make them leave. All he did is walk up and say you need to leave or you are going to jsil when one punk mouthed off he showed his badge the kid appoligized and they left. Thats what i meant about it being easier for LEOs to handle the situation, you all have legitament authority or even out of your jurisdiction implied authority where as I dont have any authority to do that. I agree it suck that we have to let these punks play their games.

    Also i noticed you are in East TN, what part i am a college student in Elizabethton.

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