Shakin' Up

Shakin' Up

This is a discussion on Shakin' Up within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Dec 31 2006 about 2 hours ago. I was pumping gas at my normal gas station in Fairfax VA. Before I got out of the ...

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Thread: Shakin' Up

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Shakin' Up

    Dec 31 2006 about 2 hours ago.

    I was pumping gas at my normal gas station in Fairfax VA. Before I got out of the car I always take a quick look around to see who is around me. I saw about a 6.2 guy wearing all black leather biker clothing talking to the really cute gas station attendent inside the gas station. I know her by sight and she knows me by sight cause thats my daily stop for cigarettes. I saw she was a little uneasy and she was alone in the actual store part of the station, there was me and probably one other guy in the gas station. I was between my car and the pump watching tentatively the body language of each. The guy wearing all black comes right at the store and starts walking directly at me. I could see right away he was either drunk or on some mind expanding drug. Didn't look like mary jane do to alot of the twitching and eyes were rolling back in his head.

    As he was approaching he said "Can I talk to you" I immediately looked for an escape route. There wasn't really one. The Gentlman then said "I want to talk to you and I might offend you" Now I started getting alittle ancy. He kept coming closer to about a 5-6 feet distance I said "Stop right there, What do you need" He said he was a Indian and that us white men had all the money and he wanted one dollar." I said I really don't have anything to give him. I had 200 dollars in large bills on me and said to myself this may escalate if he sees all I have is 100 dollar bill and 50's. I then thought about my gun in my pocket holster. I also had a Emerson Karambit which I knew I could get to faster. I put my hand on my karambit rather then my gun because I didn't want to have to hands in 2 pockets. He started to argue with me. I repeated that I didn't have anything to give him. He called me some bad name I think "Honky tonk F***er or something like and then walked away. I really wasn't listening. When he finally left I went in to pay for my gas. I saw the gas attendant looking kind of frantic calling somebody. The attendant asked me if I was okay and what the guy asked me for. I then said for a dollar. She said yeah he was definetly on something. I got my stuff and left. I saw this guy folling individuals throughout the parking lot. I didn't call the police thinking to my self well hes only pan handling. Sorry for the mispellings and typos cause I still have alittle Adrenaline in right now.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    I even put it in the wrong section. It was supposed to go into Tactial senarios
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

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    I moved your thread.

    Yep, these people that get whacked out on various "mind bending" substances or alcohol can get Instantly super violent, aggressive, and dangerous.

    It is wise to remember that you don't even have to do anything to "set them off" as the "Trigger" can be in their own mind and be nothing that you have done.

    Their personality and perception is already warped.
    A bit of distance can be your best friend and you need to really be ready to act quickly.

    Slightly Off Topic but, Related.

    When you are at a Gas Station & you could possibly be involved in a firefight...think twice about using a Gasoline Pump for cover!
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    I moved your thread.

    Yep, these people that get whacked out on various "mind bending" substances or alcohol can get Instantly super violent, aggressive, and dangerous.

    It is wise to remember that you don't even have to do anything to "set them off" as the "Trigger" can be in their own mind and be nothing that you have done.

    Their personality and perception is already warped.
    A bit of distance can be your best friend and you need to really be ready to act quickly.

    Slightly Off Topic but, Related.

    When you are at a Gas Station & you could possibly be involved in a firefight...think twice about using a Gasoline Pump for cover!
    No I totally agree. The guy basically had me backed in a corner. He came up the backside of the car toward me. I had the Pump on the left a trash can next to that next to that a pillar. I would have been a squeeze for a 100 pound 6.3 male. The car was on the other side, and the behind me was the pump wire in my gas tank. Hine sight twenty twenty the only option I had was trying to hop over the pump line going into my car. If he had started coming and I turned I would have been knocked cold. My luck, If I made it I would have tripped and been on the ground creating a even worse senario. My only chance was getting that Emerson out, showing I had "SOMETHING" in my hand, buying the time to go for my gun. If I could have gotten my gun first I probably would have had at best a low retention hold having to shoot from my hip. Again, hindsight, I was carrying 124 tap, He had so much leather on, no matter what caliber or hollow points I had they would have instantly turned into a FMJ having to penatrate that much clothing I will say this he had so much leather on the emerson would have done probably nothing as well if I could have slashed at him not to mention I don't know any knife fighting techniques therefore It proably would have been a good rock.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

  5. #5
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    Not criticizing but, perhaps next time a retreat into the vehicle with in gear is called for, while BG approaches. If he already looked odd, the clerk looked scared, I would not hesitate to put some distance between me and the BG.
    Did the clerk call 911? Just cause the guy didn't assault you doesn't mean he is harmless.
    Glad you are o.k.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


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    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky View Post
    Not criticizing but, perhaps next time a retreat into the vehicle with in gear is called for, while BG approaches. If he already looked odd, the clerk looked scared, I would not hesitate to put some distance between me and the BG.
    Did the clerk call 911? Just cause the guy didn't assault you doesn't mean he is harmless.
    Glad you are o.k.
    Well its funny know what your saying and your right I should have. Unfortunatly, the side of the car the gas tank is on "Ford Focus" Passenger side, with the doors locked. No electronic entry. The gas station is also a shop station servicing vehicles, 4-wheelers, and motorcylces. I think he was wearing like a motor cycle jacket. The thing I really learned out of this is not to park at the pump that is closest to the store entry. When the guy came out the door he was about 15 feet from me. The distance comment I agree totally with. At the time the only way for me to create distance was have him stop closing distance. Thats why I said "Stop" Fortunatly he did, however, he was still only 6 feet away thats less than 1/3 the distance on the 21 foot rule.

    To answer your 911 question No I don't think so.

    The other really STUPID thing on my part and I know I'm going to get yelled. I had just come from shooting at the NRA range. I had cleaned my gun in the dunk tank outback and had reloaded and filled my mags with carry ammo. When I got home after the incident I took my gun out of my pocket and the mag fell out. I know exaclty what happened. In a hurry to get ready for my buddies New years party I loaded the gun, dropped the mag to squeeze in extra round in the mag, I then just slid the mag in my pocket with out fully putting it in the gun. VERY DUMB.
    Last edited by Rob99VMI04; December 31st, 2006 at 05:03 PM.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

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    Ex Member Array F350's Avatar
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    When you are at a Gas Station & you could possibly be involved in a firefight...think twice about using a Gasoline Pump for cover!
    Also you have a nice handy close range weapon at hand, a gallon of gas in the eyes, nose and mouth will take the fight out of most people, and you probably can get 3-5 foot range out of it. You say you are a smoker, do you use a Zippo?

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    Well fortunately he was just an aggressive a-hole and not out to truly stomp anyone. You have learned some things.

    The only other thing is that the clerk should have been on the phone with 911 ASAP. I know some FFX County guys and they like to catch the idiots in the area and have witnesses. Yeah he stopped short of assault, but as the LEOs I know tell me, guys doing stuff like this usually have something else wrong that can get them arrested. As the guy's high wore off he may decide it is worth stomping someone or even killing them for a few dollars. Better he is off the street when that happens.
    Procrastinators are the leaders of tomorrow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    Also you have a nice handy close range weapon at hand, a gallon of gas in the eyes, nose and mouth will take the fight out of most people, and you probably can get 3-5 foot range out of it. You say you are a smoker, do you use a Zippo?

    F350 beat me to it.....
    Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est.-Seneca

    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. If I have a gun, what do I have to be paranoid about?" -Clint Smith

    "An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Jeff Cooper

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    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Good that you got out of this all right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob99VMI04 View Post
    Hine sight twenty twenty the only option I had was trying to hop over the pump line going into my car. If he had started coming and I turned I would have been knocked cold. My luck, If I made it I would have tripped and been on the ground creating a even worse senario.
    You also could have just shut off the pump and pulled the nozzle out, clearing the way for you to withdraw. Filling the tank all the way isn't important compared to avoiding a confrontation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob99VMI04 View Post
    Again, hindsight, I was carrying 124 tap, He had so much leather on, no matter what caliber or hollow points I had they would have instantly turned into a FMJ having to penatrate that much clothing I will say this he had so much leather on the emerson would have done probably nothing as well if I could have slashed at him not to mention I don't know any knife fighting techniques therefore It proably would have been a good rock.
    Tough, thick leather generally does a good job of preventing hollowpoint expansion. Cor-Bon DPX reportedly expands well after penetrating leather (and after penetrating most anything else, for that matter). Leather jackets can also stop knife blades, unless they're quite sharp.

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    Distinguished Member Array lowflyer's Avatar
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    Sounds like you did all you could. And, yes the mag should be fully installed in the gun for best results.

    Glad it turned out to be a non-event.
    Whatever doesn't kill you postpones the inevitable.

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    VIP Member Array NCHornet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    Also you have a nice handy close range weapon at hand, a gallon of gas in the eyes, nose and mouth will take the fight out of most people, and you probably can get 3-5 foot range out of it. You say you are a smoker, do you use a Zippo?

    F350 read my mind, I thought about dousing the guy with gas and holding a bic lighter in my hand telling him to back off. But with gas costing what it does this may not be a good idea,lol!!
    Glad nothing escalated any further, one of the most incredible fights I have ever witnessed was a drunk Indian, about 6'3" 250lbs, taking on 3 bikers, he was hit with wooden chair, punched and kicked multiple times, and he kept on fighting as if none of it had an affect on the guy! Somebody on drugs can be a very touchy situation. I have seen perps on LSD hit with Tasers and they kept on coming laughing the whole way. Glad you are okay.
    When Seconds Count, The Cops Are Just Minutes Away!!
    Carry On!
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    Distinguished Member Array SixBravo's Avatar
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    From what I'm told, Speer Gold Dot (in the .40) offers good (well.... better) expansion after passing through clothing.

    Sounds good, man. I'm gonna have to remember this and park further away from the stationhouse. I gotta agree, though. You got a good weapon in your hands already.... Those pumps will shoot gasoline a good distance....
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    Should Have Called 911...

    right away. If you really knew, from past experience, that the young lady didn't seem comfortable at her counter...you could have called 911 to inform them of your observations, let them decide...they may have had a car right in the area...

    Telling the 'wired' creep to stop or leave was the right thing to do if trapped, otherwise I would have been in the vehicle, on the road, and dialing 911...

    Glad things turned out OK, it's still not to late to call 911, if this just happened (sounds like it did...).

    Stay armed...stay safe!

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  15. #15
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    Also you have a nice handy close range weapon at hand, a gallon of gas in the eyes, nose and mouth will take the fight out of most people, and you probably can get 3-5 foot range out of it. You say you are a smoker, do you use a Zippo?
    Okay so I learned 2 things today thats a neat trick with the gas pump. I guess I should have paid attention to Patrick Swayze in Point Break.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

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