If you need that long shot

If you need that long shot

This is a discussion on If you need that long shot within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; A lot has been debated about the need for long distance defensive shooting. Some feel that up close to 7 yards is all they need, ...

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Thread: If you need that long shot

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    If you need that long shot

    A lot has been debated about the need for long distance defensive shooting. Some feel that up close to 7 yards is all they need, and to some, 25 yards seems extreme. But what if....

    Today during my fun time at the farm while testing some downloaded 5.56 ammo, I decided just for fun to shoot my G27 at the target. Off hand, no rest but my weak hand support. I loaded 8 in the mag and let them fly. The target was a probably smaller than an actual man, and I took a pic with my hand covering the 223 holes I had shot earlier, and also to give reference to size. Here is how the target looks at 45 yards
    image.jpg

    Four of the 8 shots fired hit the target, but I feel confident that if it was a full sized target they would have impacted.
    image.jpg
    I'm not really happy with these results, but considering the short sight radius and distance, I chalk it up as a good necessary practice.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.


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    Getting out of your comfort zone is critical to developing as a defensive shooter. I am a firm believer (and we train our course participants) that defensive shooting DOES take place at distances further than 7 yards. Of course the key to any shoot scenario is situational awareness and this plays directly into the 25 yard aspect. If you can identify threat at increased distances, make and take appropriate actions (draw, verbal commands, movement to cover, etc.) what would shooter not choose to train at "extended distances". Shooting weak-hand is very important as well. I know you were not completely happy with your shot group; but is will get better. Good on you for drilling this direction. Stay Safe….
    Mike1956, molleur, ccw9mm and 2 others like this.

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    Dude... 45 yards with a baby glock is a looooong way to shoot. I'd say your results are acceptable.

    I'm not going to argue that it's not a bad thing to practice at some extreme pistol distances but it does become an exercise in curiosity, for the most part, when you start adding in all the dynamics of a gunfight. If you are looking to pin someone down at distance, then you're right on target. You're definitely close enough that they'd think twice about breaking cover. If you're talking about an offensive gun fight and you add in a moving target that's shooting back at you and I'd personally have a difficult time justifying the loss of ammo (I don't typically carry enough spare mags to make suppressive fire much of an option ).
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    I've never understood why "7" yards seems to be the popular distance for supposed self defense practice. Seems to my that my typical 15 yards practice makes seven yards almost a given. I haven't tried beyond that though, the handgun range isn't longer. Maybe next time I use the rifle range I'll try for 100.
    molleur likes this.
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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TX expat View Post
    Dude... 45 yards with a baby glock is a looooong way to shoot. I'd say your results are acceptable.

    I'm not going to argue that it's not a bad thing to practice at some extreme pistol distances but it does become an exercise in curiosity, for the most part, when you start adding in all the dynamics of a gunfight. If you are looking to pin someone down at distance, then you're right on target. You're definitely close enough that they'd think twice about breaking cover. If you're talking about an offensive gun fight and you add in a moving target that's shooting back at you and I'd personally have a difficult time justifying the loss of ammo (I don't typically carry enough spare mags to make suppressive fire much of an option ).
    No, I'm not in to the suppressive fire thing either. But why I train to make long shots is because of a personal belief/conviction.
    I believe that with all the radical Muslims in this country that I am more likely to encounter an attack or be in the vicinity of an attack perpetrated by radicals with long guns in a public place than i am concerned with the typical street criminal.
    Actually, an attack of this nature is my primary concern, and in a public square or open area, distance becomes an issue, for you, or against you.
    I believe very strongly that a group a attack with some type of long guns is imminent. And when it happens, and if I am present, I want to arrange the meeting with their God.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
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    You did good. By the way what's the bullet weight? Agree with you on the 7 yards. When we did action shooting, they set it up from 2 yards out past 35 yards. Quick time at short range then you got to slow down for the longer range.
    miller_man likes this.
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    For throwing 8 shots down field on a whim with no rest, I'd say you did pretty good. especially since all your shots went high where they have a better chance of doing damage if/when they hit.

    You never know what situation you may find yourself in. So practice when you can.

    Thanks for sharing
    Nehemiah 4:14: “Don’t be afraid of them. Remember the Lord who is great and awesome, and draw your Beretta PX4 and fight for your brothers, your sons and your daughters, your wives and your homes.” highlighted added by LMP

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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    I believe very strongly that a group a attack with some type of long guns is imminent. And when it happens, and if I am present, I want to arrange the meeting with their God.
    Need help?
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Need help?
    All I can get in that situation:)
    airslot and Caertaker like this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    No, I'm not in to the suppressive fire thing either. But why I train to make long shots is because of a personal belief/conviction.
    I believe that with all the radical Muslims in this country that I am more likely to encounter an attack or be in the vicinity of an attack perpetrated by radicals with long guns in a public place than i am concerned with the typical street criminal.
    Actually, an attack of this nature is my primary concern, and in a public square or open area, distance becomes an issue, for you, or against you.
    I believe very strongly that a group a attack with some type of long guns is imminent. And when it happens, and if I am present, I want to arrange the meeting with their God.
    I hear you and I can't say I disagree with any of it. Your scenario is, in my opinion, greater than a possibility.

    I don't know how I'd respond in that sort of situation, but it's safe for me to say that I would feel the same way you do. In order to even consider a shot like that I'd have to be immensely sure of the target and what lies beyond it because at that distance you aren't going to have a lot going for you. I might want to facilitate their passing on to the next world, but I'm not sure there would be many scenarios where I would actually risk a shot at that distance to help 'em get there. Now the fool that I am, I might be tempted into working my way closer for some piece of mind that I'm not going to cause any collateral damage... Lot's of variables that would have to be considered in any event.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Need help?
    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    All I can get in that situation:)
    You guys will not leave me out I hope. I'll bring a rifle!
    airslot likes this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SatCong View Post
    You did good. By the way what's the bullet weight? Agree with you on the 7 yards. When we did action shooting, they set it up from 2 yards out past 35 yards. Quick time at short range then you got to slow down for the longer range.
    It's a handload, 155 weight fmj that I put together to mimic my carry round.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TX expat View Post
    Now the fool that I am, . . .
    And with that, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, the defense rests!
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

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    Quote Originally Posted by TX expat View Post
    You guys will not leave me out I hope. I'll bring a rifle!
    If we know in advance, so will we! Bring what you got.
    molleur and tcox4freedom like this.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

  15. #15
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    why "7" yards seems to be the popular distance for supposed self defense practice
    Perhaps the 21' rule?

    Good shooting, glockman! Where'd you put the Colt?

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