Montana garage burglary/shooting-how would you handle this?

Montana garage burglary/shooting-how would you handle this?

This is a discussion on Montana garage burglary/shooting-how would you handle this? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Police: Pot Might Be Factor in Montana Killing - ABC News After all the good work gun rights advocates, the NRA and people on forums ...

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Thread: Montana garage burglary/shooting-how would you handle this?

  1. #1
    New Member Array gdolson's Avatar
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    Montana garage burglary/shooting-how would you handle this?

    Police: Pot Might Be Factor in Montana Killing - ABC News

    After all the good work gun rights advocates, the NRA and people on forums like this do to teach responsible gun ownership, knuckleheads like this guy do immeasurable harm and just add fuel to the anti's fire. There is very little that this guy did that doesn't make him look guilty of murder. Of course we don't know ALL of the details but the known facts don't paint the homeowner in a favorable light.

    To get this post back to a "scenario", how would DC handle this situation? I think sensors and cameras in the vulnerable place are a great idea. His garage door should have been shut, then the perps would have to actually "break" in. It seems like I have read a post where someone has their garage door controls in the house which would allow them to potentially trap someone in the garage and call police to come and get them! Sounds awesome but might not be practical!
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Array Stirling XD's Avatar
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    Yeah, it sounds like this guy set a trap so he could kill the burglars instead of deter or catch them. Things will not end well for him. A better solution is to close the garage door and lock it. Sensors and cameras inside and out would compliment that nicely. A dog sleeping in the garage might be useful as well.

    Another solution would be to not pick up a gun while high. Even better, don't get high in the first place.
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  3. #3
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    Nope. it was a setup, number one. "Burglar" (more like "trespasser" as door was open) had no weapon, number 2 so disparity of force was pretty unequal. Guy didn't need to shoot when holding the kid at gunpoint would have sufficed. Is marijuana legal in Montana? Maybe Mr. Quickdraw needs to go to jail on a number of counts. No, this was, IMO, definitely not a killing situation. How unfortunate.
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    Senior Member Array hayzor's Avatar
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    You gotta wonder about any guy with a hairdresser.
    The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it. Albert Einstein

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    Senior Member Array NickBurkhardt's Avatar
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    Uncle Jessee would have used rock salt.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by gdolson View Post
    Police: Pot Might Be Factor in Montana Killing - ABC News

    After all the good work gun rights advocates, the NRA and people on forums like this do to teach responsible gun ownership, knuckleheads like this guy do immeasurable harm and just add fuel to the anti's fire. There is very little that this guy did that doesn't make him look guilty of murder. Of course we don't know ALL of the details but the known facts don't paint the homeowner in a favorable light.

    To get this post back to a "scenario", how would DC handle this situation? I think sensors and cameras in the vulnerable place are a great idea. His garage door should have been shut, then the perps would have to actually "break" in. It seems like I have read a post where someone has their garage door controls in the house which would allow them to potentially trap someone in the garage and call police to come and get them! Sounds awesome but might not be practical!
    We're basing all our comments on a single article from ABC news. This is one of those cases where we'll need to see how it all ends after trial.

    Some thoughts:
    1. He set up cameras and sensors - not a boobytrap.
    2. He left his garage door open - not a crime.
    3. He fired his shotgun 4 times into a dark garage - not the smartest thing to do.
    4. He told people about his plans to 'kill a kid' - see # 3.

    Bottom line, don't go trespassing or breaking in to other people's homes if you don't want to get yourself killed. Don't go looking for trouble by blindly shooting when you haven't identified a threat. And don't smoke pot if it's illegal and leave it laying around after you kill someone.

    p.s. Just because someone leaves their garage door open (or their front door unlocked), doesn't give anyone the right to enter the property uninvited.
    Ben

    Cogito, ergo armatum sum. I think, therefore I am armed. (Don Mann, The Modern Day Gunslinger; the ultimate handgun training manual)


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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robhic View Post
    Nope. it was a setup, number one. "Burglar" (more like "trespasser" as door was open) had no weapon, number 2 so disparity of force was pretty unequal. Guy didn't need to shoot when holding the kid at gunpoint would have sufficed.
    Has the raw video been released publicly and does it clearly show the intruder posed zero threat, didn't issue threats, didn't advance on the guy?

    BTW, force comparisons would include body build, apparent strength/age, whether the intruder had or claimed to have weaponry.

    Don't know what the particulars are in this case, myself.
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    Oh crap. 2 steps forward one back. Sometimes 3 back.
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    If my garage had been broken into 3-4 rimes, I'd be seriously looking a securing it better over setting any sort of trap.
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    Distinguished Member Array Glock2201's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    Has the raw video been released publicly and does it clearly show the intruder posed zero threat, didn't issue threats, didn't advance on the guy?

    BTW, force comparisons would include body build, apparent strength/age, whether the intruder had or claimed to have weaponry.

    Don't know what the particulars are in this case, myself.
    Well put. If we could believe everything that is reported in the news then this guy sure looks guilty. News reports sometimes can be one sided. One thing that does not look good for him is that he told his hairdresser that he waited up 3 nights to shoot some kid. Is that what he said or did he say trying to catch some kid?

  11. #11
    VIP Member Array maxwell97's Avatar
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    I don't see anything here that hurts our cause. A criminal murdering a thief over stolen drugs is not in any way, shape or form representative of self-defense. The only ones who would make that connection are those already dead-set against gun rights.

    Why are we always on the defensive about this stuff? "Uh oh, a guy shot another guy, that makes us look bad."
    "Yet this government never of itself furthered any enterprise, but by the alacrity with which it got out of the way... The character inherent in the American people has done all that has been accomplished; and it would have done somewhat more, if the government had not sometimes got in its way."

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxwell97 View Post
    Why are we always on the defensive about this stuff? "Uh oh, a guy shot another guy, that makes us look bad."
    Because the anti's are always on the offensive ... often, mere moments after such things occur. I'd rather be discussing the situations here and learning how to thwart the inevitable crapola once it hits the media, than to simply ignore such things.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
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    Senior Member Array Fizban's Avatar
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    I dont see how this guy is going to explain that he had no other reasonable choice but to shoot this guy.
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    A healthy dose of the three stupids all around.
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  15. #15
    VIP Member Array maxwell97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    Because the anti's are always on the offensive ... often, mere moments after such things occur. I'd rather be discussing the situations here and learning how to thwart the inevitable crapola once it hits the media, than to simply ignore such things.
    Fair enough. I guess I'd rather WE go on the offensive. For example, when a gun-free zone is shot up, why aren't we out there screaming that people are dead because of stupid anti-gun laws that keep people from defending themselves? Why do we always cringe and wait for the antis to blame US for the people THEY got killed?

    I just hate that their media victory seems to be so complete that we're afraid to say such things. We're scared, like abused puppies waiting for the next kick. We get angry at other gun owners for drawing attention and "making us look bad" when they DO speak up; and we allow the actions of criminals and murderers to be taken as a reflection on us, like we have a responsibility to distance ourselves from anybody who uses a gun for an evil purpose.

    I understand why it is this way, it's just really frustrating.
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    "Yet this government never of itself furthered any enterprise, but by the alacrity with which it got out of the way... The character inherent in the American people has done all that has been accomplished; and it would have done somewhat more, if the government had not sometimes got in its way."

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