High risk situations with child or infant in car

High risk situations with child or infant in car

This is a discussion on High risk situations with child or infant in car within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Awhile ago I posted a situation about a classic case of armed robbery initiated by a two up motorcycle with victim in a moving car. ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array Arcam's Avatar
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    High risk situations with child or infant in car

    Awhile ago I posted a situation about a classic case of armed robbery initiated by a two up motorcycle with victim in a moving car. The consensus was to use the car as the weapon in a defensive matter. This makes sense, but from another angle suppose there is a young child or infant in the car? You still try to attack the motorcycle with your vehicle, knowing that it could very well likely trigger a shot that can hit the child that you are transporting? Or the impact of the collision may harm the child? So generally in these types of situations, and I'm not talking about a planned hit, the goal of the motorcycle team is to get you to pull over and to rob you. So why not play the game… pull over and simply outdraw and outshoot the attacker? How do you approach this?


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    Member Array UrsusMedius's Avatar
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    This is all opinion of course, but:

    Pull over and shoot it out with a kid in the car? That's option number last. I don't care what caliber you're using; it has less knockdown capability than a car).

    Sideswiping a motorcycle with your car is not likely to jostle the car's passengers enough to cause much harm. Maybe some bruises at most.

    The likelihood of the assaulting bikers getting a shot off while being sideswiped is negligible.

    Again, getting into a firefight with a kid present would be option number last.

    Sent while walking the narrow road.
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    Use the biggest weapon you have, the car. Firearm is the BUG for this one.
    The driver is the target. Armed carjackers WILL shoot the driver.

    Firing from inside a car is as dangerous to the occupants as your intended target.
    Broken glass, loud report, bullet jackets will cause a hazard to everyone in the car.

    The car is capable of injuring both people on the motorcycle at the same time. The gun only one.
    Use the car!

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    VIP Member Array Ghost1958's Avatar
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    Sounds like you talking about two on a bike willing to kill to get your car. If thats the case and they have half a brain you probably will never get the chance to use your car or gun.

    All they have to do is wait until you stop for stop sign or a light in a place that looks good to them, stop beside you and the passenger shoot you thru the window. Rear and side car window glass isnt very good at stopping bullets. That would take all of maybe a second or two for them to do.

    Unless you are awfully lucky you probably wont hear the shot that put the bullet thru your brain.

    If they are stupid enough to try to stop a 2000 lb car with waving a gun and 1000 lb bike then I guess you could make road kill of them.
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    Member Array Arcam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UrsusMedius View Post

    The likelihood of the assaulting bikers getting a shot off while being sideswiped is negligible.
    Thats my main concern. I think its clear that the car is the winner. I'm not so sure if they wont get a shot off. Its the guy on the back who does the shooting so he's not worrying about steering or anything. Around here these jackings are quite common and successful. I can't even think of a situation where anybody has successfully fended one off by sideswiping. Most people are good victims and pull over and give them everything they got -- and still often get shot.

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    VIP Member Array Ghost1958's Avatar
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    Trouble with sideswiping is a bike can brake faster than a car. Swerve faster. And even a moderately powered motorcycle can routinely leave even high powered performance cars in their dust as far as instant acceleration goes.

    Hitting a bike with a car that is expecting it to be tried and actually making contact with the bike is tall order. The passenger doing the shooting wont have a problem shooting all he wants.

    Why two on a bike would try to stop a car instead of waiting for it be stopped already is beyond me but sideswiping a bike with a car that is comparable to a rhino trying to hit a antelope.
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    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcam View Post
    Awhile ago I posted a situation about a classic case of armed robbery initiated by a two up motorcycle with victim in a moving car. The consensus was to use the car as the weapon in a defensive matter. This makes sense, but from another angle suppose there is a young child or infant in the car? You still try to attack the motorcycle with your vehicle, knowing that it could very well likely trigger a shot that can hit the child that you are transporting? Or the impact of the collision may harm the child? So generally in these types of situations, and I'm not talking about a planned hit, the goal of the motorcycle team is to get you to pull over and to rob you. So why not play the game… pull over and simply outdraw and outshoot the attacker? How do you approach this?
    The circumstances don't change....a child in a moving car, a child in a stopped car. You can move faster to get off the X with a car (compared to running). Motorcycles are light and fast, but I'd rather use a 3K lbs car/SUV against a motorcycle vs being on foot against a motorcycle.
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    VIP Member Array Secret Spuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcam View Post
    Awhile ago I posted a situation about a classic case of armed robbery initiated by a two up motorcycle with victim in a moving car. The consensus was to use the car as the weapon in a defensive matter. This makes sense, but from another angle suppose there is a young child or infant in the car? You still try to attack the motorcycle with your vehicle, knowing that it could very well likely trigger a shot that can hit the child that you are transporting? Or the impact of the collision may harm the child? So generally in these types of situations, and I'm not talking about a planned hit, the goal of the motorcycle team is to get you to pull over and to rob you. So why not play the game… pull over and simply outdraw and outshoot the attacker? How do you approach this?
    I'd think the child would be in significantly more danger from flying bullets than a car crash while buckled into a seat belt.
    You really cant use a car as a weapon unless equal or greater force is being used against you. And only when there is an imedeate threat to your life or anothers. The thing about using a car as a deadly weapon is you will probably be held responsible for any damage to people and property from your vehical as well as the vehical you caused to go out of control. For example if you strike a motocycle and that motorcycle mounts the curb, and pins little susie snottynose against a wall killing her, you are responsible for her death.
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    Senior Member Array NickBurkhardt's Avatar
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    Motorcycle gang you say? Meet my truc... I mean Minivan gun:



    Because my state won't let us have loaded rifles in a vehicle, but this "Pistol" loaded with 30 rounds of 7.62 is just fine with my CHL.

    But seriously, dial 911 and drive to the nearest police station.

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    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    The circumstances don't change....a child in a moving car, a child in a stopped car. You can move faster to get off the X with a car (compared to running). Motorcycles are light and fast, but I'd rather use a 3K lbs car/SUV against a motorcycle vs being on foot against a motorcycle.
    This right here. I am in a 5000pd SUV, that is where I am going to stay....
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    Unless I am forced to leave my vehicle, I will take my chances inside the vehicle.
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    VIP Member Array Easy8's Avatar
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    I think
    I would toss wallet or purse out window an take off if you stop they might take vehicle with kid inside

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcam View Post
    Awhile ago I posted a situation about a classic case of armed robbery initiated by a two up motorcycle with victim in a moving car. The consensus was to use the car as the weapon in a defensive matter. This makes sense, but from another angle suppose there is a young child or infant in the car?You still try to attack the motorcycle with your vehicle, knowing that it could very well likely trigger a shot that can hit the child that you are transporting? Or the impact of the collision may harm the child? So generally in these types of situations, and I'm not talking about a planned hit, the goal of the motorcycle team is to get you to pull over and to rob you. So why not play the game… pull over and simply outdraw and outshoot the attacker? How do you approach this?
    The child can still be hit if you pull over and try and fight it out. My opinion is make the motorcycle a speed bump and get to safety. Then call 911.
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    I drive a 2012 Toyota Sienna SE with two small kids in the second row, both in excellent 5-point harness car seats with side head protection. I figure if I pull over, I risk getting shot anyway - or worse yet, they drive off in the van with my kids still inside. It takes a while to unbuckle two kids from 5-point harnesses.

    Since the odds are that I may get shot whether I comply or not, I'm staying in the van. I do love my van; it hugs the pavement and it is very maneuverable. It's a 4300 lb beast. I'd have to ram them.
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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcam View Post
    Awhile ago I posted a situation about a classic case of armed robbery initiated by a two up motorcycle with victim in a moving car. The consensus was to use the car as the weapon in a defensive matter. This makes sense, but from another angle suppose there is a young child or infant in the car?
    Generally speaking, the vehicle can still provide an effective barrier to proximity and remain an effective tool for escaping a situation. Depends on the specific dynamics in a given situation, I'd think.

    The thing about a motorcycle vs targeted victim in a car, is that it's still car vs motorcycle. That's a huge advantage, the motorcycle's speed notwithstanding. Would I want to have the situation at all, with a kid in the back? Nope, not at all. But if someone's violently attempting a carjacking, then I'll be dead before I'll allow myself or my child to be taken ... at gunpoint or not, via someone on a motorcycle or not. How, exactly, to stop such an attack? Use everything at my disposal ... evasion, escape, mowing down the deadly assailant, firing upon the assailant, whatever the deadly situation requires to be eliminated. Violent, forcible felony in progress? Whatever means are required to stop it cold.
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