First aid for the Bad Guy?

First aid for the Bad Guy?

This is a discussion on First aid for the Bad Guy? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hi everyone! First post and hopefully a good topic. Let's say you have just succesfully defended yourself against an armed intruder, like in this thread ...

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Thread: First aid for the Bad Guy?

  1. #1
    Member Array BassDaddy777's Avatar
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    First aid for the Bad Guy?

    Hi everyone! First post and hopefully a good topic.

    Let's say you have just succesfully defended yourself against an armed intruder, like in this thread. However, in this case the Bad Guy is not dead but instead is severely wounded. You have removed his weapon from his reach, ensured that he was alone and called 911.

    Now then, do you sit there and watch him bleed to death or do you render first aid? Can you do that safely? Is he still a threat? What would the legal ramifications be?


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    Membership Revoked Array clubsoda22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BassDaddy777
    Hi everyone! First post and hopefully a good topic.

    Let's say you have just succesfully defended yourself against an armed intruder, like in this thread. However, in this case the Bad Guy is not dead but instead is severely wounded. You have removed his weapon from his reach, ensured that he was alone and called 911.

    Now then, do you sit there and watch him bleed to death or do you render first aid? Can you do that safely? Is he still a threat? What would the legal ramifications be?
    As an EMT, i can say that my safety comes first. No human life is worth mine, especially some scumbag. After the shoot i'm going to check for further threats then retreat to a position of safety.

    Even when i'm on the ambulance, I will not pull onto a scene where a violent crime was comitted until the cops declare the scene secure. If someone has to bleed to death because of it, at least that person isn't me.

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    Thumbs up Armed Intruder ~ Good First Thread

    An armed intruder that is not dead and has only had his obvious, visible, weapon removed is still a deadly threat.
    Our fantastic police, fire, & paramedic service are ULTRA FAST in my area.
    God Bless Them ALL!
    Calling 911 at my house will get our police at my front door within 3 minutes & usually quicker than that.
    So...would I watch the wounded intruder bleed to death???...No...I would look the other way.
    And...without gloves, facemask, & eye protection I am not catching possible A.I.D.S. from some spurting, bleeding, disarmed, good~for~nothing total stranger that just forced entry my castle to possibly kill me or a family member.
    He can bleed until professional help gets here & his family can pay for my carpet replacement. Just my opinion.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

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    Senior Member Array rfurtkamp's Avatar
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    I'm likely not going to get close enough to kick the weapon out of the dude's hand if I don't have to. Either he'll remove it and throw it away willlingly, or he'll remain a threat.

    As a threat exists, well, I can keep shooting, rendering aid something I'll worry about when I'm out of ammo.

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    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    No cant say as i would Im not trained to give aid and he still a threat till the police show up and take control of the whole deal.

    Also are as a after thought is there anystate where it says you must provide First Aid ...

    I know here if your are a DR/nurse you can be fined if you dont but a Normal untraind person like me i am not Required to render aid

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    In Virginia I'm not obligated to provide aid. Also I am not trained to provide aid. Our law protects me should I further harm someone if I am acting within the bounds of my first aid training. That stops at CPR.

    So no I would not touch the BG. The police and rescue squad are exactly .6 miles from my house and will be here in a flash. I don't want the BG's attorney arguing that I further tried to injure his client while allegedly trying to render "first aid".

    -Scott-

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    In Your Dreams........

    Mouth To Mouth Resuscitation...
    I don't think you could ever be required to give medical aid or comfort to a "Down For The Count" Intruder/Attacker.
    Damn...In the days of the "Old West" ya would just take his cowboy boots off...if they were NICER than the ones you were wearing...& be done with it.
    Last edited by QKShooter; February 9th, 2005 at 12:34 PM. Reason: missspeiled worde
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    Member Array Bobcat1's Avatar
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    No way would I give the BG first aid. I just spent my time putting him down and he may still be a threat. Wait for the Good guys to get there and let them handle it. Would I watch him? You bet. Don't want him getting up and shooting me after I thought he was down for the count.

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    Member Array mikaldulee's Avatar
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    Neat question.

    Let's see, I just shot him due to fear for my life. Now, overcome with my love of humanity, I rush to his aid and use all my ability to save him...Not a Freakin' chance.

    That would be a lawyers dream. "You see ladies and gentelmen of the jury, Mr. Dulee realized that he had no reason to shoot my client, who was simply lost and entered the wrong home by mistake. So Mr. Dulee, realizing his mistake, then attempted to redeem himself in the eyes of the law, by trying to apply first aid to my client. And furthermore, as we can all see by my clients neckbrace, wheelchair and oxygen mask he failed to render proper aid after unjustifibly shooting my poor client.".

    Nope, he dies. The closest thing to medical action will be me getting a large bottle of hydrogen peroxide and rubber gloves to remove the blood from my floor, walls and clothing.
    People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to violence on their behalf.

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    Member Array BassDaddy777's Avatar
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    I'm starting to see a trend here.

    Usually our imagined scenarios end with the BG getting shot and the Good Guys calling 911. But I doubt that it is that clean. Instead you have a total stranger, (or the kid nextdoor) lying on your floor moaning in agony as the both of you watch his life drain out. Whether he is still a threat or not is up to you.

    Is letting him die that different from putting one between his eyes? At what point do we go from defender (of ourselves and loved ones) to executioner?

    Would you be as concerned about catching something from the BG if he was a shooting victim instead of the villian?

    Are we carrying these guns to stop the BG from causing harm or to clean the gene pool?


    By the way, I am not a bleeding heart (pun intended ) but I had never really examined those hour long minutes while you are waiting for the Cavalry to arrive. I don't think I could sit and do nothing.

    To know good and not do it, is the same as doing evil.

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    Senior Member Array jdsumner's Avatar
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    If you do not check for more threats and/or move to a more secure area from which to view your adversary, you may quickly share the same fate. Do not become complacent because the action has (temporarily?) ceased.
    If you fired upon this person because you were in fear of YOUR life or that of your family's, risking yourself after the shoot seems a wasted endeavor. I do not think that rendering aid is appropriate for this situation. If he is still conscious, and that is likely from a handgun, and is begging for help, you may assure him law enforcement and medical experts are indeed on the way.

    Dan

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    Senior Member Array KC135's Avatar
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    Situational Issue. If I can do so safely, yes.
    Keep the shotgun handy!!

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    Member Array mikaldulee's Avatar
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    I understand what you are asking, but if you do it right, they will only need to go straight to the morgue. If they survive, let the authorities deal with this criminal.

    You are not an executioner if you kill them. Now if they are lying there in a pool of blood and you walk over and shoot them again, you will likely have some problems with the law. I will shoot them until they are no longer a threat, whether it takes 1 bullet or 12. Then when I'm sure for my safety and/or that of others, I will call 911 if I haven't already.

    I don't plan on shooting them to slow them down or scare them. If I draw my weapon, it is because I am in fear for my life or that of another. If I fire, it is to kill, plain and simple.
    People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to violence on their behalf.

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    Ex Member Array F350's Avatar
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    BassDaddy-
    How many of our troops in Iraq have been killed/injured by "dead" wounded BGs??? Do you not think a domestic BG might play hurt worse than he is to gain the advantage??? I will seek a secure place to keep an eye on him until the sheriff's deputies arive, where I live that could be an hour, I'm not getting close enough to touch the SOB.
    Last edited by F350; February 9th, 2005 at 09:57 PM.

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    Unless the BG is down and not moving he is still a threat. Especially if he is wounded /enraged. I will wait for the EMT's and PD to secure the BG.

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