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What would you do? ATM scenario

3K views 33 replies 25 participants last post by  ccw9mm 
#1 ·
I was at the ATM tonight getting some money when I got a really weird feeling. I turned around and someone was standing closer than I was comfortable with. I wasn't carrying cause I'm still waiting for my permit.:frown: It just made me think. What would you do if you turned around to a gun in your face at the ATM? Would you give them the money you got out or would you try to get your gun? If you gave them the money and they turned to leave would you pull your gun when you had the chance? Just curious how everyone would handle this situation.
 
#2 ·
Not trying to sound like I am bagging on you for letting someone get that close to you, but you let the guy get to close. Situational awareness is paramount to every day life, even more so when you have lethal defence on your side.

To answer the question that you posed, some sort of distraction technique like dropping (not throwing) the money or your ATM card. Most people will look at movement. When their attention is diverted, create distance by what ever means necessary. At that point, draw and fire.

At least this is my armchair quarterbacking.
 
#3 ·
You're right. I did let him too close but it was an ATM in front of a store. I usually don't use them but sometimes I can't help it. I don't let anyone get that close at a bank ATM but at the store ones there are people walking by cause they're on the side walk. I'll be a little more conscious of it from now on though.
 
#6 ·
Heh. There are soooo many ways to approach answering that question.

I guess some people's rationale would be that the world is better off without the guy? :scratchchin:
I dunno, just guessin'. This is not a statement about what's moral or legal or whatever, but you asked why someone would shoot him once he's leaving... just offering one hypothetical.
 
#5 ·
What would you do if you turned around to a gun in your face at the ATM? Would you give them the money you got out or would you try to get your gun? If you gave them the money and they turned to leave would you pull your gun when you had the chance? Just curious how everyone would handle this situation.
I'd do what Tom Cruise's character did in the alley in "Collateral" -- knock the guy's gun away, draw, and double-tap him and his partner! :image035:

No, seriously, not sure what I'd do if there was a gun pointed at my face, but I am always on HIGH alert when I use an ATM.

You can bet that if he takes the money and departs, my gun is coming out because I WILL be protected if he changes his mind about leaving me alive as a witness. What would be the point of NOT assuming a strong defensive condition? And I'd be on the phone to 911 a.s.a.p., never taking my eyes off the direction in which he left, and I'd be trying to remember his description. Oh, and I'd be working hard to resist the temptation to shoot the scumbag in the back. :aargh4:
 
#28 ·
There's exactly one reason why I NEVER do that. You have nowhere and nohow to get away. That is assuming the aforementioned is the case. If it's busy, that means there's probably other cars in the line right? One or two in front, maybe a few in back. Bad idea all around. No escape plan. They walk up to the window...you lose. It actually happened a few years back here in VA if I'm not mistaken. I think it was in Herndon. Given the choice, I'll take the outside ATM where at least I can keep an eye on what's going on around me and I have the space to act according to the situation.
 
#9 · (Edited by Moderator)
The best thing to do is make some distance between you and him and be prepared for what if, this would be condition Orange. 99% of condition Orange never develop into condition Red, but you still need to be prepared. Just because you have a piece of paper doesn't mean you can draw down on somebody for standing to close to you.
Be careful, be safe!
 
#10 ·
On top of it all, even the ATMs inside the banks foyer (where you have to swipe your ATM card to get in) aren't even all that safe. For the technically-proficient BGs know that all you have to do is swipe ANY card with a magnetic backing (such as a stolen credit card) to gain access. Most of these restricted entry systems only look for something with data on it, and do not compare that data with any particular database (such as the bank's register of account-holders).

Simply to avoid fees and other nonsense, I do my best to stop at my bank's machines, and more often than not, try to simply go into the bank to withdraw funds (old fashioned, perhaps, but better situational security).
 
#11 · (Edited by Moderator)
That sounded a little harsh. It wasn't meant that way. The situation I was in is not what this was about. It just made me think what I would do if it was a completely different situation(ex. gun in my face). Sorry if everyone read this one wrong. I've seen posts with "what if" situations before and just thought I would post one that I was thinking of.
 
#24 ·
Your scenario is fine. Don't think that any one here is condemning you for your actions. We tend to chalk everything up to experience and share so that perhaps another does not fall victim to the same circustances with a fatal outcome. At least this is the hope.

This is a scenario that we have all been in at some time or another, whether it be before we got our permit to carry, or just one time that we let our guard down with out realizing it. It may not have been at an ATM, perhaps the checkout line at the local gas-n-go, McDonald's, or grocery store.


I like Leadslinger's idea of having his BUG in hand, still concealed, just in case. Something I hadn't thought of, and I have been carrying for nearly 12 years. Some of the things that have been mentioned in other posts and threads are things that I should have been doing for all 12 years, as one would think it to be simple common sense, but like the dummy that I am, I have not. I do now, but have been quite lax in the years prior.

Again, great post. The longer you have access to places like this, the more you will learn. You are just getting into the game. I wish I had had a venue such as this when I started carrying. Perhaps you won't make a lot of the mistakes that many of us have.
 
#12 ·
You know, I can't recall the last time I even used an ATM other than the one inside the grocery store in our town. My bank has a branch located inside the store and the ATM is right there inside next to the tellers and away from the doors into and out of the store. So, it is safer than standing outside and getting money.

But, usually if I need money, I can buy something like a soda or something else and get cash back, thus avoiding any fees incurred by using a different banks ATM or something. So I would say, it has been years since I used an ATM that was outside.

I have apparently been avoiding possibly trouble without even realizing it. That makes me feel pretty good.:image035:

But, as for what I would have done in your situation, if I turned around and there was an armed Bad Guy in my face demanding the money, I'd give it to him. Simple as that, then be a good witness. But, if he gave me any reason to think he was going to shoot me or otherwise harm me, then I am going to do whatever I need to do to draw and end the threat.
Bottom line is this: I carry to protect my family and to insure that no scum takes me away from them. I will protect myself how ever I need to.
 
#13 ·
I have an ATM gun . :image035:

Whenever I go to the (outside) ATM I have mycheckbook in my hand.
Also in my hand (Behind the checkbook) is A NAA mini revolver with a hideAgrip. A 5 shot .22 isn't the best self defense gun BUT it's at the ready in my hand. You would be surprised how quick you can get 5 shots off, with alot of practice. A flick of the wrist and your at the ready. AT least I can divert his attention until I can reach for my primary CCW if necessary.



:comeandgetsome:
 
#14 ·
Bad guy in my face with a gun. . . here is the money, have a nice day.
Not sure if I could draw quick enough. (more training/practice!!)
Bad guy, no gun, pull my gun and hold them for police.
Someone too close, TELL them, please step back a little.
That is with time to think about it in the safty of my home at the keyboard. . .
 
#15 ·
Act like I have just suffered a severe panic attack...drop the cash, start shaking, go to my knees, pull my piece

and send him to hell.
 
#19 ·
Great Idea Here...



Randy,

I like the way you think...and it might just work.

In a recent movie, a car load of young 'thugs' approached an old man and started questioning him about how much money he had. The old guy started digging...pulled out his wallet, "You want this?"...pulled off his watch, "You want this?"...then he reached around back and pulled out his revolver and calmly asked again, "You want this?" The thugs yelled, "F*** *** old man!" as they sped away.

The point being, the distraction kept them off guard while he was able to pull his weapon!

ret:comeandgetsome:
 
#18 · (Edited)
Thats the reason I don't use ATMs any more except in a dire emergency. If I do use one it's in a well lighted and busy area. I would never let someone get that close to me to start with. Be prepared when going to any ATM. Be aware at all times to the point of haveing one hand on your gun.
 
#21 ·
ATMs are for the :sheep:. I get cash from a retailer when I buy something with my debit card, or for large amounts, I will write a check at the bank drive thru.

If I did use an ATM and were approached from behind, it is impossible to say what I would do without knowing the exact circumstances. If I saw an opportunity to draw and fire, I would do so. My thinking would be to survive, not stop the BG from robbing me. That said, if the BG had a knife, there is a good chance that I would draw.
 
#22 ·
I actually do use ATM's. Most of my friends and I prefer having cash for going to bars than opening up a tab, a lot easier to keep track of cash that way (I know drinking is bad, and going to bars can cause problems and I can't carry there, but me and my friends are still young, so let us have our fun.) But about the only time we go is on our way out for the night, since ATMs are all over campus. We usually try to use the ones on the main street, and always move in a group, so as one person gets out money, the rest of us always turn to face the outside to look for threats. Most of the guys I hang out with used to play football and/or are bouncers with me, we have never had a problem in 4 years here.

I won't use an ATM if I am alone, just leaves you too vulnerable. If i turned and saw a gun at my face, he could have my cash, which i would probably throw down to distract him so I could draw or at least throw a punch at him.

If he wasn't a clear threat (i.e. no weapon visible) I would politely ask him to back up, if not, I would cancel the transaction and go elsewhere.
 
#26 ·
But about the only time we go is on our way out for the night, since ATMs are all over campus. We usually try to use the ones on the main street, and always move in a group, so as one person gets out money, the rest of us always turn to face the outside to look for threats. Most of the guys I hang out with used to play football and/or are bouncers with me, we have never had a problem in 4 years here.
I recall that around Christmastime last year, about 20 people were robbed at gunpoint while waiting in line to buy the Playstation 3. Granted, they may not have been bouncers...

My point is that if I read correctly, you all are on your way to go out to the bars, and thus I assume you are all not carrying any CCW, since going into the bars armed would be illegal. So you're unarmed, not CCWing, as you go to the ATM. How are you any better protected than the 20 people in line for the video game system? Your friends may be big, burly guys, but what would they do against a pair of guys who come up pointing guns at them? Sure, vigilance is great, but vigilance plus having a gun is better. I would contemplate a better time and way of getting money for the bars. If you want to go to the bars, fine, no one standing in your way. Hopefully you will soon come to realize that bars aren't all that much fun, and it's pretty foolish to spend on two beers what could get you a whole six pack if you bought it at the beverage store...


If he wasn't a clear threat (i.e. no weapon visible) I would politely ask him to back up, if not, I would cancel the transaction and go elsewhere.
I've been thinking...
If one were uncomfortable with how close the person is standing behind him at the ATM, one could just say, "Excuse me, would you mind giving me a little more space while I do this?" Anyone who would refuse should be made to understand, with your next comment, that there is ample reason for you to regard and deal with anyone who would refuse that sensible request as a threat. "You're refusing a very reasonable request; do you want me to regard you as a hostile threat because you're crowding me at an ATM?" ("Well, do ya, punk?")

Who wants to be perceived as menacing at an ATM? Answer: Only an actual bad guy. I would suspect that anyone else would move back. Maybe be surprised at the comment directed at them, but they'd probably move back. Anyone who doesn't, well, you probably should go orange on them, if not red.
 
#29 ·
In many states, the slugs on welfare get ATM cards, so the probabilility you'll meet unsavory characters will only increase. ATMs in cities are often referred to as victim depots, in the boderline burbs, great for car jackings too. If you see a hoodie (sweatshirt) anywhere, change your plans.
 
#30 ·
In a hypothetical like this I would assume that the majority of the time the BD wants your money and doesn't really plan on hurting you. (yes I know there are some crazy people out there but hurting you in most cases would get loud and decrease his chances for getting away). So asssuming he just wants the cash or wallet I'm fine with it (assuming he already has the drop on me, knife or gun, close distance with knife is just as deadly). So I'd give him whatever he wanted and get my piece ready still concealed while dialing my cell phone in my left hand.

I'd rather loose a couple grand than kill some lowlife and wind up in court about it. I'd lose more than that just by time off or work. Now if there was an instance where the lowlifes purpose was to hurt me then it'd be a different story.

This is comming from a guy who's been mugged twice in his hometown. Both times it was just money (I was 16 and 18 years old) and it was clear that the little I had was all they were going to get.

When I thought I was going to get kidnapped in Ecuador (long story) I would up arming myself with a 40oz bottle that I broke over a totally innocent guy's head, I felt really bad about that later.
 
#31 ·
I work nights, and maintain my sleep schedule on my days off, so sometimes I have to use an ATM at night to make deposits. The only ATM's that my bank has anywhere near my home are of the drive-up variety. Knowing the danger, I prepare my deposit before leaving home, and am at high Orange and scanning the area as soon as I pull into the bank parking lot. As I near the machine, my gun is on my lap and my ATM card/deposit envelope are on the seat beside me. As soon as I am positioned at the ATM, my weapon goes into my strong hand (still inside my vehicle), and I perform the transaction with my weak hand, all the while scanning the area as I wait for the ATM to process the transaction. This doesn't exactly fit the hypothetical scenario in the original post, but this is how I try to avoid finding myself in that kind of a situation. If I were to find myself staring down the barrel of a BG's gun, I would feign compliance as necessary until I was either 1) Able to draw and eliminate the threat, 2) Watching the BG retreat with my money, or 3) Dead.
 
#32 ·
I have a brilliant idea! Carry another identical ATM card in your hand, but it is an old one that is deactivated or is preferably too scratched up to work. Tell the mugger to take it and give him the pin. If he wants you to take the money out yourself, the card won't read, and you can forget about the pin. For example: "This card doesn't work most of the time, I need to get a new one". Take action from there if neccessary, but think about it: is a small amount of money is worth your life or all the hassle it is to shoot somebody?

Or you could break the card in half and give it to him.
 
#33 ·
The only drawback I can see to this is that the BG is already in a aggrivated state. He knows that all it would take is for some random cop to drive around the corner, and BINGO!, he's been made.

By you trying to give him the card and PIN (even if it wasn't the right PIN), this is only going to aggrivate him more. He is after the instant gratification of cash in hand.

By telling him that you will withdrawl the money, whether the card is bad or not, you now have your back to someone the has willingly put a deadly weapon in your face. Those tiny little mirrors that are on most ATM's are about as worthless as ticks on a hound. Plus if he is behind you close enough, most of his body is masked by your own and you can not see what he is doing.

Never take your eyes off of the threat. At least with your back to the ATM or adjacent wall, that is one direction no one else can sneak up on.
 
#34 ·
Situation: Your task is to acquire unsecured cash in hand; your attention is taken by your task; your eyes are down; your "radar" is off; and, you're unarmed.

Result: Tag, you're it.

Solution: Don't do that.

Really, it's about that simple. There be lions at the water hole. No way around that.

There aren't any good answers for how to respond when you've been completely compromised and taken at an ATM. You're unprepared, behind the curve, and very likely have a gun already pointed at you. Best way to avoid this is to avoid walk-up ATM's where the mix is handed over completely to the bad guy.

That said ... What would I do? Not much to be done. I'm not anyone's ninja, and if the BG is smart then he's beyond 3-4 ft and not liable to be disarmed (even if I were to have that skill). I'd hand over the cash, awaiting an angle/position where my gun hand was covered by my body, then likely draw/fire, assuming of course that I had alarm bells warning me it was likely anything more than a simple stick-up. These days, it's all too likely to end badly, as execution of witnesses is becoming more and more common. So, I'd fight, but it would have to be the right moment. Were the BG to actually come up to me where I could access the gun, then I'd have to think very quickly about whether I would/could disarm. I haven't trained for that skill, as yet, so likely not.
 
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