Be Careful When Intervening

This is a discussion on Be Careful When Intervening within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; It doesn't involve a firearm, but I thought this story is a good example of the dangers of intervening when you don't know the situation. ...

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Thread: Be Careful When Intervening

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Be Careful When Intervening

    It doesn't involve a firearm, but I thought this story is a good example of the dangers of intervening when you don't know the situation. A Wisconsin man kicked his way into his upstairs neighbor's apartment holding a cavalry saber in respons to what he thought was the sound of a woman being raped. Turns out it was a porn movie his neighbor was watching. Now the "rescuer" is facing charges.

    So, what would you guys do if you heard noises like that coming from a neighboring apartment? Kick down the door? Ignore them and risk a Kitty Genovese situation? Call 911 and possibly have someone be raped or murdered while awaiting a police response?

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Okay, we need to act NOW!

    Lets work toward banning of pornography, DVDs, Timberland & Wolverine boots, Schlage locks, and swords of any type and make.

    These things are DANGEROUS and the people who own them are a menace.

    - Sarah Brady
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  4. #3
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    Well, sounds like he was good intentioned, just a little over-enthusiastic. Who says chivalry is dead anyway, this guy runs in with a sword to save the "damsel in distress"?

    First of all, there would most likely be much different noises from a rape and a movie, like stuff breaking and hitting walls and such (assuming forcible rape). This would be like running downstairs and kicking in my neighbor's door because I "heard gunshots and screaming" when they were watching an action movie rather loud. I'm no genius, but I can tell the difference.

    On a side note since I am a know-it all college kid, violent "porn" like movies depicting rape and such actually is usually considered obscenity, and illegal in most jurisdictions. Also it has been proven that obscenity with violence or depicting violence is really the only type of pornography that is mentally bad for the viewer, usually because it is associated with sexual predators and part of their progression towards their "ultimate fantasy." Sick stuff, I know, but one of my professors often gets called in as an expert witness on pornography/obscenity and sex offender cases, so I have listened to many hours of lectures on this topic.
    Fortes Fortuna Juvat

    Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
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  5. #4
    Ex Member Array Pete's Avatar
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    Well there is no mention that the movie in question featured rape, just sounded like it to the Ninja guy.
    Also, wouldn't the fact that he could hear equally loud banal muzak be something of a hint that it was just a neighbor watching an 'educational dvd'?

    I wonder who was most embarrassed when the door broke down?

  6. #5
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    Van Iveren said Tuesday that he heard a woman "screaming for help",
    That is what lead me to make those comments. "Normal" pornography wouldn't include screams for help ("normal" in quotes because it is an extremely subjective term, ask a lecture of 100 college students what "normal porn" is, and you get 100 different answers.) Once again too much time in class discussions about this sort of stuff.

    Even if it was just a "normal" movie, a little education never hurt anyone, so now ya know something new (possibly).

    EDIT:
    Also, wouldn't the fact that he could hear equally loud banal muzak be something of a hint that it was just a neighbor watching an 'educational dvd'?
    The muzak tends to only be in older films or higher dollar ones. Most of the stuff that is obscenity doesn't have any, because it is really low budget and low tech. (Did I mention that it is extremely akward to try to have to distinguish the difference between obscenity/pornography in a co-ed class after viewing samples in class.)

    And the legal definition of Obscenity for anyone that cares is "A work is obscene if a reasonable person applying objective (national) standards would find the material lacking in any social value" See the Supreme Court cases of Miller vs. California and Pope vs. Illinois for more info.
    Last edited by buckeye .45; February 21st, 2007 at 02:56 PM.
    Fortes Fortuna Juvat

    Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
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  7. #6
    Ex Member Array Pete's Avatar
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    Buckeye, can I be the first to congratulate you on your encyclopedic knowledge of porn?

    I didn't read the link, I do concede that any porn film with screams for help is either actual or simulated rape.
    Still, Ninja guy should have called 911. At the very least for a disturbance call, playing porn that loud is not responsible.

  8. #7
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    If you think I am bad, you should talk to my one professor. Also, did you know that phone surveys are usually done to determine community standards for obscenity? Not fun doing calls for those.

    Yeah, a 911 call would be best. CHL holders and gun owners are not cops. It isn't our job to be the cavalry and charge in, that is what they get paid for.
    Fortes Fortuna Juvat

    Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
    NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor

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    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buckeye07 View Post
    If you think I am bad, you should talk to my one professor. Also, did you know that phone surveys are usually done to determine community standards for obscenity? Not fun doing calls for those.
    So you're the one making all those calls with the heavy breathing?

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    So you're the one making all those calls with the heavy breathing?
    Nope, never doen a survey out to Utah, the standards there would be interesting to know though due to demographics. And its more of a shy embarrassed voice trying to not laugh at all the questions.
    Fortes Fortuna Juvat

    Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
    NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor

  11. #10
    Senior Member Array PaulG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buckeye07 View Post
    . . . . there would most likely be much different noises from a rape and a movie, like stuff breaking and hitting walls and such (assuming forcible rape). This would be like running downstairs and kicking in my neighbor's door because I "heard gunshots and screaming" when they were watching an action movie rather loud. I'm no genius, but I can tell the difference.
    +1 Buckeye
    fortiter in re, suaviter in modo (resolutely in action, gently in manner).

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    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    Thumbs up True hero

    This is a true hero. He jumped right in there when he thought someone was in trouble. That takes guts. If I were in trouble this guy would be a welcome sight. I hope he didn't get into to much trouble.

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    I Thought...

    a porn movie was just a love story with all the boring parts cut out...

    Actually, if I were to hear screams next door...I'm staying close to the phone...911 only...

    Entry into another's home/apartment is a sure loser...

    ret
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  14. #13
    Member Array Only Glock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom G View Post
    This is a true hero. He jumped right in there when he thought someone was in trouble. That takes guts. If I were in trouble this guy would be a welcome sight. I hope he didn't get into to much trouble.
    +1, Tom.
    When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.
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    Distinguished Member Array BIG E's Avatar
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    Guy breaks in holding a saber and finds his neighbor holding a "saber" too.

    Outstanding work.
    Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft!

    -- Theodore Roosevelt --

  16. #15
    Senior Member Array downrange's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by buckeye07
    . . . . there would most likely be much different noises from a rape and a movie, like stuff breaking and hitting walls and such (assuming forcible rape). This would be like running downstairs and kicking in my neighbor's door because I "heard gunshots and screaming" when they were watching an action movie rather loud. I'm no genius, but I can tell the difference.
    i don't know, with surround sound and everything you could get the false impression there's an open European no holds barred sex fest going on.
    What's this button do?

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