It doesn't involve a firearm, but I thought this story is a good example of the dangers of intervening when you don't know the situation. A Wisconsin man kicked his way into his upstairs neighbor's apartment holding a cavalry saber in respons to what he thought was the sound of a woman being raped. Turns out it was a porn movie his neighbor was watching. Now the "rescuer" is facing charges.
So, what would you guys do if you heard noises like that coming from a neighboring apartment? Kick down the door? Ignore them and risk a Kitty Genovese situation? Call 911 and possibly have someone be raped or murdered while awaiting a police response?
Well, sounds like he was good intentioned, just a little over-enthusiastic. Who says chivalry is dead anyway, this guy runs in with a sword to save the "damsel in distress"?
First of all, there would most likely be much different noises from a rape and a movie, like stuff breaking and hitting walls and such (assuming forcible rape). This would be like running downstairs and kicking in my neighbor's door because I "heard gunshots and screaming" when they were watching an action movie rather loud. I'm no genius, but I can tell the difference.
On a side note since I am a know-it all college kid, violent "porn" like movies depicting rape and such actually is usually considered obscenity, and illegal in most jurisdictions. Also it has been proven that obscenity with violence or depicting violence is really the only type of pornography that is mentally bad for the viewer, usually because it is associated with sexual predators and part of their progression towards their "ultimate fantasy." Sick stuff, I know, but one of my professors often gets called in as an expert witness on pornography/obscenity and sex offender cases, so I have listened to many hours of lectures on this topic.
. . . . there would most likely be much different noises from a rape and a movie, like stuff breaking and hitting walls and such (assuming forcible rape). This would be like running downstairs and kicking in my neighbor's door because I "heard gunshots and screaming" when they were watching an action movie rather loud. I'm no genius, but I can tell the difference.
Well there is no mention that the movie in question featured rape, just sounded like it to the Ninja guy.
Also, wouldn't the fact that he could hear equally loud banal muzak be something of a hint that it was just a neighbor watching an 'educational dvd'?
I wonder who was most embarrassed when the door broke down?
That is what lead me to make those comments. "Normal" pornography wouldn't include screams for help ("normal" in quotes because it is an extremely subjective term, ask a lecture of 100 college students what "normal porn" is, and you get 100 different answers.) Once again too much time in class discussions about this sort of stuff.
Even if it was just a "normal" movie, a little education never hurt anyone, so now ya know something new (possibly).
EDIT:
Also, wouldn't the fact that he could hear equally loud banal muzak be something of a hint that it was just a neighbor watching an 'educational dvd'?
The muzak tends to only be in older films or higher dollar ones. Most of the stuff that is obscenity doesn't have any, because it is really low budget and low tech. (Did I mention that it is extremely akward to try to have to distinguish the difference between obscenity/pornography in a co-ed class after viewing samples in class.)
And the legal definition of Obscenity for anyone that cares is "A work is obscene if a reasonable person applying objective (national) standards would find the material lacking in any social value" See the Supreme Court cases of Miller vs. California and Pope vs. Illinois for more info.
Buckeye, can I be the first to congratulate you on your encyclopedic knowledge of porn?
I didn't read the link, I do concede that any porn film with screams for help is either actual or simulated rape.
Still, Ninja guy should have called 911. At the very least for a disturbance call, playing porn that loud is not responsible.
If you think I am bad, you should talk to my one professor. Also, did you know that phone surveys are usually done to determine community standards for obscenity? Not fun doing calls for those.
Yeah, a 911 call would be best. CHL holders and gun owners are not cops. It isn't our job to be the cavalry and charge in, that is what they get paid for.
If you think I am bad, you should talk to my one professor. Also, did you know that phone surveys are usually done to determine community standards for obscenity? Not fun doing calls for those.
Nope, never doen a survey out to Utah, the standards there would be interesting to know though due to demographics. And its more of a shy embarrassed voice trying to not laugh at all the questions.
This is a true hero. He jumped right in there when he thought someone was in trouble. That takes guts. If I were in trouble this guy would be a welcome sight. I hope he didn't get into to much trouble.
This is a true hero. He jumped right in there when he thought someone was in trouble. That takes guts. If I were in trouble this guy would be a welcome sight. I hope he didn't get into to much trouble.
Originally Posted by buckeye07
. . . . there would most likely be much different noises from a rape and a movie, like stuff breaking and hitting walls and such (assuming forcible rape). This would be like running downstairs and kicking in my neighbor's door because I "heard gunshots and screaming" when they were watching an action movie rather loud. I'm no genius, but I can tell the difference.
i don't know, with surround sound and everything you could get the false impression there's an open European no holds barred sex fest going on.:haha: :gah:
So, what would you guys do if you heard noises like that coming from a neighboring apartment? Kick down the door? Ignore them and risk a Kitty Genovese situation? Call 911 and possibly have someone be raped or murdered while awaiting a police response?
It's a risky world. People will take charge of their self defense or they won't. Doesn't mean everyone's his brother's keeper ... claims of Kitty G. or not. Certainly doesn't mean that this is such a heinous and life-threatening situation, when so very little is known (except a few noises).
Telephoning that neighbor is the simplest method. Short of that, if at night and concerned about being peppered full of holes for the good imitation of a home invader, calling police would be next on the list.
But, knocking down the door in a situation I don't know any details about? Absolutely not. That's a good way to get killed and, thus, not exactly on my list of bright things to do.
"Risking a Kitty G. situation" is a red herring, by the way. There's doing nothing, and then there's doing something while retaining my faculties. Only an obvious/clear situation that demands immediate response to stop a threat to life requires that sort of evaluation. And, as this example shows, it's highly likely that a single uncorroborated fact (noises) will be "read" incorrectly, when so little is known.
Here is the actual news article for those who are interested. Its too bad this dude is getting charged because what he did was pretty brave and he should be commended for his actions not charged for it.
Edit: oh by the way according to the news report he did not have a phone in his apt so he could not call 911 and he did not know the neighbor whose house he busted into with a sword.
I think there is a good chance this guy is either acquitted or the DA elects to drop the charges.
Matt
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