Man shot coming out of bathroom at Wendy's

Man shot coming out of bathroom at Wendy's

This is a discussion on Man shot coming out of bathroom at Wendy's within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; http://www.hometownannapolis.com/cgi...7/03_28-51/TOP Customer shot in fast-food robbery Man hit as he emerged from Wendy's bathroom By JOSHUA STEWART, Staff Writer A customer who came out of ...

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  1. #1
    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Man shot coming out of bathroom at Wendy's

    http://www.hometownannapolis.com/cgi...7/03_28-51/TOP

    Customer shot in fast-food robbery

    Man hit as he emerged from Wendy's bathroom

    By JOSHUA STEWART, Staff Writer
    A customer who came out of the bathroom at a Wendy's in Glen Burnie during a robbery yesterday morning was shot several times in the face by two masked men.

    The men, armed with a black small-caliber pistol and a shotgun, had just emptied the cash register and were walking to the door at the restaurant across Ritchie Highway from Marley Station when they ran into the unsuspecting customer.

    A fight followed and the customer was shot several times, county police said. According to witnesses, the 37-year-old man, whose name police haven't released, ran out of the shop after being shot.

    Police were called to the restaurant at 7905 Ritchie Highway at 11:15 a.m. When paramedics arrived, the man was talking as he was sent by ambulance to the Maryland Shock Trauma Center in Baltimore. Police said he was expected to be released this morning.

    Officers are looking for a Hispanic man armed with a shotgun and a black man armed with a handgun in connection with the robbery and shooting.

    A witness who spoke on condition of anonymity said that when the robbers entered the restaurant, they made everybody get down on the floor.

    "They said: 'Faces on the ground! Kiss the floor,' " the witness said.

    He said he and the clerk behind the counter initially didn't understand what was happening and thought somebody was just fooling around.

    "The girl up front, she thought he was joking. She said, 'Can we help you?' (One robber) said, 'You're getting robbed.' "

    The heist went smoothly and without resistance until the robbers tried to leave, according to witnesses. On their way out they were confronted by the man who was in the bathroom during the holdup.

    After the shooting, the gunmen got into a minivan that was later found abandoned on Robin Road, just a few blocks away.

    Police traced the vehicle and learned that it was reported stolen in Prince George's County, said Lt. David Waltemeyer, a police spokesman.

    After the robbers ditched the van they got into a second minivan, possibly tan, and drove off, witnesses told police. A third person could have been driving the second vehicle, Lt. Waltemeyer said.

    "Most likely it was sitting there waiting," he said.

    Yesterday, police had taped off entrances to the restaurant. A yellow safety cone held open one of the side doors, allowing views of turned-over chairs and officers interviewing employees.

    Customers from a nearby pharmacy briefly stopped while entering and leaving the store, watching police work. One investigator combed the restaurant's back lot while others documented the scene, marking evidence with placards.

    There were several shell casings spread along the floor, Lt. Waltemeyer said.

    Erin Lassen, spokesman for the owner of the Wendy's, said there had never been a violent crime at the store before yesterday's shooting. She said she didn't know exactly how many employees were there during the robbery, but none of them was hurt.

    "It was lunchtime. We probably would have had more staff than any other time of the day," she said.

    Police said about six customers were there at the time, and investigators were in the process of interviewing them.

    The timing of the robbery, the busy lunch hour, was unusual, Lt. Waltemeyer said.

    Ms. Lassen said the restaurant re-opened today.
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

    Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
    Paramedics With Guns Scare People!


  2. #2
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    Good Scenario.

    No comments on this one folks?

    So do you personally "Kiss The Floor" in this scenario?

    It looks like everybody that licked the floor in this instance survived unscathed...and the guy that had to pee caught the lead.

    I'll bet he peed a little bit more after he got shot in the kisser too.

    Even though I avoid public restrooms like the plague I'm probably taking a chance catching lead rather than kissing floor.
    I've never been much of a floor kisser.

    I honestly don't think I can ever place my body and my life in a completely helpless, docile, and subjugated position at the complete mercy of armed Adrenalin crazy thugs.

    That is not to say that I wouldn't have hauled my a$$ back into the bathroom ASAP if I had that opportunity.

    I'm not kissing the floor though even if it means two ambulances required rather than just one.
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  3. #3
    Senior Member Array PaulG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    Good Scenario.

    No comments on this one folks?

    So do you personally "Kiss The Floor" in this scenario?

    It looks like everybody that licked the floor in this instance survived unscathed...and the guy that had to pee caught the lead.

    I'll bet he peed a little bit more after he got shot in the kisser too.

    Even though I avoid public restrooms like the plague I'm probably taking a chance catching lead rather than kissing floor.
    I've never been much of a floor kisser.

    I honestly don't think I can ever place my body and my life in a completely helpless, docile, and subjugated position at the complete mercy of armed Adrenalin crazy thugs.

    That is not to say that I wouldn't have hauled my a$$ back into the bathroom ASAP if I had that opportunity.

    I'm not kissing the floor though even if it means two ambulances required rather than just one.
    +1

    I agree 100%. I've always said that I might be killed but I won't be executed.

    Also, if I was coming out of the bathroom and saw the bad guys heading for the door and they haven't shot anyone, I think it is safe to assume that no one will be hurt.

    If on the other hand they start shooting people, I would have to get involved.

    Hind sight is 20/20 but I think the guy would have been better off not confronting the bad guys as long as it looked like they wouldn't hurt anyone.
    fortiter in re, suaviter in modo (resolutely in action, gently in manner).

  4. #4
    Member Array jednp's Avatar
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    As usual, the sheep is painted clearly into the picture from the beginning. How many damn times do I have to watch security camera videos on tv, on the internet, read stories like this... where the employees being robbed... think it's a JOKE? What possibly could be a joke about that? I will never take anyone appearing to be robbing me.. as a joke.

    People truly are clueless as to what dangers lurk out there, they can't even see them when they present themselves right in front of their face.

    Now I don't know about you... but I'd think that guy in the bathroom might have had the chance to hear people yelling and screaming and get a sense that something may be going on in the restaurant.. One thing I think we can learn from this, is if we're in the bathroom and we start hearing screams, shouts, threats.. stay in the bathroom! Bathrooms are NOT located in strategic places usually.. they usually have you pinned down in a narrow hallway with nowhere to go.

    You know, my girlfriend sometimes gives me crap because I don't like sitting close to doors of restaurants.. and Wendy's in particular comes to mind with this too. I always try to sit toward the spot furthest away from the doors.. and guess what? Every time I've seen cops in there eating, they sit in the same general area. They do not sit near the doors. Sitting near the doors, makes you a very easy initial target with no ability to respond if you need to.

    Not saying that you SHOULD respond... as we all know, each situation is different.. obviously you don't want to get up and start walking toward them with a gun.. as soon as you get up you're likely to get shot. But god forbid if they started shooting the customers that were laying on the ground near them.. you just lay there at the rear of the store with your gun still holstered. Distance is your friend here, it allows you to not be an initial target, and it allows you SOME concealment to draw your weapon and not be noticed by them hopefully.. so you can react if they come your way. One person against 2 gunmen willing to shoot.. is not a good scenerio you want to be in. You've got to worry about yourself, maybe your family.. you have to realize that innocent people might be killed by these people in the process.. and if you don't act correctly, you could make things worse.. so make sure if you act... you can do so without getting yourself gunned down as soon as you prepare to act.. then you just probably made it even worse for others there.

  5. #5
    Member Array jednp's Avatar
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    you know, some would say.. that's just a horrible thing to say.

    and lets not confuse good people with bad people.. but man, in my city... all the robberies, the shootings, they all are coming from those two races.. I just don't get it.

    There are PLENTY of good people who are black or hispanic.. plenty. I just don't get why so many of the bad violent criminals we have in my city at least.. are most often from those two races. it baffles me really.. and it's sad really... those morons bring about so much racism to the good people of their race, by their contant bad and violent actions.

    you watch security camera tapes.. I'm gonna say probably 80% on camera are just who you listed above. it's just confusing to me.. wish there was some way society could make these thugs realize they need to quit acting like this.
    Last edited by rocky; April 1st, 2007 at 12:41 PM. Reason: deleted quoted text

  6. #6
    Member Array kd5nrh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paramedic70002 View Post
    A customer who came out of the bathroom at a Wendy's in Glen Burnie during a robbery yesterday morning was shot several times in the face by two masked men.
    [SNIP]
    According to witnesses, the 37-year-old man, whose name police haven't released, ran out of the shop after being shot.
    [SNIP]
    When paramedics arrived, the man was talking as he was sent by ambulance to the Maryland Shock Trauma Center in Baltimore. Police said he was expected to be released this morning.
    Shot "several times" in the face with a handgun and a shotgun, still talking when EMS gets there, and released from the hospital next day? I'd definitely be buying some lottery tickets.

  7. #7
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    When you are staring at 2 bad guys with guns and a few innocent people around you would you really take the shot. If it was one guy in this situation I probably would but two make me wonder. I am not worried about me but the people around me. That is a tough decision and to top it all off it would probably all happen in a matter of seconds. As for the people thinking it is a joke does not surprise me at all.

  8. #8
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    I've worked retail & fast food. I didn't always "see" past the counter. I'm not surprised the clerk didn't notice the weapons at first.

    tman

  9. #9
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    Sometimes A Man Has To Fight...

    I'm not getting on the floor, unless it's to get a better shot from cover.

    The simple life of retirement is getting less simple and more dangerous...

    I will NOT let myself be put into the 'execution position'...if I'm going to die, I won't be going alone...

    OMO

    Stay armed...stay alert...stay safe!

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    Member Array Gadfly's Avatar
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    The whole bathroom scenario is basically a "no win". Think of all the damn noises in there that would: 1) give your sorry butt away and 2) make it hard for you to hear if anything is going down out in the restaurant
    [Examples: noisy hand dryers; toilets flushing, water running, people talking]
    I don't see how you could hope for a surprise confrontation--more likely that YOU (just like the victim) would be surprised.
    Concealed carry depends upon the element of surprise. Not available in this scenario.

    I've thought often about the fast-food robbery scenario. Would it be better to shoot it out straight away? Or, play-act that you're respectful, scared and compliant long enough to draw and take them out? Or, go along with the program 100% if they haven't shot anyone (yet)?
    BTW: if the customers are on the floor and the bad guys are standing, doesn't that present a better situation for going mano-a-mano?
    Another thought. The timing would have to be almost perfect: 1) take the BGs out just as they start the robbery [e.g. liquor store hold-up in 'Taxi Driver'], or 2) wait for the situation to stabilize (if it ever does) until bad guys have let their guard down. Hard to call--must be why I think about it so often.
    Don't forget to bow as the chariot passes.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array Shadowsbane's Avatar
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    Wouldnt lieing down prone expose a firearm in most situations? I would think that if a robber would notice one could be mistaken for a police officer, which would be a very bad thing if you were already on the floor and helpless.

    As far as the bathroom senario goes, not the ideal place to be no, however the inside of the bathroom could present a nice choke point in which to direct your fire. In any senario like the one above I would at least aim for the guy with the shotgun first, as his aim does not need to be nearly as good, and has the better chance of injuring bystanders. That is if I had to shoot. Simple no injury robbery with no exposure of concealed firearm then be a good witness.
    Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.

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    Member Array jednp's Avatar
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    You know, the truth to the matter.. generally... in situations like this you're most likely to just comply. Heck, some of us may be carrying a gun that is smaller than we'd prefer, but we carry it for the average attack most people typically face... and it's light enough that it does not bother us.. it's better than a big gun left at home.. right?

    But do you REALLY want to confront two gunmen with a .32 acp or similar? The gun you have on you, will greatly affect what options you have available to you in a situation like this.

    The other bad thing about this is when robbers come in and seem to only want the money... part of you thinks.. ok.. they are just after the money, not threatening to shoot anyone.. hopefully it will be over soon. And the other part of your brain is saying I have to act.. I have to stop this.

    there's a downfall to either of those situations. You can not act, and things go perfect and they leave without harming someone.. or instead they shoot an employee or customer shortly after you thought about acting.. but didn't.

    Or you could open fire, and make them fire... when before they had no intention to.. possibly putting more innocent people in harms way now in a gunfight.

    I guess I can't say this is the best outcome.. best would be them leaving without hurting anyone.. but 2nd best, you act and take them down without incident.

    this is just like any other situation.. there is absolutely no way to tell beforehand what you will do. You can sit and say "i'm gonna shoot, I don't care" while you're on here.. but who knows if you will when it comes down to it.

    Certainly it's good to discuss these things.. it could potentially help one of us some day if things go how we somewhat planned for.. we just have to remember to always leave every option wide open.

  13. #13
    Member Array jednp's Avatar
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    I ate at wendy's tonight.. I have a few "tactical" spots picked out to sit at if available. They provide concealment, and some cover, and they are toward the back of the restaurant.. instead of right near the entrance where you can be an immediate target. There's no way they'd see you getting your gun out from this spot.

    I tend to notice the cops that eat there, sit around that general area too... I'm guessing it's probably for the same reason as I chose it. First you aren't noticed right away... and what better thing to have happen, than to have a cop in the store.. unnoticed and able to act with the element of surprise on his side?

  14. #14
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    I personally would comply.

    The reasons are numerous including I could give a care about robbery of an insured cash register along with a bag of McFood.
    As well this would work to my advantage being face down as I could better hide my IWB and 3:00 carried CCW...and my hand being on it for deployment. As well it's easier for me being in a prone positong to fire a deadly accurate headshot than from a standing position while it's tougher for them to do same or similar from a standing & moving position. Even if I were carrying at the kidney the advantage remains same similar. If possible and available I'd try to roll/creep/reposition myself behind or next to solid cover such as a counter.

    If they decided to move us to a back room or the basement, I'd then fight with ferocity as that almost never plays out well. Same would apply if they decided to rob the patrons by physically laying hands on them/me but if they asked we empty our own pockets and hand over watches & wallets, then again I would comply.

    As to coming out of the bathroom into a stickup with the BGs right in my face, thats just a really bad luck of the draw. Very likely the poor guy had no choice to backpedal or comply. :(

    - Janq
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  15. #15
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    Not a good situation.

    I have thought about this type of thing and I am not sure that I could put myself at the mercy of the scum bags either.

    I'd rather go down fighting that cowering on the floor face down.
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