scumbags disguised as cops - Page 3

scumbags disguised as cops

This is a discussion on scumbags disguised as cops within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I live in a small town ( that makes me lucky by default ) where I know all the officers in the county . My ...

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Thread: scumbags disguised as cops

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    I live in a small town ( that makes me lucky by default ) where I know all the officers in the county . My best advise for raiding my house is to call , and i will surrender myself immediately to any officers invlolved , be they local , state , or federal . No argument , no discussion , i give up and wont attempt to harm anyone . My day will come in court . That being said and ment , if an agency for whatever reason chooses to kick my doors , well the point man better be in uniform , and without a face mask , otherwise its going to go really bad really fast . I will submit without question to any LE no matter what , but i will also resist any " unidentified " intruders no matter what . For me at least a " fake uniform and a badge from dunkan donuts " wont get it . If its right its a case of ill see you in court , if its wrong its a case of My house , and ill see you in hell .
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
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    Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.


  2. #32
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by obxned View Post
    One of the big advantages to small-town America is the cops already know who are the good guys and who are the bad. Heck, everybody knows everyboy elses business.
    Quote Originally Posted by Smith&Wessonfan View Post
    Not an advantage to those who wish to keep their private lives private.
    But, a definite advantage to one who wishes to avoid "invasion" terrorism in the night.

    It's one of the things I don't like in a larger, faceless city ... that heightened risk of break-ins. Portland is that, and has that.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
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  3. #33
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    Guys this is a tough issue , and the protective clothing that " warrant service teams " may wear does not help . I for one tend to think of " bad guy " when i see a masked man , It may not be right , and may lead to a bad choice on my part . but none the less there it is . As stated tho If i know its a police action i will submit , no matter what , no matter how , If its the police the court is the place to address the matter , not with the officers serving the warrant . If i see a local uniform in the " lead " then i absolutly would not shoot , If the team behaved in what i would consider a " professional " manner then i would not shoot . LE as a rule has a rough job , and the officers serving me a warrant likely only know they have a valid warrant that is signed by a judge . Right or wrong they MUST serve it , just like the other ones they have for today . They dont know if i did anything right or wrong , they know that some judge somewhere belives i did wrong to the point he instructed them to come arrest me , and in the manner they are instructed by the court to serve the warrant . A ripoff crew is unlikely to be able to come thro a door like a warrant service team , nor once inside they show any professionalisim and concern for the folks they find .. just food for thought .
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
    We only begin to understand folks after we stop and think .

    Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.

  4. #34
    Senior Member Array mark555's Avatar
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    About 10 years ago the cops hit a door in Topeka KS, no knock, no announcement. The guy inside called 911 and shot through the door, killing one of the cops. He was wounded in the return fire, tried and found guilty of intent to sell (marijuana). They could not get him on the shooting.
    "Hell of a thing, killin' a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have."
    - William Munny (Clint Eastwood in the Unfrogivin)

    “The graveyards are full of indispensable men.” – Napoleon Bonaparte

    “My Idea of a fair fight is beating baby seals with a club”

  5. #35
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redneck Repairs View Post
    A ripoff crew is unlikely to be able to come thro a door like a warrant service team , nor once inside they show any professionalisim and concern for the folks they find .
    How would anyone not "in the business" know the difference?

    Beats me what a "ripoff crew" method is as compared to a "warrant service team" method. That's exactly why it's such an effective ruse. As effective as asking for the time, or asking for directions.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  6. #36
    Member Array OfClanMcnab's Avatar
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    Shoot first, questions later. It's up to them to get the right house. As soon as I hear 'BOOM' downstairs as a door is kicked in, I'll be out of bed with my AR in hand. If I hear 'Police!!', then I'll shout 'You've got the wrong house' and 'I've got a gun'. If they try to come upstairs, I'm going to unload about 15 rounds of .223 down the stairs.

    If it is the police, hopefully they have the good sense to get a negotiator, or else some of them are going to die coming up the stairs. If it is bad guys, I'll just have the pleasure of taking out a 'ripoff crew'.

  7. #37
    Member Array lostone1413's Avatar
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    If we still had a 3rd and 4th amendment to the BOR things like this couldn't happen. Hell we even have a Constitution anymore? Doesn't look that way
    Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.
    — John F. Kennedy

  8. #38
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    Amendment III
    No soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.
    I may be missing something, but how is this relevant to the conversation?

    Also, to all those "shoot first, even if they are in uniform and identify themselves as police" guys... Remember that we've only seen one or two documented instances of home invasion robbers dressed as police, and not very well dressed at that. Defend yourselves, by all means, but remember that you are talking about a statistically insignificant scenario...
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  9. #39
    Member Array broknindarkagain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OfClanMcnab View Post
    As soon as I hear 'BOOM' downstairs as a door is kicked in, I'll be out of bed with my AR in hand. If I hear 'Police!!', then I'll shout 'You've got the wrong house' and 'I've got a gun'. If they try to come upstairs, I'm going to unload about 15 rounds of .223 down the stairs.

    If it is the police, hopefully they have the good sense to get a negotiator, or else some of them are going to die coming up the stairs. If it is bad guys, I'll just have the pleasure of taking out a 'ripoff crew'.
    That would probably be the best rout to go if you're concerned of intruders impersonating the police. If you tell the police you have a gun and will open fire if they come up, chances are they are going to get a negotiator in. Either that or S.W.A.T. would come in and kick your ass.

    If you are not in a bad neighborhood and no one in your home is wanted by the police for anything...then you shouldn't have to worry about the police knocking down your door.

    I would never give up my weapon until I knew without a doubt that it was the police. Until then I would take cover and be ready to open fire.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

    Smith & Wesson M&P9c

  10. #40
    Senior Member Array mark555's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    I may be missing something, but how is this relevant to the conversation?
    Funny guy, funny, funny guy…thanks I needed that.
    "Hell of a thing, killin' a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have."
    - William Munny (Clint Eastwood in the Unfrogivin)

    “The graveyards are full of indispensable men.” – Napoleon Bonaparte

    “My Idea of a fair fight is beating baby seals with a club”

  11. #41
    Member Array OfClanMcnab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by broknindarkagain View Post
    That would probably be the best rout to go if you're concerned of intruders impersonating the police. If you tell the police you have a gun and will open fire if they come up, chances are they are going to get a negotiator in. Either that or S.W.A.T. would come in and kick your ass.

    If you are not in a bad neighborhood and no one in your home is wanted by the police for anything...then you shouldn't have to worry about the police knocking down your door.

    I would never give up my weapon until I knew without a doubt that it was the police. Until then I would take cover and be ready to open fire.
    Exactly. I kind of doubt police will come charging up a dark stairwell, knowing that someone has a gun at the top of the stairs. It is much easier to bring in SWAT or a negotiator. If it really is police, they will back off long enough to bring in SWAT and/or a negotiator, and presumably double-check the address. This delay will give my wife time to get through to 911. Once we make contact with a dispatcher the situation should be easily resolved.

  12. #42
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  13. #43
    Member Array lostone1413's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    I may be missing something, but how is this relevant to the conversation?

    Also, to all those "shoot first, even if they are in uniform and identify themselves as police" guys... Remember that we've only seen one or two documented instances of home invasion robbers dressed as police, and not very well dressed at that. Defend yourselves, by all means, but remember that you are talking about a statistically insignificant scenario...
    The swat teams aren't peace officers they have become a paramilitary organization. That make the 3 amendment relevant. But if you don't see how the 3rd amendment is relevant to the conversation then maybe the 4th amendment can clear it up. That is unless the BOR you have is different then what was put in the constitution
    Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.
    — John F. Kennedy

  14. #44
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lostone1413 View Post
    The swat teams aren't peace officers they have become a paramilitary organization. That make the 3 amendment relevant.
    I still don't see how this is relevant. Even if SWAT officers were considered soldiers, no one is being asked to quarter them. They're not busting down the door because they want to hold a sleepover.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by lostone1413 View Post
    The swat teams aren't peace officers they have become a paramilitary organization. That make the 3 amendment relevant. But if you don't see how the 3rd amendment is relevant to the conversation then maybe the 4th amendment can clear it up. That is unless the BOR you have is different then what was put in the constitution
    No, the 3rd Amendment is still entirely irrelevant. Even if the people serving the warrant were, in fact, Active Duty military, they aren't being quartered in the home. The 3rd Amendment was designed to prevent the new government from forcing private homeowners to house and feed soldiers without proper remuneration. It has absolutely nothing to do with what’s being discussed here.

    As for the 4th, of course that is the heart of the matter. The question is; what is reasonable? That word appears quite often in law, and is always a point of contention. You may think that NK warrants are unreasonable, but the SCOTUS has decided otherwise. They do not violate the “no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized” portion of the Amendment, considering that they are extra steps involved in getting a NK warrant over a standard warrant.

    I understand people’s fear of having their homes and privacy violated by an improperly obtained warrant, but the fact is that this is a HIGHLY unlikely event. It appears, however, that it is more likely than being the victim of a criminal home invasion where the perpetrators are convincingly dressed as police. That being the case, I’m simply urging people to take the “averages” into account when they say they’re going to blast away at a group of people wearing POLICE insignia and shouting “POLICE, WE HAVE A WARRANT” when they come through the door. Nothing more, nothing less…
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

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