Scenario: ACTUAL Scenario

This is a discussion on Scenario: ACTUAL Scenario within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; This was taken from another public forum. Before you folks accuse me of swiping it let me explain why I sometimes do things like this. ...

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Thread: Scenario: ACTUAL Scenario

  1. #1
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    Scenario: ACTUAL Scenario

    This was taken from another public forum. Before you folks accuse me of swiping it let me explain why I sometimes do things like this.
    My gut feeling is that many of our members here just do not visit many other gun related forums.
    Actual real life firearm "drawn weapon" scenarios are few & far between.
    We can all hopefully learn something from reading about other folks actual "real life situations" ~ no matter if they ended up in gunplay or not.
    And...also no matter if the encounter was well handled...or not.
    We should (at least) read it and think about it.
    It is a GOOD thing to be able to play "armchair critique professional" & hopefully we will add some tidbits of defensive information to our personal "knowledge base" of "Do & Don't" for any possible future nasty event.

    Here is the story presented "word for word" but without any name attached to it. Please feel free to "weigh in" on it with your comments and opinions.
    I'll refrain from posting any of my own comment or opinion for the time being.

    "It happened in 1992. I was in my car, with all of my windows down, on a warm summer day. I was the second stopped car from a red light. The man driving the car in front of me appeared to be occupied with something in the floorboard of his car as he was hunched down and not looking at the traffic light. When the light turned green he didn't notice; therefore, he kept his car still. After about five or six seconds, I very lightly tapped my horn to alert him that the light had changed.

    He apparently took offense to my alerting him this way. I was still behind him at the next red traffic light. Other cars were all around me, stopped at the large interchange, so I couldn't just drive off. While stopped at the interchange, he got out of his car and started towards me. In response, I reached into my bag for my Glock 17, got it out, and put it between my knees. The man placed his entire upper body into my car, through the passenger-side window, placed his right hand onto my passenger-side seat and opened a switchblade knife. He said, "Do you want to settle something mother *****er?"

    I placed my chambered Glock 17 in his face and said, "Get away from my car." The man quickly removed himself from my car window and even hit his head on the top of the door on his way out. He dropped his knife on the concrete, grabbed his gut with both hands, and bent over as if he thought he had been shot. It was apparent that he was extremely frightened.

    I'm glad I didn't have to fire a shot. I would NEVER want to hurt anyone! I think the man learned a valuable lesson, however. He will most likely NEVER do such a thing again. I may have SAVED his life as the next guy might actually have used his handgun."


    QKShooter just tossed you folks some bloody Red Meat didn't he??? Comments?

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  3. #2
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    As I see it - the ''reminder'' at first red light was well in order, and probably polite - a ''toot'' and not a blast it'd seem. For most folks that is a mere ''Oops, sorry'' for them - wake up call.

    If someone in the wrong takes exception to this they are either having a bad day and/or - are looking for trouble.

    It might be argued windows down was risky but heck - we should be able to do this!

    When irate driver presents into car (space invasion) and then produces an edged weapon - I'd say presentation of a piece was justified. One more bad move of the knife and maybe a discharge of said piece could have been justfied.

    The raconteur was IMO not breaking any laws. Good he did not have to shoot but - had he done so I think ''I was in fear of my life'' would have been a cogent statement.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  4. #3
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Mine wasn't so dramatic, as no weapon was presented and there was no verbal exchange, but I've been in a similar situation before.

    The situation I was in did not escalate to this degree thank goodness, but I sure was glad that gun was there with me. On that day it paid for itself.

    By the way, I have never honked my horn except once to signal my father to unlock the front door at his request, and that was years ago. I almost agree with the stand up comedian who said "You should get about 3 honks a month on the car horn and that's it."

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    Thumbs up Thanks Euclidean & P95Carry

    You input is appreciated.

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    I'll refrain from posting any of my own comment or opinion for the time being.
    I'll be waiting!!
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Seems lieka good decision to carry. I think I would crank the window up on em, if he was out of reach from me as well as draw a weapon on em. Also be aware of others who may be closing in, I would be suspecting a possible car jack attempt at this point. Always check yer 6.

  8. #7
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    Quote:I'm glad I didn't have to fire a shot. I would NEVER want to hurt anyone!

    Then why is he carrying a pistol?


    When you’re wounded and left on Afghanistan’s plains,
    And the women come out to cut up what remains,
    Just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains,
    And go to your God like a soldier.

    Rudyard Kipling


    Terry

  9. #8
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    CC - yes that is a slight paradox. I take that tho to mean what I might say myself. I do not want - meaning I'd prefer not to have to ....... meaning I have no innate burning desire to blow someone's brains away. Maybe the word ''never'' was a poor choice on his part.

    That said - I carry because in extremis - if someone is a threat sufficient to put me in fear of my life (or those dear to me) I most surely WILL shoot and hurt, badly - sufficient I hope to thwart the attempt. After, I will deal with whatever psycho type effects I might suffer, in the knowledge that I am there to do so - and a scumbag did NOT succeed!

    It's the simple ''him or me'' equation.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  10. #9
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    When i saw the guy getting out of his car my windows would have been getting rolled up. Other than that i think he handled it just fine. I have a can of fox labs in easy reach too should the belligerant ******* need a face of peper spray instead of lead.

  11. #10
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    First let me say that I'm one of those that doesn't look at other forums. (I'm totally faithful to Bumper, you lucky devil!! ) So I'm glad to see these posted from other places.

    In this scenario I think that the guy acted properly, provided that, as stated, it was a toot of the horn and that he didn't provoke the angry mororist by blowing the guys ears off in his own case of road rage.
    I would have taken the same action. Then I would have called 911 to report the incident so that the other guy could not make up his own story as to what happened.
    Heroes are people who do what has to be done, when it has to be done, regardless of the consequences

    "I like when the enemy shoots at me; then I know where the ******** are and can kill them."
    ~George Patton

    DE OPPRESSO LIBER

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    I missed this somehow earlier but would go agree with most of what has been said so far. I think the guy was justified with the toot of the horn and the display of his weapon. And it does pretty much sound like the guy learned a lesson that day about sticking his body inside someone's window. The comment the guy NEVER wanting to hurt anyone anyone is (I hope) technically correct for most people. Place them emphasis on the word "want" and it takes on a whole new meaning. And if you ever have to shoot I would not suggest telling the police officer that you "sure did WANT to shoot that guy".

    The one thing I wouldn't do is discharge OC in my car in this situation, or many others. IMO, if he has a knife the proper escalation of force goes up the scale not down. I keep all of my windows up except for the driver's side window and my sunroof when the weather is nice enough and I am anywhere else but the open highway....
    Bumper
    Coimhéad fearg fhear na foighde; Beware the anger of a patient man.

  13. #12
    Senior Member Array Prospector's Avatar
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    Red face

    I agree with acparmed on this (forum loyalty too)....I remind with a short toot for those preoccupied at lights too. I think the guy did right thing, he neutralized a bad situation with a show of greater force. But like stated in other threads, you gotta be mentally prepared to pull that trigger. At what point in this scenario would that decision be made? I'd have to say if he didn't immediately retreat.

    Getting the bozos plate number, and if safe to do so, I'd retrieve the dropped knife as evidence, then call 911.

  14. #13
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    Some Additional Thoughts

    A quick "The Light Is Green" "toot" on the horn by this guy was absolutely justified. It is an action that most of us normal folks actually appreciate.
    Obviously...our good driver already realized that he was "boxed in" with no place to go. I think that in this exact situation the more appropriate "VERY First Action" would have been to get the window up.
    In my opinion that should probably have been the first response if the potential aggressor exited his vehicle and was NOT brandishing an obvious weapon. IDEALLY one should put up the windows AND at the same time gain access to a defensive firearm. We are usually capable of doing two things at once.
    This happened in 1992 & so what is not stated is if his car was equipped with power windows & door locks. A closed window goes a long way toward delaying an instant knife attack or a human hot~headed body into the vehicle. Also (on the remote chance) that the attacker had a SNS (Sat Night Specl) type of low caliber weapon...I personally would want a sheet of car window safety glass between me and say a .25 or .32 caliber bullet.
    Aside from NOT having quicker access to his (in car) firearm ~ I can't really see where this driver did much of anything else wrong.
    I DO wonder though if the Road Rager (once inside the car) had decided to quickly "slash at throat" with his switchblade...INSTEAD of being instantly intimidated by the sight of the GLOCK...if...our good driver would have been mentally prepared to act or would have been in process of bleeding to death.
    We have no way of knowing. Thank God.
    I'm glad that everything worked out OK.
    Please do not ever count on just the appearance of your firearm to thwart an attack.
    It is a Lucky Day these days when the mere sight of a firearm fends off an aggressive attack for you!
    I totally agree with Bumper that nobody should ever WANT to shoot anybody. I sure don't. I'll be GLAD anytime I don't hafta shoot anybody.
    My gut feeling is that our Good Guy could stand to "gain a heap" by joining CombatCarry.com as do we all!
    He strikes me as being a good guy...caught up in a bad situation through no fault of his own.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

  15. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by acparmed
    I would have taken the same action. Then I would have called 911 to report the incident so that the other guy could not make up his own story as to what happened.
    That's what I was waiting for! As soon as the guy stepped back I'd have been on the cell phone reporting what I "had" to do, along with the guy's plate number.
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

  16. #15
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    Then I would have called 911 to report the incident so that the other guy could not make up his own story as to what happened.
    I would have just waited until they showed up to pick up the body to explain what happened.


    Man in my window + armed with a knife = fear of life and limb
    Last edited by F350; April 20th, 2005 at 11:59 AM.

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