You Won, You Also Lose? - Page 2

You Won, You Also Lose?

This is a discussion on You Won, You Also Lose? within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Betty One of the many reasons I'm going to enjoy having a bigger 4x4 pickup is that I can tackle bits of ...

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Thread: You Won, You Also Lose?

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Betty View Post
    One of the many reasons I'm going to enjoy having a bigger 4x4 pickup is that I can tackle bits of terrain a lot of regular cars can't.
    "One of the 'virtues' of owning a 4wd is that you can get stuck farther from a paved road than the guy who only owns a 2wd."
    -Overheard on an internet forum.


  2. #17
    Senior Member Array Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    On the road in your vehicle there is always somewhere to flee.

    Throw your vehicle into reverse and leave that way.
    If blocked in by two cars then select low gear and push your way through the other car hitting it in a rear corner using the opposite corner (not front!) of your own car.
    Or if surrounded by persons on foot armed or unarmed who mean to do you harm, again select low gear...plot your path of least resistance and quickest escape...then drive through and/or up over them.

    You do what you has to be done, to get yourself home safely and in one piece.
    Below is an example of what can and does happen to people who do not know as much or have trouble thinking on the fly toward their own survival. keep in mind the largest and most useful weapon at hand is the 2K+ motorized vehicle that you are in control of.

    As reported by CBS11TV.com:
    Exclusive: Teens Pelt Driver With Bricks, Stones
    Woman Says She Only Tried To Stop A Fight Between Them
    Jay Gormley
    Reporting
    (CBS 11 News) DALLAS A woman trying to break up a fight says she was attacked in broad daylight. The woman's truck was pelted with bricks and stones by nearly 50 teenagers in an upscale neighborhood in Dallas. The victim says it was caught on video, but the tape has yet to surface...
    The full story can be found at; http://cbs11tv.com/local/local_story_066221802.html

    Edit: After posting I noticed Limatunes own story.
    Agreed 100%...being forced off the road is not the end of your options as most any car can and will drive over grass, gravel, dirt, and even snow as well as tarmac.
    It ain't over until the coroner cuts you...think and fight to your last breath.
    Thats all a little easier said than done.

    As I stated, I was in my car not my truck. There is NO WAY I could have budged a monster truck looking F350 with a small car (I bought it for gas mileage)
    Now, if I had my jungle safari rigged 4x4, maybe I could have winched those A-holes into on coming traffic. lol

    Also, There was no way to really back up either. The point of where the began to swerve, there was very little shoulder due to it being a mountain top cliff that was guard railed.

    If I were to be stopped and tried to back up, I would have slammed right into 70MPH(yes that was the speed limit) traffic behind me.

    I think, you are all right about getting on the horn with 911. That would be the best witness.
    Primary Carry Gun: Sig Sauer 229~R (.40cal w/ Golden Saber JHP's)

  3. #18
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    There is also the option to slow down, to a crawl if necessary, whilst staying in your lane on road in traffic forcing them to either continue pass you or to do same.
    If they do same the get ff the road at you first opportunity of an exit or I'd get to the far left lane and make a J turn to go in the opposite direction.

    My point is just to keep thinking and do so out of the box if neccessary.
    Even in a small sized car options are available.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  4. #19
    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miggy View Post
    Quick queestion slightly off topic. Sixto and other LEOs, what kind of information would a 911 require in order to process a call with the due priority needed? What should we say first, second, third, etc?
    That all depends on the 9-1-1 center. If it is a center with a computer aided dispatch system, you need to enter a location recognized by the computer system and a call type at minimum. Some systems allow "common place names" to be put in the geobase, some require a street address or an intersection. The common place names, like "McDonalds" would then bring up a list of all of the McDonalds in that jurisdiction and the the dispatcher has to pick from the list. If it is a non C.A.D. center it depends on how familiar the call takers are with the area. If they know where the big rock is on the road that goes from "A" to "B" that could be enough.

    What I told my rookies to ask was:
    1) What is happening? (needed to know if it was for us or fire/rescue)
    2) Where is it happening?
    3) Who is involved? ( name, description of people/ vehicles etc.)
    4) Weapons involved?
    5) If it is not "in progress", How long ago did this happen?
    Then if time allows we would follow up and fill in any blanks we felt we had.

  5. #20
    Senior Member Array Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    That all depends on the 9-1-1 center. If it is a center with a computer aided dispatch system, you need to enter a location recognized by the computer system and a call type at minimum. Some systems allow "common place names" to be put in the geobase, some require a street address or an intersection. The common place names, like "McDonalds" would then bring up a list of all of the McDonalds in that jurisdiction and the the dispatcher has to pick from the list. If it is a non C.A.D. center it depends on how familiar the call takers are with the area. If they know where the big rock is on the road that goes from "A" to "B" that could be enough.

    What I told my rookies to ask was:
    1) What is happening? (needed to know if it was for us or fire/rescue)
    2) Where is it happening?
    3) Who is involved? ( name, description of people/ vehicles etc.)
    4) Weapons involved?
    5) If it is not "in progress", How long ago did this happen?
    Then if time allows we would follow up and fill in any blanks we felt we had.


    If you say "There is an intruder at my house, I have a gun and will use it."

    They will come like the cavalry at high speeds after the next question:

    "Whats your location?"

    Trust me.
    Primary Carry Gun: Sig Sauer 229~R (.40cal w/ Golden Saber JHP's)

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky View Post
    Most likely , if they are trying stuff like this on an unknown, they have a record. also, if they force you off the road, impact marks on vehicles , skid marks ect might help to alibi your story. also your standing as a law abiding citizen , co worker testimony , ect should work in your favor.
    That's the first thing I thought of -- they probably have a record of some sort and are known to the police in some way. Gonna make them look hard to believe against you. And yeah, hopefully there would be some physical evidence of their attack.

    And if you ended up killing both of them? Wouldn't it be your word against their Non-words, and up to the authorities to prove you didn't act in self defense as you say you did?

    Surely plenty of people defend themselves where there is no camera or witness to attest to their story, and they don't end up in jail. Don't worry so much.

  7. #22
    Senior Member Array Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    Don't worry so much.
    LOL Not worried brother, just I think this is a good discussion for this forum.
    Primary Carry Gun: Sig Sauer 229~R (.40cal w/ Golden Saber JHP's)

  8. #23
    Member Array broknindarkagain's Avatar
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    A small car can maneuver a whole lot better then an F-350 can. You can also accelerate a whole lot faster then a truck (or at least most cars can) unless you're driving a Geo Metro.

    I would not have my gun in hand while driving trying to escape from harm. Both your hands should be free to use your e-brake and steering wheel. Cars can do amazing things...the way your can can handle will amaze you if you pushed its limits....but I don't recommend it unless a professional is teaching you.

    I'm confident that I can get away from any truck that decided to try and force me off the road or chase me. This would be the best option IMO, along with having 911 on speakerphone while you are getting away.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

    Smith & Wesson M&P9c

  9. #24
    Member Array tvsjr's Avatar
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    Brokin - don't be so sure on that acceleration issue. My heavily-loaded diesel 4x4 crew cab F350 can stay with a whole lot of vehicles out there... it's surprisingly quick, even though it tips the scales at 12K lbs.

    Unless forced into a shootout (multiple vehicles or one vehicle plus fixed object for a roadblock), flight is the best option. And, at that point, all rules are off... speed limits, one-way signs, do not enters, etc. can all be safely ignored if you do it safely (the last thing you want to do is wreck out, injure an innocent, and have the BGs on top of you as well).

  10. #25
    Member Array broknindarkagain's Avatar
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    F350s do pick up and go, I'll give them that....but there is no way someone can maneuver a 350 like they can a car. I'm also sure that my Subaru is a bit quicker then a 350...I shouldn't have spoke for all cars on the road, as I'm sure a 350 is quicker then some...but my personal vehicle will have no problem getting away from a 350
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

    Smith & Wesson M&P9c

  11. #26
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    If forced into a situation with 'mobile BG's', I would use my car as a 3500# bullet if forced to do so...this is what I told my wife to do...drive over the BG(s) if you have to...we'll get the bumbers fixed some other time.

    Stay armed...keep it in drive...stay safe!

    ret
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  12. #27
    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig229 View Post
    If you say "There is an intruder at my house, I have a gun and will use it."

    They will come like the cavalry at high speeds after the next question:

    "Whats your location?"

    Trust me.
    Actually a statement like that could be all the prosecutors need to put you away for a long time. All 9-1-1 calls are recorded and are admissible in court. A prosecutor could use a statement like that to show premeditation in your murder trial. A burglary in progress call gets a lights and siren response. A trespasser in progress does not. Either one could be covered by that statement. A better statement if someone is breaking in would be "Someone is breaking into my house, I am armed and prepared to defend myself if necessary."

  13. #28
    Senior Member Array Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    Actually a statement like that could be all the prosecutors need to put you away for a long time. All 9-1-1 calls are recorded and are admissible in court. A prosecutor could use a statement like that to show premeditation in your murder trial. A burglary in progress call gets a lights and siren response. A trespasser in progress does not. Either one could be covered by that statement. A better statement if someone is breaking in would be "Someone is breaking into my house, I am armed and prepared to defend myself if necessary."
    I thought the word Intruder would be clear as to someone is breaking IN the home.
    Primary Carry Gun: Sig Sauer 229~R (.40cal w/ Golden Saber JHP's)

  14. #29
    Member Array denverd0n's Avatar
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    I can't think of any good reason to tell the 911 dispatcher that you have a gun, unless you have already been forced to use it and are calling after the fact.

  15. #30
    Senior Member Array Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
    I can't think of any good reason to tell the 911 dispatcher that you have a gun, unless you have already been forced to use it and are calling after the fact.
    If a swarm of cops coming to your house with guns drawn, wouldnt you want them to know who's the good guy? And that your armed so they dont mow ya down?

    I know Denver isn't like where I grew up, but the Police had zero problem shooting first and asking questions later. I almost cant blame them considering how many LEO's got shot per year.
    Primary Carry Gun: Sig Sauer 229~R (.40cal w/ Golden Saber JHP's)

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