A Cell Phone, Bang, Bang You are DEAD! - Page 2

A Cell Phone, Bang, Bang You are DEAD!

This is a discussion on A Cell Phone, Bang, Bang You are DEAD! within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; A retired US Marine once told me, "Never sit in a stationary vehicle, the opposition may have RPG's." as well as, "doors are bullet funnels, ...

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  1. #16
    Senior Member Array wdbailey's Avatar
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    A retired US Marine once told me, "Never sit in a stationary vehicle, the opposition may have RPG's." as well as, "doors are bullet funnels, never stand in the door". Quite literally words to live by
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  2. #17
    Member Array alabamaguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toolmanbutch View Post
    I have always told family members to be aware of their surroundings. Such as sit facing a door, know where the exits are, lock your doors, back into a parking area, scan an area ect.
    Well one time I backed into a parking area to let my daughter go into a store. I had my windows down, and I was looking at my messages on my cell phone. My daughter came out and reached into the window with her Finger pointed at me like it was a gun and said Bang, Bang you are dead! This caught me totally by surprise, I was upset with myself for not being aware of my surrounding. This taught me a lesson that I will never forget. Now I look around and see that so many people are so caught up into their phones that they are easy targets. SHAME ON ME and them. I am somewhat embarrassed by this, but a new learning experience.
    Toolman-Butch

    >>> sitting in a car is an inevitability from time to time in most of America and any industrialized nation. Whether it is because you are waiting for someone to make a store run, or you are simply staying warm/cool while waiting for time to pass, it's going to happen. And as one poster said, I don't want to feel like I am in a war zone when I am not.

    That being said, keeping a 180 degree view and glancing behind occasionally may not be the end all of lookout methods but statistically I would argue it has the potential to identify a wide swatch of red flags. Not all certainly but a lot more than with eyes closed or diverted.

    But the 2nd action to take, and one that I do as a matter of habit, is I have my weapon in the door well of my car, within easy reach. While this won't be a defense for an assassin bent on taking me out, it provides instant access with actually very little opportunity for someone outside my window to see what I have in my hand. Of course this method is not good to use if you have kids. In that case having the weapon within easy reach such as a shoulder strap would be pretty good, 'tho not as good as the door well.

    To me, and I am speaking about no one else but me, the art of self-defense is making sure you have good options to deal with the majority of circumstances you are likely to come across.

    Just my 2 cents!
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toolmanbutch View Post
    I have always told family members to be aware of their surroundings. Such as sit facing a door, know where the exits are, lock your doors, back into a parking area, scan an area ect.
    Well one time I backed into a parking area to let my daughter go into a store. I had my windows down, and I was looking at my messages on my cell phone. My daughter came out and reached into the window with her Finger pointed at me like it was a gun and said Bang, Bang you are dead! This caught me totally by surprise, I was upset with myself for not being aware of my surrounding. This taught me a lesson that I will never forget. Now I look around and see that so many people are so caught up into their phones that they are easy targets. SHAME ON ME and them. I am somewhat embarrassed by this, but a new learning experience.
    Toolman-Butch
    As others have said, ambushes can happen at any time. The lesson I see your experience is to not sit in a parked car with the window down. The driver's seat is a funnel of death.
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  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by wdbailey View Post
    A retired US Marine once told me, "Never sit in a stationary vehicle, the opposition may have RPG's." as well as, "doors are bullet funnels, never stand in the door". Quite literally words to live by
    I posted my response before I read yours.

    Even if the opposition has a cheap revolver in hand as he approaches the vehicle and the victim sees him, then what?
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  6. #20
    VIP Member Array jmf552's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I posted my response before I read yours.

    Even if the opposition has a cheap revolver in hand as he approaches the vehicle and the victim sees him, then what?
    In my case, I have a snubby in my center console. I am going to lean forward with one hand up, appearing to surrender and covering the draw. Then the BG is getting shot through the window. At least that's the plan! Of course it depends on the exact situation. Every hypothetical has its limits and you can "what if" all day.

    I think one thing everyone can do that applies to any situation is revisit, really understand and contemplate Cooper's color code system. He does a great talk on it on YouTube. I agree with him that the #1 reason people with weapons and skills get defeated by BGs is that they are mentally in Condition White, meaning they are relaxed and unaware of what is going on around them, not ready to take action." People get killed going through the mental process of accepting "This can't be really happening >>> Oh, this is really happening >>> Oh, I need to do something" >>> (too late).

    You can't live your life like a Spec Ops guy in an ISIS village, but that is Conditions Orange or Red. I think Condition Yellow is the sweet spot 99% of the time for people really concerned about SD. Condition Yellow is you still remain relaxed, but you are aware of who and what is around you, and as Cooper explains in his video, you are not paranoid or fearful, but you have accepted that the worst could happen at any time. This allows you to skip the "This can't be really happening >>> Oh, this is really happening" steps and move to the "I need to do something" step instantly.

    I can relate. As a Naval Aviator we had to have emergency procedures in verbal and muscle memory. We had checklists, but there are a lot of inflight emergencies where there would not be time to read them. So you might be in a preflight brief and the flight lead might point at you and say, "Right engine fire." You would not only recite what you were going to do, you would make the hand motions as you said them and it was all expected to be fast and crisp. There was no delay like, "The engine can't really be on fire, that never happens>>> Oh, it is on fire >>> I need to do something >>> What am I supposed to do?"
    Attack Squadron 65 "Tigers", USS Eisenhower '80 - '83, peackeeping w/Iran, Libya, Lebanon and E. Europe

  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmf552 View Post
    In my case, I have a snubby in my center console. I am going to lean forward with one hand up, appearing to surrender and covering the draw. Then the BG is getting shot through the window. At least that's the plan! Of course it depends on the exact situation. Every hypothetical has its limits and you can "what if" all day.

    I think one thing everyone can do that applies to any situation is revisit, really understand and contemplate Cooper's color code system. He does a great talk on it on YouTube. I agree with him that the the #1 reason people with weapons and skills get defeated by BGs is that they are mentally in Condition White, meaning they are relaxed and unaware of what is going on around them, not ready to take action." People get killed going through the mental process of accepting "This can't be really happening >>> Oh, this is really happening >>> Oh, I need to do something" >>> (too late).

    You can't live your life like a Spec Ops guy in an ISIS village, but that is Conditions Orange or Red. I think Condition Yellow is the sweet spot 99% of the time for people really concerned about SD. Condition Yellow is you still remain relaxed, but you are aware of who and what is around you, and as Cooper explains in his video, you are not paranoid or fearful, but you have accepted that the worst could happen at any time. This allows you to skip the "This can't be really happening >>> Oh, this is really happening" steps and move to the "I need to do something" step instantly.

    I can relate. As a Naval Aviator we had to have emergency procedures in verbal and muscle memory. We had checklists, but there are a lot of inflight emergencies where there would not time to read them. So you might be in a preflight brief and the flight lead might point at you and say, "Right engine fire." You would not only recite what you were going to do, you would make the hand motions as you said them and it was all expected to be fast and crisp. There was no delay like, "The engine can't really be on fire, that never happens>>> Oh, it is on fire >>> I need to do something >>> What am I supposed to do?"
    The aviator analogy is a good one in describing the time-lines involved when going from condition white or yellow to show-time in an ambush. The suspension of disbelief must be immediate.
    “I can explain it to you, but I can't comprehend it for you.”

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  8. #22
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    I support whole heartedly the idea of paying attention to what goes on around you. There is a fine line between paying attention and being hyper alert. Some would ask.,"is too much alertness a bad thing".. I would say yes. If you begin to search for the boogieman behind every blade of grass, you will likely never see him when he walks right up to you. Information overload equals wasted time, wasted mental process and unnecessary distraction. In most public spaces, if you as joe public citizen are observing alone while you go about your daily affairs, you are not likely to have a keen grasp of what is going on outside of 180degrees (intermittent 360) 90 feet at eye level. Your sense of awareness can be pretty good but its not going to be perfect or substantial. The sooner people are willing to accept that they are not going to know everything, the sooner that most of them can begin to focus on what is primarily important. Speaking for myself, I am open and attuned to what I consider "danger ripples" in the water... not every ripple, not every potential cause of a ripple or every potential ripple that may occur at any moment. Every environmental venue has its own set of nuances and a person can adjust their danger filter accordingly. I have done a lot of different things in my life but as joe citizen I have never once worried about where to sit in a diner or movie theater. Everyone knows that one guy who always makes a spectacle of himself when he cant sit in the most tactical position in the place. I wont be that guy and I wont hang with that guy, I just sit where I feel will be most enjoyable for whatever activity I am participating in. If its dinner, I sit away from the kitchen and away from the bathroom... that's it. While at dinner, I am not concerned with tactics, I am only concerned with noise and foot traffic. I guess my point is that a person can take steps to be reasonable aware without turning their life into a spec op mission. Pay attention, keep your head out of cyberspace when in public and enjoy life... that's my motto.
    Think like a man of action - Act like a man of thought

  9. #23
    VIP Member Array Fizban's Avatar
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    That being said, keeping a 180 degree view and glancing behind occasionally may not be the end all of lookout methods but statistically I would argue it has the potential to identify a wide swatch of red flags. Not all certainly but a lot more than with eyes closed or diverted.
    exactly.. and a person who has accepted this is likely to be a much better observer than those who are trying to make single man(solo) observations into something that its not. Situational awareness is something to endeavor towards but its also something rarely achieved alone.
    Think like a man of action - Act like a man of thought

  10. #24
    Senior Member Array graydude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I posted my response before I read yours.

    Even if the opposition has a cheap revolver in hand as he approaches the vehicle and the victim sees him, then what?
    Mike1956, before I toss out a response it's clear you already know the answer to this and were just helping the discussion along, so here goes.

    My plan for these types of things is to turn the tables and use typical mugger strategies against them, such as calling out "hey, what time is it?" Action beats inaction, always seek the initiative and take it away from the bad guy. Then in whatever opportunity comes from momentary confusion I can take more action (floor it, draw, etc).

    Very seldom will I sit in a vehicle without the engine running, even if that's not eco-friendly.


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    Quote Originally Posted by graydude View Post
    Mike1956, before I toss out a response it's clear you already know the answer to this and were just helping the discussion along, so here goes.

    My plan for these types of things is to turn the tables and use typical mugger strategies against them, such as calling out "hey, what time is it?" Action beats inaction, always seek the initiative and take it away from the bad guy. Then in whatever opportunity comes from momentary confusion I can take more action (floor it, draw, etc).

    Very seldom will I sit in a vehicle without the engine running, even if that's not eco-friendly.


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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post
    ...Unless you want to drive around in an armored car.
    As a matter-of-fact 10th, I DO want to drive around in an armored car. Maybe something like The Green Hornet's "Black Beauty"? (Black Cars MATTER! Black Cars MATTER!...) Only problem is that my MPG goes to crap.

    Honestly, when I watch folks so totally preoccupied by their cell phones as to trip/slip/flip/fall into public fountains, lamp poles & open manholes, I can only repeat a single mantra to myself...DON'T BE THAT GUY!
    There are only TWO kinds of people in this world; those who describe the world as filled with two kinds of people...and those who don't.

  13. #27
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Bob View Post
    If your head is in your rear end you are a victim.

    If someone wants you dead, you are in trouble.
    Truth...

    Anyone can be ambushed....
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

    And Shepards we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee,
    Power hath descended forth from Thy hand, So that our feet may swiftly carry out thy command,
    And we shall flow a river forth to Thee, And teeming with souls shall it ever be,

  14. #28
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    In retro behavior, I tend to notice people who are not buried in their cell phone. Fewer of them and they are the red flags to me. They stand out. Unless they are driving while on their phones, talking or texting, both are accidents waiting to happen.

    One thing I cannot seem to correct is my son and one daughter who are constantly lost in the dadgum cell phone black hole. It is as if, cell phones on, defensive shields are automatically initiated. I have taken them for periods of time and a soon as I hand it back they become cell tower Godzillas. Completely oblivious.

    They understand the importance of situational awareness but it is like time stands still for them and they are invincible during every hour they waste inside their phones. I have made them wet their pants many times but to no avail. I love to be driving them and they are hunched over in deep cellphone 6 and I swerve slamming on the brakes as I scream..... This stops them every time for a few road trips but that's it.

    My other four are good as gold with theirs. Any advice?
    "I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them." John Wayne
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  15. #29
    Member Array Toolmanbutch's Avatar
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    That is a Dilemma. Maybe constantly remind them that in your presence that this is very rude to do this. Harp on them constantly and maybe they will stop. Or beat the crap out of them!
    Quote Originally Posted by rcsoftexas View Post
    In retro behavior, I tend to notice people who are not buried in their cell phone. Fewer of them and they are the red flags to me. They stand out. Unless they are driving while on their phones, talking or texting, both are accidents waiting to happen.

    One thing I cannot seem to correct is my son and one daughter who are constantly lost in the dadgum cell phone black hole. It is as if, cell phones on, defensive shields are automatically initiated. I have taken them for periods of time and a soon as I hand it back they become cell tower Godzillas. Completely oblivious.

    They understand the importance of situational awareness but it is like time stands still for them and they are invincible during every hour they waste inside their phones. I have made them wet their pants many times but to no avail. I love to be driving them and they are hunched over in deep cellphone 6 and I swerve slamming on the brakes as I scream..... This stops them every time for a few road trips but that's it.

    My other four are good as gold with theirs. Any advice?
    rcsoftexas likes this.
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  16. #30
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    i guess i am lucky, as most of the places i go, have very little to no cell coverage.
    and very hard to hear it ring while riding on my motorcycle. no way could i here it. but i do leave it on if for nothing more than a so-so way to kinda track me in case i do not get home. (pinging cell towers).

    but we all have been there done that, cell phones take so much brain power the world just disappears.

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