What would you have done
This is a discussion on What would you have done within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Just as a note, unless you all are driving trucks, and I mean a truck with some clearance, you probably don't want to hit it ...
November 5th, 2007 01:39 PM
Just as a note, unless you all are driving trucks, and I mean a truck with some clearance, you probably don't want to hit it with your vehicle. I have done some defensive protection training with the military, and we were taught and shown what happens when a car tackles a motorbike. You tear stuff up and run the real risk of becomming tangled so badly that you can no longer maneuver the vehicle.
Our training was my tactic: maintain maneuvability, call for support, and keep moving. If that includes hitting one then I will do so and hope I can do it in a way to keep it from hitting the undercarrage / tires. You also need to consider using the back of the car - you have alot more there you can afford to loose and keep it moving when you are done.
In any situation like this we would all have to really do what looks right at the time. Brick through the back window? Well I dunno if that elevates it or not... If there are multiple riders then it may, if I see another brick it may, if they are shouting threats it may. There are alot of things that can elevate it - but I have to say that is going to really put things in that light really fast. My Dad talks about bikers using chains and such around KC in the 70s and how bad it was. I have no intention of having me and mine be at their will.
As another aside... Most police helecopters can be outran by the hotter street bikes. Those things are bloody fast.
Good luck to the police hunting them.
November 5th, 2007 08:39 PM
When I first read this after my brother sent it to me I thought since this happened in October it was probably some of the participants in the Great River Road Ride who'd had one too many brews. Now that I see it also happened back in August I've changed my opinion. It looks as though it might be a group, or gang, of bikers who are trying to stir up some s*&t.
One suggestion I'd have to maybe stop this before it does get out of hand and there is an almost war going on would be to notify all the bike shops in the St Louis area as to what has happened. Doing this would get the word out into the biker community that the only result of this will be some deaths, on both sides. Maybe I'm wrong but I think the best people to put a stop to this before it gets out of hand are the bikers themselves. There are a number of active clubs in the St Louis area and doubt if they want to have a few outlaws causing trouble.
It is also possible these are bikers from outside the area who decided to have a little "fun" while passing through. Even if that is the case I would suspect someone would have a pretty good idea about where they might have come from.
For those of you who think you are all powerful because you drive a truck or SUV, unless you are driving a military Humvee I say you'd better think again. Against 50 bikes, especially if they are looking for trouble, you won't stand much of a chance, even a small bike is much more manueverable than any four-wheel vehicle on the road. Also if they are looking for trouble I'd be willing to bet a good number of those bikes are going to have passengers, each of who, more than likely, will be armed. Those arms are much more likely to be Uzis or other small full-auto weapons than semi-auto, just ask the LEOs of CA, AZ and NV who have had outlaw problems what kind of weaponry they carry.
That brick thru the window or kick in the side might just be a test to see how far people can be pushed before a weapon does appear which might be just what they wanted in the first place. So unless you have several people in your vehicle who are carrying it would probably be a good idea to maintain your cool unless someone is injured but make sure you get some tag numbers.
November 5th, 2007 08:55 PM
Brick through the window would make me lose control. I wouldn't attempt to hit anyone, but if they get pinned between my sub and the center wall...too bad.
1 biker, 50 bikers....doesn't mater. There's a threat from a mob..handle accordingly.
"If I was an extremist, our founding fathers would all be extremists," he said. "Without them, we wouldn't have our independence. We'd be a disarmed British system of feudal subjectivity."
November 11th, 2007 05:06 PM
Absolutely crazy, but it appears the world is headed that way.
Les Baer 45
N.R.A. Patron Life Member
November 11th, 2007 10:30 PM
Do you really need to see another brick before you are convinced?
In any situation like this we would all have to really do what looks right at the time. Brick through the back window? Well I dunno if that elevates it or not... If there are multiple riders then it may, if I see another brick it may, if they are shouting threats it may.
If a brick comes through my rear window...message received loud and clear. A brick is a deadly weapon and the survival light is (still) lit in my vehicle.
November 11th, 2007 11:58 PM
Your traveling 70 mph down a divided highway. You are under attack by 50 motorcyclist. I don't think your gun or your vehicle, whatever it might be, is going to get you successfully out of this.
You're going to have to do what you can to keep them off you, if they persist. You are also going to have to figure out how to make a cell phone call, keep you vehicle on the road and not let you firearm get to far away.
Dented fenders, broken mirrors and windows can be repaired/replaced. You life or that of your passengers may not be so lucky.
Tomestone courage will just get you killed.
November 12th, 2007 02:32 AM
I don't understand what's so hard about this situation. Start playing bumper cars with the bikes and they'll move out smartly if they live through it!
"I'd rather have my gun and not need it, than need it and not have it"
November 12th, 2007 02:54 AM
I think this is a time when drawing a firearm could potentially worsen a situation. How many people do you know that carry 50 rounds on them. I'm sure they would have scattered at the sound of the 1st shot, but then agian i would be sure this sort of thing (50 bikes harassing an SUV on a highway) wouldn't really happen...
"A government is like fire, a handy servant, but a dangerous master." -- George Washington
November 12th, 2007 03:51 AM
This is an interesting story...
If I were in his shoes, I would use my vehicle weight to my advantage. A crotch rocket wouldn't have much against an SUV. It would be something like swerve to the left, swerve to the right, slam on the brakes, then speed up and hit the next exit. Doing that would certainly take out a few of the bikers and possibly give the hint to the others that I wasn't going to mess around with them and maybe they would go away.
Taking shots at a moving target while you're moving that fast yourself isn't something that most people could do, so I wouldn't even bother firing at any of the bikers. I would have my pistol and hopefully a few extra mags handy though just in case I had to stop for some reason.
I would also definatly call 911, but I would have my phone on speaker so I could have both hands free to drive.
As far as getting plate numbers off some bikes, I wouldn't even bother. Plates on bikes are small and hard to see from more then 15 or 20 feet away. You need your eyes on the threat, not the threats license plate. When they start to retreat, then you get the plate numbers if you can.
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
Smith & Wesson M&P9c
November 12th, 2007 10:15 AM
I know there is no way my Suburban can out run a bike. I ride a 1996 Goldwing (Barcalounger on wheels/slow bike) and it will run circles around my truck. I think I would probably lay on the horn, floor it then test the ABS, then slowly and carefully take the next exit.
Infowars- Proving David Hannum right on a daily basis
November 12th, 2007 11:10 AM
Okay, I admit, I had some fun with the "run 'em over" thing too, but in reality, all our experience driving has taught us NOT to run over people and objects.
I think my tendency would be to try to escape the group, call 911 on the cellular, arm myself, but if a bike stopped in front of me, I'd probably stop.
If I did hit one of the bikers, they would certainly ramp up their aggression and then it would get really ugly before help arrived. I can't even guess what might happen next!
ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!
"A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
November 13th, 2007 09:34 AM
I seriously thought this story was in Maryland. There is a I-270 that goes north in Maryland into I-70 going across the north part of the state. I had no idea this was in MO
November 13th, 2007 12:45 PM
Don't forget that if you open fire on a busy interstate, you run the risk of hitting an innocent motorist as well. I'm not saying don't shot, but keep that in mind.
November 13th, 2007 09:09 PM
Anyone on a bike kicks my car, tries to run me off the road, or throws anything at my vehicle with my kids in it and I will do my best to get away from them.
Now, if there are 50 of them surrounding my vehicle and the same happens, they will be driven into and over. I will take as many out as I can and I will win. No number of bike riders will win against the smallest of cars much less an SUV or pick up like most of us drive.
These idiots think they are protected because there are several of them in a group. They simply have not met someone who is willing to sacrifice the paint of their vehicle to protect their families safety.